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shaan.mi
November 27th, 2007, 07:06 AM
First, before I say anything else let me say that I want you all to circulate this all around the linux community. Also I would like to say thank you all who this summer helped me get compiz fusion to work. I have used Ubuntu before. I have been an open source fan before.

Why is everybody so obsessed about linux and open source? Every pc magazine I read “Embrace Open Source” or “switch to linux” Linux to me is not that great. During my first boot I needed to use the command line to install my wireless driver. I needed to do the same thing for flash and java. A normal Windows user uses the device manager or an *.exe file or plain old active x. You people see the difference? Nobody has time for the command line. And you people actually have the nerve to say “linux is the future”? What are you people basing that off of? Im not ignorant though, I see your side of hating Microsoft. I really do! But is it worth it to switch? I don’t think so! You guys are like feminist, you people take yourselves way too seriously! Face the truth! Linux = Windows 3.1! A graphics layer on top of a command line! Except Linux is actually an O.S. and 3.1 was not! Linux is only good 4 servers and small computers like phones and pda's.

wolfen69
November 27th, 2007, 07:14 AM
you're entitled to an opinion. you've already made up your mind. so don't expect me to try and talk you into using linux. have fun using whatever OS. goodbye.

ericesque
November 27th, 2007, 07:14 AM
Let me be the first to say: Linux is not Windows. Linux isn't .exe's and My Documents. You didn't HAVE to use the command line for any of the things you mentioned. There were graphical alternatives--you simply were not aware of them. You're used to going to get drivers from manufacturer's websites. Linux typically has a different route because manufacturers don't always support linux.

If you're looking for Linux to be a better Windows, you're in for heartbreak. If you want Linux to be a better OS, give it 30 days and you'll never look back.

Chayak
November 27th, 2007, 07:19 AM
Just remember that Windows Vista just won the hall of shame in the top ten worst tech products of all time. My roommate despite having a brand new Asus gaming laptop can't even connect to my wireless AP. Every computer I have can including two laptops, an iMac, and my iPhone. I booted an Ubuntu CD in it just to see if it was something wrong with his hardware and guess what? It connected with no issues what so ever.

http://crave.cnet.co.uk/gadgets/0,39029552,49293700-10,00.htm

girishv
November 27th, 2007, 07:35 AM
I respect your opinion, biased though.

Did you ever tried to install windows using a general windows distribution ? Not the one that comes pre-packaged with the comp you buy. You will then understand what is the meaning of pain to get and install needed drivers.

Between, I wasted one whole day trying to install xp on a friends laptop (as he wanted it just in case) which came bundled with vista home and couldnot go beyond the second boot, 'cos the drivers are not compatible. I didnot had any problem with any of the drivers/settings with Gutsy. Now I am happy that he donot want windows anyways..

Girish

shaan.mi
November 27th, 2007, 07:35 AM
sorry guys i was not trying to be rude!

shaan.mi
November 27th, 2007, 07:37 AM
Btw, I build computers. Im running Vista with no problems AT ALL!

kpkeerthi
November 27th, 2007, 07:42 AM
Shaan,
Please don't invite flame wars with such topics. Nobody is forcing you to use Linux. Use the one you are happy with.

Sef
November 27th, 2007, 07:55 AM
Btw, I build computers. Im running Vista with no problems AT ALL!

That's great if it works for you. GNU/Linux is not for everyone. I just want you to use what you feel is best for you.

I built my own comptuter, and run Ubuntu Gutsy Gibbon on it with no problems.


I needed to do the same thing (use a command line) for flash and java.

I just used Add/Remove to install flash and java. As for my printer, an HP PSC 1650, Ubuntu detected it automatically.

misfitpierce
November 27th, 2007, 07:59 AM
Everyone has an opinion... No need to circulate this garbage. You may like vista better whereas I had BSOD on first day of install on that. So I choose to view differently. Also linux may not be for you but that does not mean you should change other peoples view's. Thanks for trying it though and farewell.

dasunst3r
November 27th, 2007, 08:16 AM
You provoked me at Linux = Windows 3.1; but instead of flaming you, I'm going to refute you. That argument is only valid in pointing out Linux's modularity. Indeed, if you removed enough packages, you'll have the equivalent of Windows 3.1. But I can list off a good few things that Linux can do that Windows 3.1 can't:

Wireless networking
Desktop effects
USB support
Update all your software from a central repository in one go

I may have left out a few things, but you get my point. Just because the command line's there doesn't mean that it's primitive. That's why people pick Linux for servers -- it's because you can go without a graphical environment, and that saves a lot of resources.

lancest
November 27th, 2007, 09:44 AM
Linux = Windows 3.1! A graphics layer on top of a command line! Except Linux is actually an O.S. and 3.1 was not! Linux is only good 4 servers and small computers like phones and pda's.
Windows is a security risk because the GUI (and everything else) is tied into the kernel. Linux is of modular design and that is a very good thing for many reasons.

zero244
November 29th, 2007, 07:10 PM
Comparing Linux to Windows 3.1 is ludicrous. Ive used Windows 3.1 and you had to install drivers for your cdrom before you could even use it. As far as comparing the base code of Linux......it is far superior to any version of Windows. Windows is the worst security risk of any operating system ever created.
Windows XP is a decent OS but it is very dangerous to use security wise if you dont know what your doing. And most Windows users dont know what they are doing.
You have to use Linux for a while to really appreciate it. You can dual boot with XP and do your gaming in Windows.
Do your surfing and banking in linux.

akiratheoni
November 29th, 2007, 09:05 PM
First, before I say anything else let me say that I want you all to circulate this all around the linux community. Also I would like to say thank you all who this summer helped me get compiz fusion to work. I have used Ubuntu before. I have been an open source fan before.

Why is everybody so obsessed about linux and open source? Every pc magazine I read “Embrace Open Source” or “switch to linux” Linux to me is not that great. During my first boot I needed to use the command line to install my wireless driver. I needed to do the same thing for flash and java. A normal Windows user uses the device manager or an *.exe file or plain old active x. You people see the difference? Nobody has time for the command line. And you people actually have the nerve to say “linux is the future”? What are you people basing that off of? Im not ignorant though, I see your side of hating Microsoft. I really do! But is it worth it to switch? I don’t think so! You guys are like feminist, you people take yourselves way too seriously! Face the truth! Linux = Windows 3.1! A graphics layer on top of a command line! Except Linux is actually an O.S. and 3.1 was not! Linux is only good 4 servers and small computers like phones and pda's.

Ah, ignorance really is bliss, isn't it?

It's pointless to actually try to reply to this. Close-minded people such as you will never understand.

SunnyRabbiera
November 29th, 2007, 09:25 PM
I am not getting the linux=windows 3.1 arguement as well...
Linux and windows 3.1 are entirely different operating systems, seriously I dont get your comparison.
And also the arguement that linux itself is an operating system... actually its a kernel but it performs just as well as any other operating system.
I can list many reasons why linux is better then windows, or why open source is better then closed...
seriously though Microsoft's business practices and lack of concern for their customers is what lead me away from them.
Firstly there is the crap with internet explorer 7, they made very sure that only Microsoft users can install the thing.
There are other operating systems out there and Microsoft knows this, but their anti competitive stance makes them arrogant and ignorant of most of the issues found with internet explorer/
IE7 shares most of the same bugs and flaws as its older counterparts, really IE7 is just a dressed up IE6 with no real differences between the two except Microsoft wont play nice with IE7.
The browser market has changed, Mozilla firefox has made a lot of moves in the browser world. The reason for this is for one its open source the polar opposite of Microsoft's stance... anyone can modify it and re brand it if they wished, plus mozilla has a lot of extensions on her that run laps around anything IE has.
Now granted even Mozilla has its security issues but the mozilla foundation seems infinitely more responsive then microsoft when concerning keeping it secure.
Of course the most secure browser out there is Opera and despite it being closed source it has become a major browser as well...
During my quest I have become very fed up with pages that work for IE only, for the non microsoft user this is frustrating and I honestly wish it was criminal... web standards are changing and its time for some of these guys to get a clue.
Then lets move onto the operating systems themselves, Windows XP was a nightmare to keep secure, its use of administration made it a pile of swiss cheese.
One major mistake with XP was MS got **** and made IE a core part of the OS... BIG MISTAKE.
This is another factor that turned me away from Microsoft, I had a LOT of issues (as did many) with trying to keep IE and XP running... IE attracts so many viruses and so much adware that it is the leading cause of XP system failures.
Then there is Vista, sure its colorful with fancy graphics and cool effects but really there isnt much in it that other systems have not done before. Vista really rips OSX off with its functions, claiming that all the innovations OSX has are all microsoft ideas.
From my perspective this is nonsense, sure on linux it too has flashy effects if you know where to look but it has never claimed it has the market on such things.
Then on vista there is DRM, and it is much worse there then any other OS...
Then there is the windows license itself, you realize that when you buy a copy of windows its still not yours, MS runs practically a rental policy on it and you can only use that magic serial on the side of the box a certain amount of times till its not usable anymore, on vista its worse as you can only use that code say twice if you have issues but on the third try its time to pull out your wallet again.
then there are the demands made by vista, it is insane that MS wants to shove a version on it that most computers right now cant handle... upgrading from XP to vista might as well be upgrading from windows 95 to XP as that was far easier to do.
Now yes Microsoft is probably the easiest OS to use out there, but its only easy because it has a monopolistic hold on things.
But there are other reasons too, such as the way MS allows people to install their applications but this too has its drawbacks.
One of the drawbacks is of course it doesnt filter what goes on in the packages, you have to install half a dozen things to make sure the app you want doesnt have a virus or something else thats malignant.
now on Vista this is a tad better as Vista has taken the unix approach a bit in its administration of packages, sadly though this actually makes things much harder then they have to be as the administration on vista is more paranoid then helpful.
Microsoft really cant last like this forever, already both apple and linux are starting to become more everyday user ready.
the most impressive one to me of course is linux, it has gotten a lot better over the years as a lot of things have been going for it.
I am more then sure that when you used linux it was most likely a rough and tumble distribution like red hat but there are others out there that have risen to the challenge of the everyday user.
Distrobutions like Ubuntu linux, Mandiva, PClinux and some others have changed the face of linux.
with distributions like ubuntu going into the termial has almost become a thing of the past and soon more developers will come to it as most companies are looking at things from my perspective.
of course even linux has its flaws, I wont deny them...
no games made for it, certain drivers dont work for it plus a lot of applications are not made for it.
but this is slowly changing, already Dell has put its hand in to linux development and I bet soon others will follow.

Vavo
December 1st, 2007, 10:27 AM
It has been 10 days since I got my laptop (rare MSI VR610X-017EU). It is a triple boot. Ubuntu 7.10, XP, PC-BSD. The last one is far from desktop solution, mainly hardware support (my ati card and wireless are not working...nor will any soon)

I have experience with Win since 3.11...15 years maybe and have Ubuntu for a year. This was my 3th Ubuntu installation but I have read ALL ubuntu help files (the guide) and now reading the Official book for 6.06

So I am more of a Win user (advanced) but I do like the ubuntu idea, so I can say that I like *both* OSs. Those who have negative emotions toward an OS are strange..it's a software ppl!

My comparision so far:

INTERFACE / GUI:

I LOVE Gnome. It looks good for any fonts size and you can make it uniquely yours. in XP things get messy as you try to make the small texts larger and icons looks ugly. However XP take advantage of the right click. Even in Open file box I can use Copy/Paste to make backup of the file before opening (there are rclick items)..generally there are more options.Great thing about Gnome is that the window design is same everywhere (same icons for same things and no "rounded"/skinned windows with bitmap in the background like some stubborn Win apps) KISS and I prefer it over KDE.


DRIVERS:

It's hard if things do not work out of the box for Ubuntu. I am not afraid of command lines and text files..it's like in Win 3.11 and famous INI files. But some hardware is not supported. Manufacturers are ignorant that's for sure. In Xp (as my laptop is "designed" for Vista) I use wireless driver labeled "for Lenovo" and edited INF fine to install the ATI card! Also some small glitches in Ubuntu annoy me a lot.. I understand the situation and accept it.

MIGRATION:

I use a lot of open source software + freeware that is portable in Win (many are present in Ubuntu). So I just copied the whole folder to separate VFAT partition ..starting the launcher program and I have migrated 80% of the applications. Used tweaking in Firefox and Thunderbird and they use the same profiles in Ubuntu. Codecs and fonts helped me to achieve the same "level" in Ubuntu with preinstalled applications.. (at the moment what I miss is Miranda and 1by1 player..substitusons in Linux do not do it as I like it)


SOFTWARE:

There is much more software for Win. But for a lot of users Ubuntu offers all they need. Most IT people have everything there. Artists, Arhitects, Web Designers, DTP are strictly Win oriented. It also seems that there are lot of apps in Linux that are duplicates..they can be combined in single product that will much better... like VLC(configurability) + Mplayer(Codecs) + Totem(Interface+Localization). Do not take me wrong..I see it like that from user point of view.

HELP/GUIDES:

I always hate when some program run a Wizard to "help" me. Many are targeted for newbies and useless for me. However ppl need them and ubuntu is make for ppl...so I found it useful that help collection in Ubuntu..and Internet is always there (here ;))

EASY TO USE:

Hard to say. GUI is needed for most programs if you do not have experience. Compared to Win..Linux apps look like a DOS program and the GUI just pass the commands when you press the button. This is also disadvantage when things get messed up. If you run it in shell you will see more info. In Win you have GUI for EVERYTHING..and I like it..but bugs from random software can make big damage. I see it in the Ubuntu: I installed hm..the name.. it basicly is a GUI for fstabs. As now Ubuntu use UUID this program interpret all partitions as unconfigured. When more and more setup options will be available from GUI the SIZE of the OS will grow up and it will be more buggy just like Win.

CONCLUSION:

Can I migrade 100% to Ubuntu? Don't know. I will not delete XP for sure. Will use Remote Desktop Protocol to access my desktop PC that has lot of XP software. Even transferring them to my XP here will be a big deal. Hope that I will make both OSs equal in features for everyday use (video/audio/reading pdf, chm)/office/IM?/Mail/Web). However I am very optimistic about Ubuntu. It's like people vs one corporation..ok few more. But my sister (beginner) will be Ubuntu girl for sure as I have everything that she needs there and it is also localized (classes will begin soon)..maybe I will even contribute some translations!