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aysiu
December 7th, 2007, 05:51 PM
I've read a lot of strong opinions in favor of Apple porting iTunes to Linux and in opposition to Apple porting iTunes to Linux.

If you were Apple, do you think it would make sense to release iTunes for Linux? Why or why not?

Please post a response and answer the poll.

For further reading, check out these threads:
Why Apple doesn't want to release iTunes for Linux (http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=220167)
Petition - iTunes for Ubuntu (http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=432151)

boast
December 7th, 2007, 05:53 PM
I don't even like itunes on my macbook. But if others want it, sure, I support bringing itunes to linux

popch
December 7th, 2007, 05:57 PM
I voted yes but I won't use it.

Since iTunes is not only the 'device driver' but the sales outlet for canned music, Apple would demonstrate that they care not only for customers using Windows computers and - grudgingly - those using Mac OS X computers.

khurrum1990
December 7th, 2007, 05:57 PM
I think we do need iTunes on Linux. It will make managing the iPod so much easier. Other iPod managing applications currently on Linux suck!

stlcoptony
December 7th, 2007, 05:58 PM
I see that a lot of people think we shouldn't encourage people to get ipods, I was just wondering why? All the common arguments aside, I've gone through many mp3 players and finally decided to get an ipod. I must say I do like it very much. I don't what it is exactly about it, but it just seems to work really well, it's smaller than anything else I've seen with 80-160gb of storage (except the zune, but I refuse to go there). I thought I would hate the ipod and itunes, but there management of podcasts alone were worth it for me

thanks

Vadi
December 7th, 2007, 06:01 PM
I don't have an ipod, and given it's limited capabilities, I won't be getting one. Getting a different player instead (anythingbutipod.com is an excellent choice).

However, the people who already have an ipod are having a hard time on linux as I understand - so this'll definitely help them.

Edit: btw, you can get rockbox (click (http://www.rockbox.org/)) or linux (click (ipodlinux.com)) on an ipod.

aysiu
December 7th, 2007, 06:07 PM
I voted that I'm not sure how I feel about it.

I guess I can understand arguments from all sides.

From the business perspective, I think Apple would gain a lot of goodwill from the Linux community if it ported iTunes, but I don't think it would see any immediate increase in iPod sales.

From the Linux community perspective, it could be both harmful and beneficial. You could argue that anything that eases Windows users' transitions to Linux is a good thing. On the other hand, Apple is all about the vendor lock-in, and you're just moving people from being locked in to Apple at Windows to being locked in to Apple on Linux.

I moved away from iPods for a couple of reasons myself: I know some people swear by AmaroK, Banshee, or GTKpod, but I never could get my iPod working properly with those. I sometimes like to listen to the radio, and no iPods come with radios in them. I'm trying to move in the Free direction, and iPods don't support Ogg natively. I don't want to bother with Rockbox or iPodLinux. I like cheap players. Even my iAudio 7, which is more expensive than the Sandisk player I had before, is still cheaper than the iPod Nano. I used to depend on iTunes a lot, but now I'm fine with Rhythmbox, Sound Juicer, and my Cowon iAudio player.

Curtisc
December 7th, 2007, 06:07 PM
I see that a lot of people think we shouldn't encourage people to get ipods, I was just wondering why? All the common arguments aside, I've gone through many mp3 players and finally decided to get an ipod. I must say I do like it very much. I don't what it is exactly about it, but it just seems to work really well, it's smaller than anything else I've seen with 80-160gb of storage (except the zune, but I refuse to go there). I thought I would hate the ipod and itunes, but there management of podcasts alone were worth it for me

thanks

When you say "a lot of people", do you mean the one person who voted for that option? ;)

You're right though, I have seen a lot of ipod-bashing, especially from linux types. I just got one of the new nano's to replace my hard-drive only iAudio X5, and while there are things I don't like about the nano, all in all it's a pretty awesome little player. I especially like how the ipods go to sleep, whereas most other players I've seen actually power down when you turn them off. I'm sure that has its advantages, but in normal use, you're going to be charging the thing every few days or so anyway, so I doubt the power consumption really makes a difference.

I think there's just a strong pull in a lot of people to go against the mainstream. They see something like the ipod being a fashion accessory instead of a music player, and all of a sudden they don't want to get it because they don't want to be associated with "mainstream". It's exactly the opposite of the people who buy things because they are fashionable.

Luggy
December 7th, 2007, 06:10 PM
On one side giving more people and outlet to purchase music online is good.

On the other hand the DRM associated with iTunes music is bad.

But if you are just talking about the player and iPod syncronizer then I guess it wouldn't be that bad.

I wouldn't use it either way since I didn't purchase on iPod.

stlcoptony
December 7th, 2007, 06:16 PM
When you say "a lot of people", do you mean the one person who voted for that option? ;)

Yes, I did. I just looked at the bar graph and not the amount of total voters, oops. I was one of those people who did not want an ipod because everyone had one. Except for sound quality (which I think is much better on others, like the creative products) I haven't found a downside to ipods yet (well, I guess itunes not being available on linux is a problem. Does anyone know of a combination program to sync an ipod with linux and manage podcasts. how would find all the ones i already subscribe to and redownload them all?

thanks

aysiu
December 7th, 2007, 06:19 PM
You're right though, I have seen a lot of ipod-bashing, especially from linux types. I just got one of the new nano's to replace my hard-drive only iAudio X5, and while there are things I don't like about the nano, all in all it's a pretty awesome little player. I especially like how the ipods go to sleep, whereas most other players I've seen actually power down when you turn them off. I'm sure that has its advantages, but in normal use, you're going to be charging the thing every few days or so anyway, so I doubt the power consumption really makes a difference. Every few days?

My Sandisk player used to last three weeks on a single AAA battery. And I'm almost a week in on my iAudio 7 with not a single bar down (it's supposed to have a battery life of 60 hours, but I haven't had a chance to test that fully).

I have to say, though, I've grown to like the idea of a scroll wheel. When Apple first came out with that, I thought, "That's not intuitive. Why would you go in a circle to scroll through songs? Wouldn't you scroll down or up?"

Then, I realized it's not about being intuitive (even though all the reviews three or four years ago called it that)--it was about being practical. Right now, with my iAudio 7, there's a "swing touch" scroll bar, which is annoying. If you want to scroll through 300 songs, you have to swing touch back and forth about 50 times. With a scroll wheel, you can just go round and round in circles 50 times, which is a lot less work and much quicker.

gn2
December 7th, 2007, 06:23 PM
Don't have an ipod, wouldn't buy one, cheaper and better options are available.

Never used itunes.

Don't like the prices of the itunes store.

Don't like DRM.

aysiu
December 7th, 2007, 06:27 PM
Don't like the prices of the itunes store. Really? I've found them to be quite reasonable. $.99 per song? Sounds about right to me. I've paid anywhere between $7.99 and $14.99 for new albums, even back in the 1990s. I'm not sure how old you are, but when I was growing up, it was a common practice to buy an entire CD album just to get the one or two songs you liked from it. The ability to pay only a couple bucks for those two songs instead is great.


Don't like DRM. Not all the songs in the iTunes store are DRM'ed.

dhobbs
December 7th, 2007, 06:29 PM
I voted no. There are better applications for Linux and why should we want an application that supports DRM when there are others?

aysiu
December 7th, 2007, 06:31 PM
I voted no. There are better applications for Linux and why should we want an application that supports DRM when there are others?
Well, "better" is a matter of opinion. Some people think iTunes is "better."

The only thing I don't like about iTunes from an end-user perspective (not politics about freedom and DRM) is the lack of global keyboard shortcuts. Yes, I know there are helper applications (hacks) that allow you to have global keyboard shortcuts, but I still think that points to a deficiency in iTunes.

lespaul_rentals
December 7th, 2007, 06:36 PM
If they ported iTunes to Linux, and added support for Ogg Vorbis, FLAC, etc., then I would probably use it. I don't own an iPod and I actually dislike them, not only because they are quite mainstream but also because they have a 20% failure rate. That's a statistical number, but I'd say that 75% of my friends that have iPods have, at one time or another, had some major problem that cost loads of money to fix or needed to be shipped for repairs, and these are people who treat their electronics with care. I really like the iTunes player, however. Let's face it, it's simple, practical, and does what it has to do. iTunes is the Amarok of Windows.

XulluX
December 7th, 2007, 06:36 PM
I vote yes, for the simple fact of why would you not want one more option for mainstream users. I think it would add just one more selling point to the platform. In my personal opinion adding mainstream titles to the Linux platform would help growth. For example Quickbooks, and better blackberry support, this would be enough for me to never use windows again. And i know a few people how feel the same way, they love the platform but it comes down to we need "X" to get "Y" done and while there are open source options for just about every title out there all open source projects don't stand up to there proprietary counter parts.

So I yes to porting just about every thing.

aysiu
December 7th, 2007, 06:39 PM
Right now the top three choices appear to be
I don't care either way. 6 23.08%
Yes, and I would use it. 5 19.23%
No. We shouldn't encourage people to get iPods. 4 15.38%

Lostincyberspace
December 7th, 2007, 06:42 PM
I voted yes if only for the availabliity of others to use it. Which is my big thing for linux people helping other people.

daynah
December 7th, 2007, 07:16 PM
I voted no, we shouldn't encourage people to get ipods. Creative is better.

Even though I have an iphone. ~sighs~ It was a gift, okay!

justin whitaker
December 7th, 2007, 07:33 PM
I was sort of on the fence about this, but ended up between "I don't care" and "Yes, I would use it". I ended up voting for the former.

iTunes (the media player) is big, bloated, and proprietary, but is easy to use, and gets all of your media in one player. That's nice, actually.

iTunes (the store) is a great service. I don't know if anyone feels the same way that I do, but being able to legally buy tracks, tv shows, and podcasts through one interface is compelling.

Now, I can work around just about all of this in Linux, so in some sense, I'm not inconvenienced at all by not having it.

If, however, it is one more reason for the general public not to use Linux, then yes, we should fight to have it.

dimbulb1024
December 7th, 2007, 07:41 PM
First, I miss voted. I clicked option 1 instead of 2.

Now, on to the discussion. I don't think Apple ever will port to Linux. They had to port to Windows because of the desktop %. It was the only way to make money without forcing users to buy Macs. Users are not going to buy a new computer just to use the iPod. I think for Apple, they wouldn't want to port to Linux as it could take away from their market share. If you want to move away from Windows and you can get Linux for free and install iTunes, why purchase a Mac?

Maybe, maybe not, just my uniformed thinking.

boast
December 7th, 2007, 07:44 PM
Even though I have an iphone. ~sighs~ It was a gift, okay!

Not a supporter of innovators huh?

aysiu
December 7th, 2007, 07:46 PM
Now, on to the discussion. I don't think Apple ever will port to Linux. They had to port to Windows because of the desktop %. It was the only way to make money without forcing users to buy Macs. Users are not going to buy a new computer just to use the iPod. I think for Apple, they wouldn't want to port to Linux as it could take away from their market share. If you want to move away from Windows and you can get Linux for free and install iTunes, why purchase a Mac? I agree with your general reasoning, but not this last statement.

Apple will not port iTunes to Linux, because there's no financial incentive to do so, and it would legitimize Linux as another viable alternative to Windows. But there are many reasons people purchase Macs apart from iTunes. My wife, for example, likes her Mac. She likes how it looks. She likes the font rendering. She likes having native installations of Adobe CS and Flash (the maker, not the player). Having iTunes is a big plus for her, but that's not the only reason she chooses Mac over a Linux PC.

bobbocanfly
December 7th, 2007, 08:00 PM
No - We Shouldnt Encourage People to Get iPods.

They are inferior, overpriced, fully proprietary products with no benefits over other players with half the price, twice the storage and Rockboxability.

</rant>

Also iTunes is pretty awful software. It is incredibly bloated! Its worse than Songbird in terms of excess bloat. Seriously. Now you are on Linux use a proper, lightweight Linux player. Or if you are still on Windows (Or use WINE) use Foobar2000.

dimbulb1024
December 7th, 2007, 08:06 PM
I agree with your general reasoning, but not this last statement.

Apple will not port iTunes to Linux, because there's no financial incentive to do so, and it would legitimize Linux as another viable alternative to Windows. But there are many reasons people purchase Macs apart from iTunes. My wife, for example, likes her Mac. She likes how it looks. She likes the font rendering. She likes having native installations of Adobe CS and Flash (the maker, not the player). Having iTunes is a big plus for her, but that's not the only reason she chooses Mac over a Linux PC.

Your point is true. What I was trying to say,and I will use myself as an example, had I not had another computer that I could use my Nano with, I don't know if I would have tried Linux/ Ubuntu in the first place. I was interested in getting away from Windows but I don't have the $ for a Mac, or another PC for that matter. Ubuntu was a free way to leave Windows on my day to day machine.

gn2
December 7th, 2007, 08:10 PM
Really? I've found them to be quite reasonable. $.99 per song? Sounds about right to me. I've paid anywhere between $7.99 and $14.99 for new albums, even back in the 1990s. I'm not sure how old you are, but when I was growing up, it was a common practice to buy an entire CD album just to get the one or two songs you liked from it. The ability to pay only a couple bucks for those two songs instead is great.

I'm 47 and live in the UK. Tracks on the UK itunes store are 79p = $1.60 US

Where I buy my mp3's tracks cost $0.19 US

I well remember buying LP's to get one track, taping it then selling the LP.
(Same process works with CD's on ebay these days)

EmilyRose
December 7th, 2007, 08:17 PM
I like m iPod. IMO its the best option out there. Sure, I'd like to use a more open-source friendly product, but, I don't know of one that compares. What do you all recommend instead? I don't want a Zune, for the same reasons I won't use Vista. What are the other supposedly 'better' or equal options?

yatt
December 7th, 2007, 08:39 PM
I voted yes, but I don't know why anyone would want to use it.

bruce89
December 7th, 2007, 08:48 PM
I have to say that the result of this poll is not suprising given this is Ubuntu.

markp1989
December 7th, 2007, 08:50 PM
i would like them to port itunes to linux but they wont, because apples main selling point is that it isnt windows, and by creating a linux port they will be showing people that linux is also an alternative

a12ctic
December 7th, 2007, 08:54 PM
I voted "No. We shouldn't encourage people to get iPods." Mostly because Apple acts like a monopoly in the MP3 player market.

aysiu
December 7th, 2007, 08:55 PM
I have to say that the result of this poll is not suprising given this is Ubuntu.
Really? I'm surprised.

Based on discussions I've read in the past, I assumed the results would be an overwhelming majority (or largest minority) being actively against Apple porting iTunes. Right now, 52% are in favor of the port.

bruce89
December 7th, 2007, 09:07 PM
Really? I'm surprised.

Based on discussions I've read in the past, I assumed the results would be an overwhelming majority (or largest minority) being actively against Apple porting iTunes. Right now, 52% are in favor of the port.

I have my faith restored partially if you believe that.

I suppose people will vote in this poll only if they want a port, a bit like the Scottish Independence question. The number of people in favour of independence depends on the question asked. If asked for independence, people like it, but if asked for breakup, people don't like it.

Personally, I couldn't care less about this anyway.

aysiu
December 7th, 2007, 09:10 PM
I have my faith restored partially if you believe that.

I suppose people will vote in this poll only if they want a port, a bit like the Scottish Independence question. The number of people in favour of independence depends on the question asked. If asked for independence, people like it, but if asked for breakup, people don't like it.

Personally, I couldn't care less about this anyway.
I understand what you're saying, but you really think it's a semantics issue? Is there another way to phrase it apart from "Port"? Should I have said something like "Do you want Apple to infect Linux with a version of iTunes?"

Phlll
December 7th, 2007, 09:12 PM
I actually put that I don't care either way, which sounds a lot harsher than it is.

I use Mac, Win and Ubuntu everyday. But I don't use an iPod. At this point I've no plans to buy one either, my XM works fine.

It simply wouldn't matter to me, but that doesn't mean that others might not find it useful.

bruce89
December 7th, 2007, 09:13 PM
I understand what you're saying, but you really think it's a semantics issue? Is there another way to phrase it apart from "Port"? Should I have said something like "Do you want Apple to infect Linux with a version of iTunes?"

No, probably not. Maybe a "Do you not want a port" poll would be an interesting comparison.

~LoKe
December 7th, 2007, 09:27 PM
iTunes is a piece of garbage and we have plenty of more competent replacements.

No thanks.

Zipster90
December 7th, 2007, 09:34 PM
I love gtkpod, but I miss being able to buy music and move it to my iPod all in the same program. If Apple ever did port iTunes to Linux, I would certainly use it, but in the meantime gtkpod and FrostWire are great.

zenwhen
December 7th, 2007, 09:46 PM
I would love to see iTunes on Linux. I am an avid user and supporter of Apple products along with my love for open source software.

popch
December 7th, 2007, 09:52 PM
I understand what you're saying, but you really think it's a semantics issue? Is there another way to phrase it apart from "Port"? Should I have said something like "Do you want Apple to infect Linux with a version of iTunes?"

I think it's not a semantic issue but a question of motivation and bias. I would expect a smallish part only of the non-iPod-owning population to take part in that poll. Further, those already content with the solution to have would perhaps also abstain from taking part.

What's left is possibly not only would-be iPod owners and FOSS zealots. However, the set of people voting in this poll can not be presumed to be a representative sample of 'the population' at large.

Sunflower1970
December 7th, 2007, 09:54 PM
I really don't care one way or another. When I used Windows, I used iTunes to orgainze my music, and bought a whole two albums off of it...version 7.x never worked right with XP so I used 6.x instead (and could not buy albums any more). When I moved to Ubuntu, I found Amarok which I now use and can't live without it now. :D

I know if iTunes was ported to Linux, I'd look at it out of curiosity, but probably would not use it. I'll use Amazon to buy mp3's instead.

aysiu
December 7th, 2007, 09:58 PM
I think it's not a semantic issue but a question of motivation and bias. I would expect a smallish part only of the non-iPod-owning population to take part in that poll. Further, those already content with the solution to have would perhaps also abstain from taking part.

What's left is possibly not only would-be iPod owners and FOSS zealots. However, the set of people voting in this poll can not be presumed to be a representative sample of 'the population' at large.
I don't know. People are pretty quick to jump on to Community Cafe forum topics they shouldn't otherwise care about. People who have no interest in Automatix have no problems posting in Automatix-related threads. Same with the religious derivative threads.

I think your point is valid. I just don't think it would seriously skew the results. In fact, 16% of people voting that they don't care either way would support the idea that people will still vote, regardless of their iPod/non-iPod situation.

KOld Iron
December 7th, 2007, 10:09 PM
The reason I vote "yes" is that would allow me to get my wife's PC to Ubuntu. She does not care about the OS, but just wants to use her applications. I got here to use Firefox for browsing instead of IE, and she also uses OO for writing her letters. She is not a gamer except for the ocassional Mahjong. BUT, she has an iPod, and the way Apple is basically forcing a user to use iTunes for synchronizing (by making it constantly difficult for third party software doing the same job), I would like to have the possibility to use a Linux version of iTunes (to allow my wife the same user experience).

However, I may also add, that exaclty because of this enforced customer binding exerted by Apple, I myself will not consider an iPod for my own use, ever [-(. But having switched to Ubuntu successfully about six weeks ago \\:D/, I would now like to spread the system in the family. iTunes for Linux would simply help doing that.

qazwsx
December 7th, 2007, 10:14 PM
Yes, if they realease source code as well. I don't care closed apps. I just don't like closed Linux apps (for example i386 and amd64 problems ).

toupeiro
December 8th, 2007, 12:23 AM
Sorry, playing catchup between 2 threads -- dont know if this was started in response to the first one:


As you can see from the poll below, the largest minority of Ubuntu users own iPods, so Apple doesn't need to port iTunes to Ubuntu to sell its hardware. The point of iTunes isn't iTunes. The point of iTunes is the iPod. If iPods are selling and Linux users are happy with Rockbox and AmaroK, then Apple has no financial incentive to port iTunes.
What kind of portable audio player do you have?

If you were an Apple executive reading this thread, would you get the impression that porting iTunes to Linux is worth it? Either most are an extremely vocal minority of Linux users appear to not want iTunes ported.


Actually -- I know a lot of people who like to buy online music through iTunes, or who have bought a great deal of it through iTunes. Who have credit - which converts to money in accounts on iTunes, and who like iTunes as a service. Therefore, there is some significant incentive to do so.

Oh, and I have a Creative Zen Vision: M. I also wasn't outlining my personal opinion of iTunes in support of it being ported -- rather I was giving some constructive responses as to why there is financial incentive (because lets face it, they want to make money) despite my personal opinions of the software. After all, I dont have to install it. That doesn't mean that people who want to shouldn't have the option.

aysiu
December 8th, 2007, 01:06 AM
Sorry, playing catchup between 2 threads -- dont know if this was started in response to the first one:



Actually -- I know a lot of people who like to buy online music through iTunes, or who have bought a great deal of it through iTunes. Who have credit - which converts to money in accounts on iTunes, and who like iTunes as a service. Therefore, there is some significant incentive to do so.

Oh, and I have a Creative Zen Vision: M. I also wasn't outlining my personal opinion of iTunes in support of it being ported -- rather I was giving some constructive responses as to why there is financial incentive (because lets face it, they want to make money) despite my personal opinions of the software. After all, I dont have to install it. That doesn't mean that people who want to shouldn't have the option.
There is a perception in the general populace that Linux users do not want to buy music (Richard Stallman's outspokenness on the subject of "piracy" and "sharing" serves only to reinforce this notion), and I'm sure Apple execs don't see big money porting iTunes to Linux. How many Linux users want to buy off the iTunes music store? I know I might, but I think I'm in the minority here.

toupeiro
December 8th, 2007, 01:17 AM
:-) Maybe you are, and maybe you aren't. Ubuntuforums.org is a great and diverse venue, but When I say linux -- I am not just thinking ubuntu or the members of ubuntu forums. If you tally up the "linux users" of the world, all of a sudden you have some pretty nice numbers. if you do some data analysis on how many unique downloads the 3-5 most popular linux distributions get in one year and how many iPods were sold in a year, I bet you suddenly come up with enough reasons to throw all that iTunes source code they have through a compiler on Linux. Its not a wheel reinvent in any way.

not to simplify the process, but I just ported a visualization app from SGI Irix to Linux because I had the source. I am by no means a programmer. I'm not going to say it runs perfectly, but I had a working solution in less than a day. Not a lot of time to dedicate. I think its worth apples time, they just don't know it yet. :P

aysiu
December 8th, 2007, 01:24 AM
If you tally up the "linux users" of the world, all of a sudden you have some pretty nice numbers. if you do some data analysis on how many unique downloads the 3-5 most popular linux distributions get in one year and how many iPods were sold in a year, I bet you suddenly come up with enough reasons to throw all that iTunes source code they have through a compiler on Linux. But here's what I view as the problem for Apple: their perception may be (and this is mine as well) that Linux users are perfectly willing to buy iPods right now (even without iTunes ported) and not as willing to spend money on music (which would be the major benefit to them of porting iTunes).

The latter has to do with a combination of many Linux users feeling that what Apple and many corporations call "piracy" is really "sharing" (and not illegal or immoral at all) and many Linux users also being anti-Apple or anti-DRM.

In other words, if iTunes is mainly a vehicle to get Windows users to buy iPods, and if Linux users are already buying iPods and unlikely to buy songs off the iTunes music store, why port iTunes? What financial incentive does Apple have?

Mr.Auer
December 8th, 2007, 01:35 AM
I have owned one Apple player, and that will also be the last I will ever buy.
It was a 1st gen Shuffle. First hard part came after I unpacked it. It needed to be initialized with a Mac OS / Windows ONLY utility or standard ITunes. Needless to say, this would NOT work in any way under Linux, my sole OS on 3 comps at that time.

Well, I had one XP OEM cd, so I had to install XP just to initialize the thing. And of course after initializing, you cant just drag your music on the Shuffle, but you have to use something that builds the IPod database. In this case I was lucky and theres a Python script that will build the database from music files it finds on the IPod.

This alone wouldnt be enough reason to shun Apple..But in addition to this, it wont play oggs or flacs. Thats a major minus, when half of my collection is in those formats.

But the worst part is that the Ipod would occasionally stop working completely. It would unmount forcibly by itself, corrupting the files. On a computer that handles all other USB devices perfectly, all other flash disks and external drives as well. It bricked itself twice, for no good reason, demanding a reset on a MAC OS or WINDOWS again. No linux reset utility.

And the final straw that broke the camels back was the last time it stopped working - I went to a friend to reset it on his XP, with the Apple utility....Only this time, the utility crashed in the middle of resetting the Ipods firmware. Now even the battery charge indicator light is dead. Totally brick. No life. And of course, warranty had JUST ended.

To sum it up: Vendor lock-in thru Itunes and the utilities needed to make the player even start up, DRM, lack of supported formats, high price compared to other similar products, poor durability (ive read plenty similar bricking stories on the net), and you are forced to use their software in most cases (newer Ipods, have seen plenty problems that ive had to troubleshoot with linux/ipod compatibility). And of course the famous Apple class you gain when using em: "Apple - by the smug bastards, for the smug bastards." The only good things about the player were good sound quality, small size and ok looks.

Cowon will probably be my next buy - they support all formats I need, and they guarantee that their players work with Linux. So I voted "No. We shouldn't encourage people to get iPods."

Edit: Id also have to add that the Shuffle went right on to claim spot Number One on my list "Record-breakingly fast breaking consumer electronics". And Ive had plenty experience, from VIC-20s to PCs..to Minidisk players of which ive used up several. And they had MOVING PARTS, and even the cheapest lousiest machine would last over 2 years in heavy use. A few days over 1 year, not much use, a device that is flash based and has no moving parts? Unacceptable.

Edit 2: Ok, it took place 2 actually, number one would still be IBM DeathStar HD - the famous Click of Death model :) That one didnt last six months :D

Scotty Bones
December 8th, 2007, 01:50 AM
I voted No (other) for one simple reason. DRM
This is why I do not suggest to anyone they use itunes (music store of course)
If apple were to reverse this policy and drop DRM completely it would go a long way to changing my view about them.
I simply can not support any company that shows hostility to its customers.

aysiu
December 8th, 2007, 01:51 AM
I voted No (other) for one simple reason. DRM
This is why I do not suggest to anyone they use itunes (music store of course)
If apple were to reverse this policy and drop DRM completely it would go a long way to changing my view about them.
I simply can not support any company that shows hostility to its customers.
In all fairness, there are some songs they sell without DRM (the ones from EMI, I believe).

Scotty Bones
December 8th, 2007, 02:13 AM
Thats why I made the "completely drop" statement.
I do realizes that they are finally seeing the light, but that light is still too dim.
It seems more like an idea that they are playing with, rather than a full hearted attempt to right a wrong.

EDIT: It's more of an (poor) attempt at appeasement then anything else.

boast
December 8th, 2007, 02:25 AM
If apple were to reverse this policy and drop DRM completely it would go a long way to changing my view about them..

"Steve Jobs announced that he doesn't like DRM and wants to get rid of it. He urges DRM activists to lobby Europe's governments to force European record giants like Sony-BMG, EMI and Universal to license their music to the iTunes Music Store without DRM"

so do your part! :)

maharbA
December 8th, 2007, 02:35 AM
I have a mac and I use iTunes exclusively (except for occasional Pandora) for both music and podcasts. I like that when I'm on another computer on my network I can listen to my own music over the network.

No matter which app I use in Linux, I can't get this fuction to work. Rhythmbox seems to want to do it (it shows that I have music shared and makes it look like I can just click to listen) but it never works.

SomeGuyDude
December 8th, 2007, 02:42 AM
I said this before, so I'll say it again: why WOULD they?

Apple's MO is "windows vs OSX", so why do they want to encourage people to move to Linux? They're taking from their own market.

Auria
December 8th, 2007, 02:47 AM
There's no reason they would do that...

But if they would i'd use it. Only because there's currently no linux player with both the interface and the features i like/need. When it happens (and it WILL happen, i've been following development and seems like both rythmbox and exaile will get what i need relatively soon) i would see no more need for itunes

init1
December 8th, 2007, 02:48 AM
I don't have an iPod, but I don't have anything against porting it.

toupeiro
December 8th, 2007, 02:52 AM
[QUOTE=aysiu;3911480

In other words, if iTunes is mainly a vehicle to get Windows users to buy iPods, and if Linux users are already buying iPods and unlikely to buy songs off the iTunes music store, why port iTunes? What financial incentive does Apple have?[/QUOTE]

You make a very good point. And the only answer I have is that: iTunes is an extension to iPod functionality, and now iPhones functionality, as well as being a source for online legal music procurement, which cannot be completely sufficed by any single program available in the open source world. The LAST thing apple wants is an all around open source alternative to iTunes, that provides ALL of iTunes functionality to their devices, and has the ability to be ported to ANY O.S. Again, the incentive is there, its more a matter of not being a priority since it has not been acted apon. If Open Source refines their solutions to the stage that it has one app which offers all that iTunes can offer to Apple devices, shame on Apple for letting an opportunity slip through their fingers.

Again, I am not a fan of iTunes for personal reasons, but if/when someone in apple crunches the numbers, I believe that the amount of money it would cost them to port iTunes to linux would be made up in hours if not days, and continue to make them money, for a very small commitment of time relatively speaking.

SomeGuyDude
December 8th, 2007, 02:53 AM
I'd like to say I would like iTunes perhaps to be on Linux (though Exaile's all I need), my main point is that Apple has roughly zero motivation to do so. Where would their profit come from?

The Linux community is a small fraction of computer users. Shrinking it them to find out how many would buy an iPod but currently won't due to lack of iTunes on Linux and the number is smaller still. Then how many of THEM would buy many songs on iTunes?

There's very little money in a Linux port that I can see. Apple's better bet is to try and limit people to Mac/Windows and encourage people to switch to theirs.

master_kernel
December 8th, 2007, 03:32 AM
I voted yes and I would use it, even though I don't have an iPod. However, I do somewhat agree with those who voted that we shouldn't encourage iPods. Although there have been several Linux MP3 players, Apple has entirely dominated the portable media player industry. There are no Apple products in my house. It seems like they are creating a monopoly along with Google (who I have nothing against) and taking over the technological world.

My guess is that by 2010, Mac users will have caught up with Windows users because of the huge blunder Microsoft calls "Windows Vista". Although people think, "Wow, that's pretty cool! I love those features and that sidebar!" once they experience it, most hate it and either switch to Macs or go back to their old eXPerience.

Not to denegrate Linux, but it's going to be a while longer before Linux even comes close to where Macs were 2 years ago. All we can do is promote like crazy, and put out weird commercials like Apple :).

SomeGuyDude
December 8th, 2007, 03:36 AM
My guess is that by 2010, Mac users will have caught up with Windows users because of the huge blunder Microsoft calls "Windows Vista". Although people think, "Wow, that's pretty cool! I love those features and that sidebar!" once they experience it, most hate it and either switch to Macs or go back to their old eXPerience.

Not to switch topics, but Windows Millennium Edition was exponentially more disastrous than Vista, almost EVERYONE I knew who got a computer with it loaded on reverted to either 98SE or 2000 within a week of dealing with the thing.

Yet, somehow, Windows stuck around. I don't think Vista's gonna make as big a dent as the MS-bashers are hoping for.

ameba
December 8th, 2007, 03:42 AM
Yes, i think it would be good idea because it give Linux users more application choices to choose from.

I doubt the day that itunes will arrive at the linux juncture but, it would be something to be proud of because it shows how strong linux has become.

ameba
December 8th, 2007, 03:44 AM
Hey, windows 98 and millennium edition are totally insecure. Why would anyone want to revert to those two options. Just curious?

2cute4u
December 8th, 2007, 08:19 AM
I think the coolest thing that could (n)ever happen would be for Apple to release iTunes under the GPL

jpkotta
December 8th, 2007, 09:06 AM
Yes - other (please explain)

I wouldn't use it, because it's bloated, has (so I've heard anyway) the audacity to reorganize my collection, it doesn't play vorbis, there are better players, etc.

But every popular app that is ported to Linux is one less reason not to use Linux.

BTW, I use mpd+mpc/ncmpc/sonata.

Danikar
December 8th, 2007, 09:07 AM
I think it would be super awesome for Apple to port iTunes to Linux. Making Linux more suitable for the general public, (not that it isn't already, mostly), will do nothing but help Apple. One less WIndows machine means 1 more point away from a monopoly.

And an open minded Linux user is 10x more likely to at least try Mac OS than someone dependent on Windows, its like crack.

khurrum1990
December 8th, 2007, 10:40 AM
I really want Apple to port iTunes to Linux. An iPod is currently the best mp3 player in the market and to have good support for it on Linux will be an advantage to all of us.

Hey maybe we should ask Microsoft to port Office for Linux as well. I am not saying OpenOffice isn't good enough so don't start a war with me, but most schools like mine require Microsoft Office. Currently I have to run Xp on virtual box just for Office.

What do u think?

Peter Mount
December 8th, 2007, 10:51 AM
I voted Yes - other (please explain)

I haven't used iTunes and I don't yet own an iPod. So I can't comment on what they are like. But I think if people want to use it then why not? It's about choice after all.

popch
December 8th, 2007, 11:05 AM
most schools like mine require Microsoft Office. Currently I have to run Xp on virtual box just for Office.

Who pays for that copy of MS Office you run at home? If it is you who does, you can take your cause to school authorities and demand that they allow (or endorse) another product which can be had free of charge.

khurrum1990
December 8th, 2007, 11:50 AM
Who pays for that copy of MS Office you run at home? If it is you who does, you can take your cause to school authorities and demand that they allow (or endorse) another product which can be had free of charge.
I paid for the Microsoft Office copy. I don't live in the States or in Europe. I can't just go to my school and demand anything like that. I will get kicked out. Also I am doing A-Levels and am taking ICT classes and their entire syllabus requires Microsoft Office.

popch
December 8th, 2007, 12:05 PM
Also I am doing A-Levels and am taking ICT classes and their entire syllabus requires Microsoft Office.

Since you are running Windows anyway, you have at least the option of running iTunes there. Does it work in VirtualBox? As far as I know it does not in VMWare.

khurrum1990
December 8th, 2007, 01:23 PM
Since you are running Windows anyway, you have at least the option of running iTunes there. Does it work in VirtualBox? As far as I know it does not in VMWare.
No, I haven't managed to get usb support work in virtual box. I don't think it will work though. All I have done in virtual box is setup a file sharing network between Kubuntu and Xp.

toupeiro
December 8th, 2007, 06:06 PM
After rereading this thread to a degree, The incentive for apple to port it is complete conjecture. There are as many arguements outlining incentive to port it as there are incentives not to. I can't speak on apples behalf, and even if I could, I could not explain to you why they don't port iTunes except to tie it to the same reason why on the release of the iMac they focused more on the arrangement of colors they come in than than what their operational capabilities are. (a.k.a. we have no idea, but here is something shiny.) In my book, Apple NEVER had a keen sense of the computing market. They make good mp3 players, but the action of not porting their software to linux is just another page in the history of bad moves that company has done. If they do it, great. More market, and financial opportunities for them, more choice for us.

suziequzie
December 8th, 2007, 06:33 PM
Vote: Yes - Other.
Explain?: Here's why:

If they really want everyone to use an iPod, then they should support Linux as a way to drum up more customers. Till then, I won't buy their products. If they won't support my OS, then why should I support their company with my hard earned money?

Vadi
December 8th, 2007, 06:38 PM
Have you guys tried floola?

http://www.floola.com/modules/wiwimod/

logos34
December 8th, 2007, 07:08 PM
I wish they would. It would give people one more incentive to migrate to linux and dump windows, which can't exactly be against apple's interest. They would also make money from new apple music downloads from Linux iTunes users. The downside is people who might otherwise have bought a mac as an alternative to windows would instead use (free) linux on their pc.

I think amarok is great and will continue to use it and encourage its development and/or better alternatives. As bloated as iTunes is it does have the virtue of being a great all-in-one music organizer/jukebox with a fantastic visualizer. (the wow factor is still there for me after all this time). If they'd include support for all the other codecs (lame, flac and ogg, etc) then I'd welcome it.

Spr0k3t
December 8th, 2007, 07:36 PM
I hate apple. I hate apple. I hate apple. I hate apple. I hate apple.

With that said, we should discourage the purchase of apple products and encourage other Linux friendly products which offer the same or better options/performance for a lower price.

The whole application itunes should not be ported to Linux... rather a small subset of programs which are generally unavailable without itunes. Currently there are several tools available in Linux which work with the ipod quite well, but there are a few tools only available through itunes. If the generic group of apps were built for people, I doubt itunes would need to be ported at all.

The reason why I hate apple, they have a much higher level of lock-in than you would find from microsoft. The products they offer are nifty looking and quite the trendy "star-schmucks coffee cup a'like" moniker for the maelovolent masses of mindless miscreants.

No offense meant for those who actually purchase apple products willingly.

alwiap
December 8th, 2007, 07:46 PM
i browsed through the topic and thought I'd give my 2 cents :)

I won a free video iPod (30 gb) in a raffle, so I basically am forced to use it as I don't want to dish out more money to get another player, and I don't want to sell it because I'm lazy mostly. I was using Windows at the time, and I reluctantly installed iTunes, and really disliked the program. From everything from a couple processes running all the time after installation (iPodHelper something, AppleMobiledevice etc.), to the bulky program itself, needless to say I was disappointed in that aspect.

Enter Ubuntu linux, I just had installed it this september, and I asked a few questions here about programs for an iPod, and I tried Amarok. I had literally NO problems with it, and in my opinion in just about EVERY category Amarok > iTunes. I had a problem initially uploading videos, but with another program or two I was fine.

Any day, I would MUCH rather support open-source programs that help you use a closed-source device and maybe have a hitch or three (didn't really happen to me, but I've heard of people's problems with iPods) than use iTunes, which was bloaty, ugly to look at, and converted everything to a needless format, at least for me.

If Apple did port iTunes to Linux, I'd say thanks but no thanks, I already am doing absolutely fabolous with Amarok :guitar:

bashveank
December 8th, 2007, 07:51 PM
No! iTunes is bloatware and as long as you don't buy DRMd music iTunes is completely unrequired.

Joeb454
December 8th, 2007, 08:44 PM
Yes they should port it...I mean, the file system on Mac's and Ubuntu are incredibly similar, if not the same due to both system's Unix background.

I'd use it anyway :)

khurrum1990
December 8th, 2007, 09:58 PM
Yeah they should port it, those people who say they shouldn't should just not use it. Most of the iPod managers for Linux r not as easy as iTunes. If u don't like iTunes still vote for it as it will help most of the other who do want it. If Apple does not release iTunes atleast they should release a software to help us manage iPods.

aysiu
December 8th, 2007, 10:03 PM
If u don't like iTunes still vote for it as it will help most of the other who do want it. Well a vote in this poll just expresses an opinion to other forum members.

If you want to "vote" in a way that Apple can see, vote here:
http://www.apple.com/feedback/itunesapp.html

prodigalson666
December 8th, 2007, 10:04 PM
I own an ipod and I wouldnt use itunes if it was available, however its there property, they can do what they want or not want with it.

khurrum1990
December 8th, 2007, 10:07 PM
Well a vote in this poll just expresses an opinion to other forum members.

If you want to "vote" in a way that Apple can see, vote here:
http://www.apple.com/feedback/itunesapp.html
I have done that already. Thanks anyway.

cluepon
December 8th, 2007, 10:12 PM
One word: amarok.

Amarok makes iTunes and even Winamp look like a feeble attempt at an mp3 player.

Amarok is one of the finest pieces of open source software ever. And, it just keeps getting better. =)

prodigalson666
December 8th, 2007, 10:15 PM
One word: amarok.

Amarok makes iTunes and even Winamp look like a feeble attempt at an mp3 player.

Amarok is one of the finest pieces of open source software ever. And, it just keeps getting better. =)

Absolutely right!

forrestcupp
December 8th, 2007, 10:33 PM
People, it's not about having another media player. It's not even about being able to manage an iPod. What it's about is having an option to legally purchase downloadable music from well known artists. Until recently, the only way to get digital media of this sort in Linux was illegally. Being able to get free digital music of no-name artists is great, but that doesn't help me when I want a copy of the latest music being played on the radio.

Now we have the ability to purchase DRM-free mp3's from Amazon, which is great. But having more than one option can't be bad.

Scotty Bones
December 8th, 2007, 11:12 PM
"Steve Jobs announced that he doesn't like DRM and wants to get rid of it. He urges DRM activists to lobby Europe's governments to force European record giants like Sony-BMG, EMI and Universal to license their music to the iTunes Music Store without DRM"

so do your part! :)

You might want to go back and reread that statement.
His points against it, is that DRM in the music industry is not universal. Consumers can go to a music store, purchase the album and avoid the DRM issue altogether. Making crippling a part of the market a wasted effort and a needless expense.
His true view about this issue really comes out when asked about DRM and "premium content". He is all in favor of that because DRM is in place from the get go, its universal, all content will be "protected" regardless of the point of sale.


EDIT: ok, so I was going to post a link to the particular interview i was referring to, but since I can't find it...oh well. I believe the the link is posted somewhere here in the forums.

EDIT: What do you think is going to happen when the music industry finally dumps the CD format? The newest latest greatest format is going to be DRM enabled from the start just like blu-ray and hd-dvd (video of course being bills territory). Where do you think Steve's stance on the subject will be then? "See, I told you, its all their fault (the RIAA)", You have fallen for his BS hook, line and sinker. He just told you what you want to hear, so he can shift blame and public outrage at someone else, then look like the good guy (classic good cop, bad cop). DRM has put him in the position he is in today (60 to 70% market share) and he is not going to give up that leverage, period. The non-drm offerings are to get the public and EU court system off his back just long enough for the industry to tie it all together (DRM and Trusted Computing - in which case, circumvention will no longer be a possibility). While DRM does have a few legitimate applications like subscription and rental services, its the overall abuse of the technology to lock everyone down and treat them like criminals that has me so upset. Until these abuses are rectified, I just can not support implementing the technology into Linux.

ntowakbh
December 8th, 2007, 11:14 PM
To me, it honestly doesn't matter too much either way. I wouldn't use it for a number of reasons, one being that I don't have an iPod, but the major being that the last time I ran iTunes under Windows, it pitched a fit.

Though I may be shouted at by some big anti-Microsoft people, I use the Zune. It really is pretty good. I have the 30GB model. It is now pretty much the only reason I choose to boot into XP. To add songs, and charge it. With luck, I may get a docking station, so the only other reason I would need it would be to manage songs, pictures, and videos. If only there was someway to use my Zune on Linux...

m1 grant
December 16th, 2007, 06:39 AM
Yes, but only because it would draw more people to Linux, there are A LOT of itunes users out there.

el_ricardo
December 16th, 2007, 06:44 AM
hell no, itunes is the worst media player out there, it uses WAY too much memory for something that essentialy just plays mp3s/aacs

boast
December 16th, 2007, 07:52 AM
--snip--

hehe, im not much of a reader :)

But yeah, now i see. Apple wants to make their own DRM. And now microsoft is firing back with their own DRM too.

this will be fun. makes buying music so much worse:popcorn:

k0rfain
December 16th, 2007, 07:55 AM
it doesent really matter to me, since you can manage your ipod with other things like gtkpod

jrharvey
December 16th, 2007, 07:57 AM
I have never had any problem getting my ipod to work with exhile or rythmabox but I would like to see iTunes ported over for the simple fact that I cant stand hearing people say that they give up on linux because of that stupid iPhone. Haha, ok maybe its not stupid but it is a stupid reason to go back to windows. I have tried to get iTunes to work with WINE but I havnt figured that one out yet.

RyanKage
December 22nd, 2007, 10:20 PM
Yes, I would love to have iTunes on Linux. It was the only all-in-one media player that I used on Windows. I'm trying to get completely away from Windows. At least with iTunes on Linux I could then FINALLY get an iPhone (I never had the cash and now I use Ubuntu and I'm rarely on Windows now lol). I would also use it for how easy it is to organize and manage audio AND video Podcasts on a single player. Unlike Linux where you have to have at least three different media players for: Music (audio) podcasts, video podcasts, oh and an aggregator FOR the freaking podcasts lol. So YES I want and would use iTunes on Linux.

jeffus_il
December 22nd, 2007, 10:29 PM
Any port to Linux is good since each port is a hole in the Microsoft monopoly, and makes Linux more attractive to a wider public.

DeadSuperHero
December 22nd, 2007, 10:33 PM
I recommend actually writing a letter to Apple about it, via snail-mail. If their corporate headquarters get enough emails, I don't see why they wouldn't at least talk about it.
I think I will write a letter.
Remember: just because something gets ported doesn't mean everybody has to use it. But, it gives more options, even though it's proprietary.

hessiess
December 22nd, 2007, 11:00 PM
i wont suport any hardwere that you are unablble to change the battery when it dyes

phen
December 23rd, 2007, 01:45 AM
I voted no, other reason, because I dont like the way apple is trying to glue every customer to their products. the ipod database that doesnt store the data in a normal way. all the accessoiries that only work with ipods. its a shame, because they have cool stuff. But i dont want to be forced to buy a specific mp3 player only to use the good looking accessory. Nokia phones now have usb-connectors and they connect as usb-mass storage. I like that.

fatality_uk
December 23rd, 2007, 02:00 AM
I voted no, other reason, because I dont like the way apple is trying to glue every customer to their products. the ipod database that doesnt store the data in a normal way. all the accessoiries that only work with ipods. its a shame, because they have cool stuff. But i dont want to be forced to buy a specific mp3 player only to use the good looking accessory. Nokia phones now have usb-connectors and they connect as usb-mass storage. I like that.

That's exactly how they want it!!! Apple sells boxes. It makes a lot of cash on the back on locked down hardware and that philosophy has carried across into iTunes. Despite Apples "warm and friendly" image, you only have to look at the way they have actively disabled peoples iPhones on update and they way the dealt with, what I thought, was a pretty harmless "fan" site http://www.thinksecret.com/

I couldn't see Apple even contemplating iTunes for Linux. It doesn't server their business interests, so why should they?

AndyCooll
December 23rd, 2007, 02:30 AM
My first thought is to say no to porting iTunes. It always amazes me how so many folk act like lemons and purchase iPods when the product is in reality nothing special. There are plenty of more fully featured, more reliable, and cheaper equivalent products if anyone cares to look. What these alternative products don't have however is that "fashion" factor. Just the same as when schoolkids must have the "named" trainers even though higher standard and cheaper (but less fashionable) equivalents are easy to find.

I also find the fact that you need to download iTunes software to use the store is a pain in the posteria. Hence I've got this far without ever using it and probably never would.

However, my second thought is that I'd be quite happy for iTunes to be ported. Purely on the grounds that I have nothing against proprietary software companies creating products for Linux. And indeed it is always a step forward when "mainstream" software apps are available on Linux for it becomes yet another barrier knocked down for those considering moving to Linux. Of course we'd like to hope that they'd only use open-source apps, however the reality is that many folk considering adopting Linux are put off by the thought of having to give up the apps they are familiar with.

:cool:

Arathorn
December 23rd, 2007, 09:03 PM
If their iTunes port to Linux will be just as crap as their port to Windows (I'm serious, have you ever opened task manager and seen how many memory-hungry services iTunes has running, even if you haven't run iTunes yet in that session?), I'd say no. On the other end, a lot of people don't seem to notice just how bad the Windows port is, so chances are they won't notice for Linux either, and the more programs available for Linux (especially popular ones), the better.

bufsabre666
December 23rd, 2007, 09:14 PM
i think the less proprietary software the better, but yes if were ganna get linux mainstream we should have it so people who always complain about having to learn a new program no matter how easy it is

stlcoptony
December 25th, 2007, 08:00 AM
On the whole, I am not against proprietary software. I am speaking only on my personal experiences here, by the way. I tried many mp3 players after my sandisk died (got run over) with bad results. I even tried the main ipod killer, the creative 30 gig mp3 player (I forget the name). I didn't like it; it didn't sync right and it was too bulky. After trying about 3 hdd mp3 players, I decided I would try the ipod. I haven't looked back since. It's syncing with itunes has been perfect. I know it is inferior in sound quality to many others on the market, but overall, I have had the best experience with it. For this reason I am recommending that itunes be ported to linux. It may not be the best option or the best mp3 player even, but after trying out many others with a highly impartial, biased testing scheme, I ended up liking the ipod ( and itunes ) the best,

just my 2 cents,
tony

rabid9797
December 25th, 2007, 08:27 AM
you forgot the option:

Yes - but i would only use it because i have an ipod

Lord DarkPat
December 25th, 2007, 09:18 AM
Actually, I think they should. I like the simple iPod transfer interface but Rythmbox is an unmatchable. If only it would be in windows(but, linux also needs the spotlight) It wouldn't make that big a difference or atleast make it Wine-Usable if they dont wanna port it. They needn't make it open-source, it's free anywayz.

Polygon
December 25th, 2007, 02:57 PM
it would provide a great technical challenge for apple as they kinda had it easy with windows, since quicktime had a windows port before itunes was ported to windows, but since linux does not have a linux port, they have to port both itunes and quicktime.

but i voted yes even though i wouldent use it. i might use it to get some non-drmed songs, but thats about it.

hakimaki
December 28th, 2007, 08:01 PM
I hate using so many different apps in linux to put stuff on my ipod. One program puts music on it well but can do video, the other does video but not podcasts, its annoying. I usually go on a windows box to transfer anything more than an mp3. So yea, give me iTunes in linux please.

BDNiner
December 28th, 2007, 09:44 PM
I don't care for iTunes or anything else that Apple makes for that matter. I have never really been a fan. I think all hardware vendors need to make their hardware compatible with most computers, but it is all on them.

P5ych0Gigabyte
December 28th, 2007, 09:54 PM
I'm not really in favour of iTunes for Linux. However Apple should release the details about the iPods implementation. I got a classic for Xmas and it was a pain in the butt to get to sync with Amarok because of some crap that apple did to try and prevent apps other than iTunes from syncing with it.

bobpress
December 28th, 2007, 10:00 PM
My daughter uses an iPod so iTunes is her access to songs. We do have a PC with Windows on it, but it would be nice to use iTunes under Linux.

billgoldberg
December 28th, 2007, 10:20 PM
I don't want any Icrap on my system.

I voted "no and we shouldn't encourage people to use ipods" or something like that.

Apple = DRM

Apple is worse than Microsoft when it comes to DRM, so I for one ban all apple products.

hhhhhx
December 28th, 2007, 10:46 PM
one word : iphone

fearpi
December 28th, 2007, 11:10 PM
Software like iTunes that relies so heavily on DRM would infringe upon the spirit of free and open source. I know that Ubuntu doesn't adhere as stringently to this philosophy as Debian, for example, but it would be a step in the wrong direction for GNU/Linux.

arkara
January 17th, 2008, 12:45 AM
first of all
i believe that releasing itunes for linux would show that linux counts more on computer industry.

i would not use itunes but.
itunes should not have drm and most of all it should have it's source open....

jrusso2
January 17th, 2008, 01:24 AM
Personally I don't think Linux users should be supporting this locked in DRM iTunes.

However you have freedom to choose. But as you can see Apple has no interest in supporting Linux.

barbedsaber
January 17th, 2008, 03:31 AM
I would use for reason only, .the music store, (I always feel bad when I use frostwire to download music, but I dont want to buy a cd with 19 tracks I don't like, to get one track that I do)

Æniad
January 17th, 2008, 04:18 AM
iTunes is bloated crap, one of my pet peeves is that you need an iTunes account just to get album art.

allforcarrie
January 17th, 2008, 05:08 AM
yay itunes.


iTunes is bloated crap, one of my pet peeves is that you need an iTunes account just to get album art.
I've never had htat problem....

bufsabre666
January 17th, 2008, 05:17 AM
i think itunes is bloated crap, i hate viewing album covers, ill stick to rythmnbox

but i support the port just to have it cause that might get more poeple over to linux

Zack McCool
January 17th, 2008, 05:31 AM
I think we do need iTunes on Linux. It will make managing the iPod so much easier. Other iPod managing applications currently on Linux suck!

I disagree with you here. I really like Amarok a lot. The only downside is that, honestly, I would rather download my music legally, and the iTunes store has the best selection I have found. But I will not download DRM music for myself (the wife does, but considering the crap she listens to, I couldn't care less).

If Amarok would team with a better music outlet (perhaps e-music?) where I could legally buy a decent selection of music at a reasonable price (and I do think $1 a tune is fair enough), I would be in heaven.

paintba||er
January 17th, 2008, 06:00 AM
I said no, other because while I am an Apple fanboy, love Apple software and would surely use it in Linux if I had the option to I still don't think it would be worth it for Apple to do. There Linux userbase isn't really large enough for them to make a profit from it, there is already plenty of iTunes alternatives for Linux, and if they did release a Linux version half the users would complain about proprietary software and not use it anyway. I just sync my iPod in OS X. (what I use almost all of the time)

Game Theory
January 28th, 2008, 02:04 AM
I think it's time to get recognized.
I sent feedback to Apple using the link below.
I think anyone who can send one, and is interested in using iTunes should do it too (you will have to sign up for an log in account).

http://www.apple.com/feedback/itunesapp.html

If anyone knows of a better way to petition this, please help!

:KS

Folk Theory
January 28th, 2008, 02:06 AM
yes, it is time Apple recognize that we exist. please participate in this effort of ours to finally get Apple iTunes working on our OS of Choice.

hhhhhx
January 28th, 2008, 02:25 AM
theres an actual online petition that you can sign up for, i signed up for it a while ago, but i cant remember were it was.

also, i hate to be the bearer of bed news, but i highly dought that apple will go for it because the longer they can deny open source the longer that apple and windows will last. :(

Game Theory
January 28th, 2008, 02:30 AM
If there is a petition, didn't find it on Apple's website (though probably would not be there...) If anyone knows where it is, that would be good.

Also, about being the bearer of bad news...probably Apple wouldn't go for it now, but if people keep on asking for it...then might realize that it has to be done sooner or later.

It can happen, so let's all try :KS

Joeb454
January 28th, 2008, 02:32 AM
Drop a few emails to the EU and they might start an anti-trust case against them for it.

They do for everything else ;)

hhhhhx
January 28th, 2008, 02:34 AM
If there is a petition, didn't find it on Apple's website (though probably would not be there...) If anyone knows where it is, that would be good.

Also, about being the bearer of bad news...probably Apple wouldn't go for it now, but if people keep on asking for it...then might realize that it has to be done sooner or later.

It can happen, so let's all try :KS

Once open source gains most of the market share, then apple will realize that they haft to. But, it may still happen before so i couldn't hurt to try. :)

CCNA_student
January 28th, 2008, 02:34 AM
I like gtkpod better anyway, but if you really think that this is that important, why not support this petition.

p_quarles
January 28th, 2008, 02:42 AM
Similar threads merged.

Nessa
January 28th, 2008, 03:34 AM
Yes, so the experts here can tweak it and make it better. :)

money2themax
January 28th, 2008, 06:24 AM
i chose yes - other because i just want to sync and go some times and i can't find any linux prog the with sync music, vids, and pictures

graabein
January 28th, 2008, 10:34 AM
I voted no because I think it's a terrible program. It's slow and ugly and locks you into the sync library nonsense. I have an iPod and used iTunes on the Windows XP install (dual boot). Had all kinds of problems putting music on it from different computers (home, work, parents house). Good thing I have Linux both at home and my parents house. GtkPod and Banshee works fine with the iPod.

My next player will possibly be a Cowon iAudio and not an iPod... A friend has iPod Touch and it does look pretty good though. I love the interface and the screen is crisp and clear. Guess I'm not sure yet...

frup
January 28th, 2008, 10:59 AM
I would always choose an open source alternative where I can. Rhythmbox does the job for me. Apart from more reliable iPod support I see no reason for iTunes at all. I detest DRM anyway.

money2themax
January 28th, 2008, 11:46 PM
I voted no because I think it's a terrible program. It's slow and ugly and locks you into the sync library nonsense. I have an iPod and used iTunes on the Windows XP install (dual boot). Had all kinds of problems putting music on it from different computers (home, work, parents house). Good thing I have Linux both at home and my parents house. GtkPod and Banshee works fine with the iPod.

My next player will possibly be a Cowon iAudio and not an iPod... A friend has iPod Touch and it does look pretty good though. I love the interface and the screen is crisp and clear. Guess I'm not sure yet...
I'm going for the Archos 605 wifi (http://www.archos.com/products/gen_5/archos_605wifi/index.html)

El Flavio
February 2nd, 2008, 08:22 PM
I wish they would, there is very little support for the ipod touch/iphone. Thats the only reason why I think Linux needs iTunes.

notanatheist
February 3rd, 2008, 12:52 AM
It may have already been stated but here's why I think Apple WON'T port to linux. It's simple really, they'll lose market share!

Think about it? They're doing what they can to attract Unix/Linux people with OS X. At the same time they get MS fools by using a pretty face. I've never used an OS that allows me the flexibility that linux has. Yes, you can do some fun stuff to Windows and OS X but it just isn't the same.

FWIW, I did vote yes. I wouldn't mind seeing integration with other components of linux as I do own an iPhone (jailbroken) and rather enjoy the functionality. *IF* the US market can get a decent linux phone any time soon at a reasonable price I'd be happy to switch. I was seriously considering the Moto A1200 before my purchase. OpenMoko doesn't quite seem ready yet. I will say I'm happy with Nokia's purchase of Trolltech. I hope they go full speed ahead on development and continue to properly support open source.

sandwormblues
February 3rd, 2008, 08:25 AM
if apple is going to combat third-party itunes store clients, then they should throw us a bone. I want to use my itunes gift card!!:guitar:

money2themax
February 3rd, 2008, 08:27 AM
if apple is going to combat third-party itunes store clients, then they should throw us a bone. I want to use my itunes gift card!!:guitar:and inflict DRM upon yourself...sad i only want it to upload junk to my ipod hassle free i like amaroK but i doesn't support uploading pics and videos

fr0sty
February 11th, 2008, 05:46 PM
I voted that I would like itunes to be imported to linux. It is the one thing holding me back from switching over to linux. I have lots of music and wish I didn't have to dual boot between vista and ubuntu soo much. I love vista for its versitality, but Ubuntu is the most customizable OS ever and everything is free. I personally hate Apple, cuase they won't release itunes for linux because it would divert people from buying uber expensive mac computers.

cerebrix
February 17th, 2008, 11:45 PM
i love my ipod touch. and apple owns like 90+% of the mp3 player for a reason, tons of people buy them.

itunes on linux would only strengthen the linux desktop and make it more legitimate to the public.

i want it.

money2themax
February 18th, 2008, 12:10 AM
I voted that I would like itunes to be imported to linux. It is the one thing holding me back from switching over to linux. I have lots of music and wish I didn't have to dual boot between vista and ubuntu soo much. I love vista for its versitality, but Ubuntu is the most customizable OS ever and everything is free. I personally hate Apple, cuase they won't release itunes for linux because it would divert people from buying uber expensive mac computers.
iTunes is making people buy macs because you can get it on windows too...for free

lyceum
February 18th, 2008, 01:04 AM
I voted no, we shouldn't encourage people to get ipods. Creative is better.

+1

I have a creative Zen, it dies not work with Ubuntu (yet) but that is the only bad thing about it. I can insert a SD card for more space, it is small with a big screen and easy to use. Movies look amazing on it! Forget the iPod, but Apple/Mac should get iTunes on Linux if they want to keep getting us with their DRM music.

cprofitt
February 18th, 2008, 01:52 AM
I would not be in favor of such a move unless Apple were to provide the source code and add support for more codecs on Linux, OSX and Windows versions. iTunes currently is just used as a 'drug' to tie users in to their codecs and the iTunes store.

As for the actual hardware... iPods are not really worth the money... they are just popular right now among the under-educated masses.

I like the Meizu, COWON and Creative players much better.

Players that support OGG:
iAUDIO 7 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16855228010) - amazing music only player that actually lists Linux (2.2.x or later kernel) as a supported OS
MEIZU MiniPlayer 2.4" (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16855625003) - a very nice 4gb video/music player
COWON D2 2.5" (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16855228007) - this player supports MPEG4, OGG and FLAC and actually lists Linux as a supported OS (2.2.x or later kernel)

Just my opinion, but the above players are better players and support open source alternatives.

hotani
June 11th, 2008, 04:09 PM
I think we do need iTunes on Linux. It will make managing the iPod so much easier. Other iPod managing applications currently on Linux suck!

My feelings exactly.

zachtib
June 11th, 2008, 05:15 PM
Up until now, I've been content using gtkpod, and then banshee for loading music onto my fourth gen iPod photo.

But now, with the release of the 3G iPhone for just $199, I'm planing on buying one when they release on July 11, and it would be nice to have iTunes in Linux to administer it, as I don't want to have to jailbreak it to use it in Ubuntu.

As it is, I'm just going to use VMware to virtualize iTunes, but I wish there was a better solution.

fearpi
June 11th, 2008, 08:42 PM
I think we do need iTunes on Linux. It will make managing the iPod so much easier. Other iPod managing applications currently on Linux suck!

Something wrong with gtkpod?

money2themax
June 11th, 2008, 08:57 PM
Something wrong with gtkpod?
i'm gonna have to say yes it needs to be a little more user friendly i sure most if not all of us don't wanna play around with our music we spent years putting our collection together and we would like an easy way to get our music on our ipods i switched to an archos for just that reason and that reason is...simplicity.

swoll1980
June 11th, 2008, 09:06 PM
there is no option in the poll for 'no, because it is crappy, and I can't stand it'

fearpi
June 11th, 2008, 09:07 PM
i'm gonna have to say yes it needs to be a little more user friendly i sure most if not all of us don't wanna play around with our music we spent years putting our collection together and we would like an easy way to get our music on our ipods i switched to an archos for just that reason and that reason is...simplicity.

I didn't have to do anything to my collection. I just clicked the "Add folder" button on gtkpod's toolbar.

cardinals_fan
June 11th, 2008, 09:07 PM
there Is No Option In The Poll For 'no, Because It Is Crappy, And I Can't Stand It'
+1

money2themax
June 11th, 2008, 09:20 PM
I didn't have to do anything to my collection. I just clicked the "Add folder" button on gtkpod's toolbar.
i know that i work with this stuff all the time now i also understand that it is wrong for me to turn to using linux and then complain about simplicity but when it comes to music i'd hate to waste time trying to figure out how to convert it [particularly videos]

on an unrelated note:

i have a copy of the source code for my archos from archos.com
does anyone want to take a look?

Link:

http://www.archos.com/support/download/software/gpl_notice.html?country=global&lang=en

wxnker
June 23rd, 2008, 04:45 PM
If there is a petition, didn't find it on Apple's website (though probably would not be there...) If anyone knows where it is, that would be good.

Also, about being the bearer of bad news...probably Apple wouldn't go for it now, but if people keep on asking for it...then might realize that it has to be done sooner or later.

It can happen, so let's all try :KS

Here's the PETITION link:
http://www.petitiononline.com/itmslin/petition.html

If people want itunes on Linux, then sign the petition.

-------------------------------------------------------------

Poll comments:
Through the succes of the ipod Apple has managed to "force" itunes on people. I don't like the way Apple does things, but itunes has become the obvious choice for many Windows/Mac users.

I'd prefer if Apple was forced to make the ipod/iphone more usable with 3rd party programs, but I do support a port to linux as well. Not that I like itunes much personally and I wouldn't use the shop as long as there's DRM, but itunes is one of those major programs, that make people boot into Windows or choose Windows instead of Linux.

Canis familiaris
June 23rd, 2008, 05:25 PM
They should open up the specifications. But I know they wont.

jumponskis
July 14th, 2008, 09:16 PM
I need <snip> iTunes! I need to get 7.7 to get the app store software upgrade for my 'pod!

Jordanwb
July 19th, 2008, 02:38 AM
"No. We shouldn't encourage people to get iPods." My MP3 player which I got for $50 is just as good as the iPod (if not better), does not use propriatory software (yes I know, rockbox) and cabling. Besides there's nothing inovative about them. It's been the same thing for the past 3+ years.

zmjjmz
July 19th, 2008, 03:53 AM
I've changed my mind since I voted.
cplay > *

Yes
July 19th, 2008, 04:09 AM
It nearly crashes my dad's P4 with 1 GB RAM. I know that's not much, but a program whose main purpose is to put things on an MP3 player and play music shouldn't be so bloated.

When I had an iPod Amarok worked perfectly for transferring songs, why would anyone want/need iTunes?

ad_267
July 19th, 2008, 04:19 AM
This thread is huge and I wasn't going to read the whole thing to see if someone else already said this, but I don't think they should port itunes, just release the ipod specs so that linux developers can easily include ipod support in applications, instead of encrypting ipods so that only itunes works properly.

At the moment ipods must be reverse engineered for things like libipod and libgpod, which is far from a perfect situation. It would be so much easier if apple just opened up the ipod specs for developers.

Edit: Stuff like this http://ipodminusitunes.blogspot.com/2007_09_01_archive.html shows that apple just doesn't want any other applications to be able to work with ipods. It obviously didn't work as the hash was reverse engineered, but the same sort of thing has happened with the new ipod touch. The firmware has been changed and so has to be reverse engineered all over again.

http://www.boingboing.net/2007/09/14/new-ipods-reengineer.html
http://blogs.guardian.co.uk/technology/2007/09/15/new_ipods_not_ready_for_linux_either_by_design.htm l

money2themax
July 19th, 2008, 04:24 AM
This thread is huge and I wasn't going to read the whole thing to see if someone else already said this, but I don't think they should port itunes, just release the ipod specs so that linux developers can easily include ipod support in applications, instead of encrypting ipods so that only itunes works properly.

At the moment ipods must be reverse engineered for things like libipod, which is far from perfect. It would be so much easier if apple just opened up the ipod specs for developers.

hey now there is a good point