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View Full Version : Public school computer literacy is failing us :P



jeffc313
December 13th, 2007, 01:21 AM
today, my brother (8th grade, i'm in 11th) came home from school and asked me if he had a firewall on his computer (laptop, running gutsy). I told him yes, and showed him firestarter. I wondered why, and he told me that his computer teacher told him that you need a firewall so that hackers can't "ping" into your computer. Now, I'm no security expert, but I could not help but laughing out loud at the moron.
ps. dont ping into my box and steal my files :p

blithen
December 13th, 2007, 01:24 AM
today, my brother (8th grade, i'm in 11th) came home from school and asked me if he had a firewall on his computer (laptop, running gutsy). I told him yes, and showed him firestarter. I wondered why, and he told me that his computer teacher told him that you need a firewall so that hackers can't "ping" into your computer. Now, I'm no security expert, but I could not help but laughing out loud at the moron.
ps. dont ping into my box and steal my files :p
:lolflag:
ps: I'll try not to. :P

zekopeko
December 13th, 2007, 01:37 AM
sorry to burst your bubble but Firestarter isn't a firewall. It's a GUI for iptabels firewall.
Also you can disable pinging on the firewall so that "hackers" can't see what services you are running on your computer and what ports are open.

i think you/your brother misunderstood what the teacher meant

Darkhack
December 13th, 2007, 01:38 AM
My school is absolutely obsessed with Microsoft. If a piece of software doesn't have the word "Microsoft" in front of its name, then it's an evil spawn from hell and "nobody uses it", but if it does, then we are a step closer to world peace. The district website even has one of those "Download Internet Explorer 7" buttons on the page. The school doesn't make computer decisions based on what IT tells them. Instead the school board votes on it rather than listening to the person they hired to work with computers in the first place. Thus you have a bunch of 70 year old geezers that can't even use a mouse voting down all efforts to get OpenOffice and Firefox on school computers. They probably believe that Windows Genuine Advantage is good for them. And holy cow, you better not get them started on this creepy "free software" or "open source" voodo. After all, if we let our students use FOSS, next thing you know they'll want to marry their goat and America will turn communist!

I've tried several times to promote FOSS and while all the computer teachers and IT guys agree with me, the school turns us down. Whenever I'm dealing with these people, they remind me of Peter's father... http://www.adequacy.org/stories/2001.12.2.42056.2147.html

init1
December 13th, 2007, 01:42 AM
today, my brother (8th grade, i'm in 11th) came home from school and asked me if he had a firewall on his computer (laptop, running gutsy). I told him yes, and showed him firestarter. I wondered why, and he told me that his computer teacher told him that you need a firewall so that hackers can't "ping" into your computer. Now, I'm no security expert, but I could not help but laughing out loud at the moron.
ps. dont ping into my box and steal my files :p
:D

Velcor
December 13th, 2007, 01:44 AM
I was recently suspended from school because I wrote a program which displayed a full screen of raining numbers+letters. They called it a virus and said I was going to use it for malicious intent, where really it was a C++ exercise that I altered to give a somewhat cooler looking effect.

koleoptero
December 13th, 2007, 01:48 AM
I was recently suspended from school because I wrote a program which displayed a full screen of raining numbers+letters. They called it a virus and said I was going to use it for malicious intent, where really it was a C++ exercise that I altered to give a somewhat cooler looking effect.

I bet they saw you have a hacker-friendly subconcious. :lolflag: These people are not only ignorant, but also beyond redemption...

p_quarles
December 13th, 2007, 01:49 AM
sorry to burst your bubble but Firestarter isn't a firewall. It's a GUI for iptabels firewall.
Also you can disable pinging on the firewall so that "hackers" can't see what services you are running on your computer and what ports are open.

i think you/your brother misunderstood what the teacher meant
Right, so Firestarter creates a set of firewall rules . . . using it means you have an effective firewall, rather than simply the presence of iptables in the kernel.

And, no, disabling pings does not stop people from scanning for open ports and services. There are some reasons to disable pings, but pings are not a threat in and of themselves. I'd have to say that this teacher doesn't know what he/she is talking about.

Darkhack
December 13th, 2007, 01:52 AM
I was recently suspended from school because I wrote a program which displayed a full screen of raining numbers+letters. They called it a virus and said I was going to use it for malicious intent, where really it was a C++ exercise that I altered to give a somewhat cooler looking effect.

I've seen this kind of thinking too. Seriously, open up a DOS prompt or any kind of command line and you are instantly an "evil haxor". I always shudder when I hear "DOS is that thing hackers use to make viruses".

OlyPerson
December 13th, 2007, 01:53 AM
I was recently suspended from school because I wrote a program which displayed a full screen of raining numbers+letters. They called it a virus and said I was going to use it for malicious intent, where really it was a C++ exercise that I altered to give a somewhat cooler looking effect.

Hahaha, niceeee.

My school seems doomed with computers. Recently we got new computers that have Core 2 Duos and nice hardware, but even so they are slower than any computer I've ever used. They're running VMWare I think it's called and they are just unuseably slow. Our tech group seems to be lagging...

new2*buntu
December 13th, 2007, 01:55 AM
The computer teachers in my school are also obsessed with "Windows" and "Microsoft." Actually 2 people in my school that use Linux, with one being my sister. :)

t0p
December 13th, 2007, 02:11 AM
I've seen this kind of thinking too. Seriously, open up a DOS prompt or any kind of command line and you are instantly an "evil haxor". I always shudder when I hear "DOS is that thing hackers use to make viruses".

I remember a while ago, I was in my local library using one of their computers, and I wanted to use telnet to access my shell account. So I opened the CLI, and the librarian was straight over, accusing me of being about to do some wicked hacker-cracker stuff and threatening to ban me from library computers for the rest of my life!

Even after I explained what I had intended to do, the librarian was sullen and suspicious. I don't think she even knew what "telnet into a shell account" meant!

~LoKe
December 13th, 2007, 02:15 AM
Pinging a system is a good way to find out if there's a live connection...

science4sail
December 13th, 2007, 02:15 AM
Of course.
Must be the fact that CLIs in general are seen by [you know who] as hacker-only tools.

-grubby
December 13th, 2007, 02:41 AM
The computer teachers in my school are also obsessed with "Windows" and "Microsoft." Actually, other than me, there are only 2 other people in my school that use Linux, with one being my sister. :)

out of all the people in my school, only 2 I know of use it, me and my sister :P

DoctorMO
December 13th, 2007, 03:07 AM
The correct answer is that you can use a firewall to stop pings, just not iptables; don't forget a lot of firewall software does multiple things; blocking certain kinds of tcp/ip requests can be one of them.

Tundro Walker
December 13th, 2007, 07:58 AM
ps. dont ping into my box and steal my files :p

I'm past ur firewall...

SomeGuyDude
December 13th, 2007, 08:05 AM
today, my brother (8th grade, i'm in 11th) came home from school and asked me if he had a firewall on his computer (laptop, running gutsy). I told him yes, and showed him firestarter. I wondered why, and he told me that his computer teacher told him that you need a firewall so that hackers can't "ping" into your computer. Now, I'm no security expert, but I could not help but laughing out loud at the moron.
ps. dont ping into my box and steal my files :p

Yikes.

Of course, when I was in school, our "computer class" consisted of running MS Frontpage and designing really rudimentary websites. There was one programming class with 10 of us in it, and basically we sat around bullshitting and occasionally made something in C++.

I remember getting in trouble because I was installing Netscape on one of the machines (yes, this was a while ago) and the teacher nearly sent me to the office.

Polygon
December 13th, 2007, 08:09 AM
my school district is mac exclusive. I guess its kinda smart cuase they locked everything in the prefs pane, locked like every single program except for like word, firefox, safari, keynote, etc etc and even if you get a mac virus on teh computer, you wont have permission to run it ;)

SomeGuyDude
December 13th, 2007, 08:15 AM
my school district is mac exclusive. I guess its kinda smart cuase they locked everything in the prefs pane, locked like every single program except for like word, firefox, safari, keynote, etc etc and even if you get a mac virus on teh computer, you wont have permission to run it ;)

Most schools use DeepFreeze on their machines. Since the issue is keeping them safe from idiots, that's plenty. Anyone smart enough to break 'em with that on there likely isn't going to be enough of a jackass to actually do it.

sloggerkhan
December 13th, 2007, 08:21 AM
So we've entered an era where knowing or finding out anything about computers, networks, or the internet at large, is a danger to the ignorant people who use them without having the least clue. Remember: Learning is evil. If you know anything, you might possibly put it to criminal use, so it's better for all if we remain stupid. That's America for ya. And it begins in the classroom. (And this perspective applies to pretty much everything, not just computers.)

Lostincyberspace
December 13th, 2007, 08:40 AM
School teachers have no technology experience even the technology ones. My school shot down a teacher trying to teach php because it wasn't in the curriculum even though it had all been finished.

wana10
December 13th, 2007, 09:25 AM
i had a class in high school and the teacher had booked the computer lab for a week. i finished early and had to come up with some way to amuse myself, and this back when i was first starting to mess around with linux, so i brought my knoppix cd to school. i booted into knoppix and was having a jolly old time when all of a sudden the it guy for the school was behind me, breathing heavily, asking me what the hell i thought i was doing. i said i was teaching myself the bash shell commands and he flipped out, started ranting and raving about destroying school property, etc etc. so in an attempt to calm him down i rebooted and removed the knoppix cd. sure enough it boot right back into windows but then i had to sit there while he checked everything on the computer and ran scan after scan to make sure i hadn't messed everything up...i brought a book to class the next day.

EdThaSlayer
December 13th, 2007, 09:43 AM
My school is very computer literate...when it comes to Windows.

Spike-X
December 13th, 2007, 11:10 AM
I remember a while ago, I was in my local library using one of their computers, and I wanted to use telnet to access my shell account. So I opened the CLI, and the librarian was straight over, accusing me of being about to do some wicked hacker-cracker stuff and threatening to ban me from library computers for the rest of my life!

Even after I explained what I had intended to do, the librarian was sullen and suspicious. I don't think she even knew what "telnet into a shell account" meant!

Idiots will always feel threatened by people who actually know a damn thing. They're like the angry villagers with the burning torches and the pitchforks and those weird rake things climbing the mountain to attack the lair of the 'evil' scientist.

dnns123
December 13th, 2007, 11:28 AM
The computer teachers in my school are also obsessed with "Windows" and "Microsoft." Actually 2 people in my school that use Linux, with one being my sister. :)

You're lucky! I'm the only one who uses linux :P I know, i surveyed the whole school,part of a thesis,, not one said "yes" of using linux. about 4% only knew it exsisted and all of them think that it's a hacking tool. wth...

dnns123
December 13th, 2007, 11:34 AM
My school is absolutely obsessed with Microsoft. If a piece of software doesn't have the word "Microsoft" in front of its name, then it's an evil spawn from hell and "nobody uses it", but if it does, then we are a step closer to world peace. The district website even has one of those "Download Internet Explorer 7" buttons on the page. The school doesn't make computer decisions based on what IT tells them. Instead the school board votes on it rather than listening to the person they hired to work with computers in the first place. Thus you have a bunch of 70 year old geezers that can't even use a mouse voting down all efforts to get OpenOffice and Firefox on school computers. They probably believe that Windows Genuine Advantage is good for them. And holy cow, you better not get them started on this creepy "free software" or "open source" voodo. After all, if we let our students use FOSS, next thing you know they'll want to marry their goat and America will turn communist!

I've tried several times to promote FOSS and while all the computer teachers and IT guys agree with me, the school turns us down. Whenever I'm dealing with these people, they remind me of Peter's father... http://www.adequacy.org/stories/2001.12.2.42056.2147.html

Is your son obsessed with "Lunix"?

BSD, Lunix, Debian and Mandrake are all versions of an illegal hacker operation system, invented by a Soviet computer hacker named Linyos Torovoltos, before the Russians lost the Cold War. It is based on a program called "xenix", which was written by Microsoft for the US government. These programs are used by hackers to break into other people's computer systems to steal credit card numbers. They may also be used to break into people's stereos to steal their music, using the "mp3" program. Torovoltos is a notorious hacker, responsible for writing many hacker programs, such as "telnet", which is used by hackers to connect to machines on the internet without using a telephone.

Your son may try to install "lunix" on your hard drive. If he is careful, you may not notice its presence, however, lunix is a capricious beast, and if handled incorrectly, your son may damage your computer, and even break it completely by deleting Windows, at which point you will have to have your computer repaired by a professional.

If you see the word "LILO" during your windows startup (just after you turn the machine on), your son has installed lunix. In order to get rid of it, you will have to send your computer back to the manufacturer, and have them fit a new hard drive. Lunix is extremely dangerous software, and cannot be removed without destroying part of your hard disk surface.

OMG!! WTF! and LOL!!! where did he get this? uncyclopedia.com? hahahaha I thought he researched well...

Oh wait, this post was made under "computer idiocity". damn I was fooled.

Darkhack
December 13th, 2007, 03:28 PM
so i brought my knoppix cd to school. i booted into knoppix and was having a jolly old time when all of a sudden the it guy for the school was behind me, breathing heavily, asking me what the hell i thought i was doing.

Although my school district thinks Microsoft software is the equivalent to the second coming, individual teachers and our IT people are really awesome. I remember brining a LiveCD to school and was showing it to a friend before class started. My computer teacher even let us open up hardware and install different operating systems and all sorts of fun stuff. The IT people were very cool too. They often gave students the admin password in case we were blocked out from doing legitimate school work by the filters and such. Of course they only gave it to a select few and those who obviously knew something about computers. They're really fun people to talk to.

stoodleysnow
December 13th, 2007, 03:46 PM
Sigh. If only my college had a clue.
According to the IT Technicians here at Calderdale College, Mozilla Firefox is a virus, Linux is used to spread it and Microsoft is God.
Seriously, they said as much in a reply to a complaint I recently made to them :(:(:(

MerlinX420
December 13th, 2007, 04:04 PM
COLLEGE!!?!?! I expect suchattituides from high scholl level idiots!! BIUT WTF!!?!
Back when I went to High School I had the "reputation" as a hacker.
I sat outside by the phone and Redboxed calls for people so I could get their quarters instead of ma bell. The CIS teachers were hesitaint to even let me into class but when I started teaching the class things that they had no clue about they let it go. I got kicked out thou once they learned I knew how to bypass the security software on the macs. I told a couple people. They told some more, etc., etc. They basicly pulled me into the office and threatened to press charges and such but I told them they had no proof that I EVER did anything wrong on the school computers. They kept me in that office for hours grilling me one after another. I was "too" smart for high school. I made a deal that I'd quite and never come back. I still remember that they thought someone taught me how to do these things. nope. I learned all by myself. I basicly told them to take those degree's on the wall and burn them becuse they didnt know more then a poor white kid from the ghetto.I'm still mad about it after all these years! these posts brought back memories.

bobbocanfly
December 13th, 2007, 08:51 PM
I thought my school was bad before I read these! My school is completely based on Mac except 1 or 2 of the departments which use Windows software. Its all locked down well enough, though the admin file shares are mountable by anyone.

I have basically finished the course about a year early (HTML = teh hard) so just sit about breaking old machines with my teacher. He still wont let me bring in my LiveCDs though. For some reason Microsoft Windows has to be run on all old hardware for security reasons. :S

happysmileman
December 13th, 2007, 10:01 PM
My school are complete idiots about computers... But at least the teacher of my LCVP class thought it was cool that I used to be able to get past the site filters, just saying "don't look at anything bad or I could be in trouble"...

Two people in my school use Linux that I know of, me and my ex-girlfriend, and guess who recommended it to her (a couple of my brother's friends used to, but they left for college)

I haven't come across a single person that knows what Linux is without me telling them (a friend of mine maybe, he's very interested in gaming, I can't remember whether I told him about it or he knew)

Darkhack
December 13th, 2007, 11:55 PM
The CIS teachers were hesitaint to even let me into class ... I got kicked out thou once they learned I knew how to bypass the security software on the macs. I told a couple people. They told some more, etc., etc.

That's why they were hesitant.


I was "too" smart for high school. I made a deal that I'd quite and never come back. I still remember that they thought someone taught me how to do these things. nope. I learned all by myself. I basicly told them to take those degree's on the wall and burn them becuse they didnt know more then a poor white kid from the ghetto.

What do you mean by too smart? High school (at least in the US) is more about trying out different things and seeing what you like so you can make a decision for college about what career path you want to take. I quit HS and I really wish I hadn't. I have a lot of emotional and mental health issues which makes it harder to fit into a HS environment, where as in college, it's been a lot easier for me. As for the teachers, it vastly depends upon what school you go to. You said you were from the ghetto, so did you go to a school in such an area? Such schools often times have trouble finding qualified teachers and they'll take what they can get.

Nekiruhs
December 14th, 2007, 12:14 AM
I think I nearly gave my tech department a heart attack in my 2 years so far in HS. Lets see:

I use Ceedo (http://www.ceedo.com) to carry all my apps on a flash drive. They flipped out when I started compiling C++ code in Dev-C++. All I was really doing was making a simple C++ program to calculate musical intervals given an input file.

I almost got 10 days detention for using the DOS shell, after It was blocked. I coded a quick Python program to take input and pass it to os.system() (Executes the DOS command), I ran ping on the network and they lost their heads. It ran in a portable install of the Python interpreter.

As far as the students I'm now regarded as "that hacker kid". Lol. And I'm expected to give free tech support, to students and the IT department. :lolflag:

sloggerkhan
December 14th, 2007, 12:18 AM
I went through high school. Now I kinda wish I'd just started community college as a ninth grader. High school is a near complete waste of time unless you want to only take stuff like metalshop and photography. The rest of it just makes you lose faith in society. I did enjoy the elective classes I took, though.