Will Gutsy be a dud?

[floke]

Ok so there are similar threads around, but no polls AFAIK.

So here we go.

[Druke]

Running better than ever on my desktop!

[floke]

Just added (I'm slow...*yawn*).

[flander]

Upgraded 3 days ago and had no problems, just fun and games with compiz !

[lewmnik]

Right now I am think that gutsy is ready for a desktop but not laptops. Gutsy is a real nightmare with suspend and resume problems and the funny part is that all hardware is runnig pretty well on edgy and feisty. So I'll skip this release and wait for Hardy :)

[ajackson]

I went for OK but nothing special.

When people talk about it being buggy they have to remember that a lot of the stuff is third party stuff that the ubuntu devs have tweaked here or there (I know they do a lot more than that though) and you also have to remember it is free. Compare that to Microsoft where the core system is all in-house and the company has the financial clout to invest heavily in the product but still release stuff with bugs in it.

To get software (and I'll include stuff like the kernel in with that group) working 100% on a small section of available hardware is difficult, Apple manage it fairly well because the iMacs (and other Macs) have a very small variety of hardware to cater for. For linux (and to a lot of extent Windows) the hardware that could potentially be part of the system is vast. For a lot of hardware the manufacturer creates the drivers needed to fully integrate with the OS, under linux a lot of the drivers are reverse engineered by people other than the manufacturers.

With each release ubuntu improves, I think the releases between the LTS releases where aimed more at cutting edge maybe at the slight lowering of stability, with the LTS releases I think you will see a more stable version of Ubuntu as a lot of the newer technology has been integrated via the non LTS releases.

[Fixxxer]

For me it's simply the best Ubuntu release yet.

[Tux Aubrey]

With each release Ubuntu improves

That has certainly been my experience. I have done one upgrade (laptop) and one install (PC) of the Gutsy RC and both have shown no instability and a perceptible speed increase. Restricted Drivers Manager worked great (it didn't for me in Feisty) and so far I've had no problems at all.

And I think the inter-LTS releases are far more interesting :) Now I have a whole year to wait for something genuinely new! Roll on Ignoble Iguana / Inspired Impala / Interesting Insect !

[Druke]

Anyone care to do a recap on just how far it has come since dapper?

[misfitpierce]

Whoever said its the new Vista (*pulls out rifle*) Well lets just say you know what's coming to you... ....... ..

[Vadi]

I didn't notice any problems. Hibernate works, but is acting just as odd when resuming (random fancy colors on the screen and such), resume I haven't tried yet.

My realtek-based chipset again not recognized at _all_, not even by iwconfig. Same thing was in Fiesty though. I didn't try compiling the linux drivers again though, because last time the instructions weren't right and copy/pasting them didn't work! So I went the easy way, ndiswrapper + windows drivers, as sad as it is.

The only thing I'm dissapointed at is the bulletproofx, which apparently isn't so bulletproof - my friend can't boot from her LiveCD because the screen just goes black after a bit of a loading. And since I'm not expert there, she's somewhat on her own to get it working..

[zekopeko]

The only thing I'm dissapointed at is the bulletproofx, which apparently isn't so bulletproof - my friend can't boot from her LiveCD because the screen just goes black after a bit of a loading. And since I'm not expert there, she's somewhat on her own to get it working..

did you try clicking the mouse? for me after the liveCD loads the screen goes black as if the monitor is in sleep mode. clicking the mouse solves the issue.

[Lozz]

There have always been problems with Ubuntu. Mostly these are things like wireless card support & laptop power annoyances. In Gutsy they are very much still present & I'm not at all suprised. On the upside Gutsy does contain all sort of nice updates of which I'm very glad. Particularly I think compiz fusion is wonderful & along with Gnome 2.20 everything feels much more polished. The new appearance menu is also pretty handy & overall everything for me appears to be running more smoothly than ever.

[Perpetual]

The only problem I have had with Gutsy is using the Live CD to install. First tried with the Beta and it wouldn't install, hung during partitioning (as others have reported). No luck with the Alternate Beta CD either, hangs at certain points of the installation.

Was able to install from the RC however had other problems after install, no Ubuntu progress bar during boot, blank screen during boot that 'sat' doing nothing for over a minute (ctrl+alt+f1 would get around this and boot like normal).

Bugs have been reported for these problems.

However, doing a clean install of 7.04, updating it then doing a dist upgrade produces a nice install of 7.10 in which I have had 0 problems. Runs perfect on my Dell D600 Laptop. May download final and do a reinstall just to see if the problems with the live cd are gone.

Edit: and by the way, I am averaging about :30 minutes longer battery life over what I was getting out of 7.04.

[ericartman]

The number of shills for MS should increase as the day goes on and this poll gets attention. Couldn't care less, I tried Vista,really tried, thats why I'm on Gutsy.


Cart

[Miguel]

I voted "not ready for prime time". For me, this is a "windows-like" release. Not in the sense of bloat and all, but in the kernel bugs sense. We are shipping a kernel that seems to have many issues with laptops where there were none before, and a kernel that has a severe I/O issue (see bug #131094). For me, a kernel that will cause long periods or unresponsivenes to people that dist-upgrade from Feisty (they'd better install from scratch) is unreleasable. Also IMHO bulletproof-X and displayconfig-gtk are not really ready for prime time (some important bugs are still standing), although Bryce Harrington has done an enormous progress and I have blind confidence in his work shining in hardy.

On the good side, although some GTk+ bugs were present until very late, the GTk 2.12 Gnome 2.20 seems like a good combination. It works extremely well for me and, although I don't use evolution, this release seems much more solid than 2.18. My only complaint is that we are not likely to see the full 2.20.1 experience (I'd really love to have backports of the bugfixes .1 .2 and .3 releases bring). I can't speak for KDE, but given that 3.5.5 has been out for a year I suspect this is an extremely solid release.

As a side note, this is the release in which I have been more involved, both in beta testing, bug hunting and trying new packages (more concretely X.org, ati and fglrx packages). It's been a very good experience, one that I fear I won't be able to repeat until I read my PhD thesis. In any case, all the work and X crashes have been well worth it.

In any case, these are the good things and the bad things of a fixed release schedule. On hone hand, you have the rush of the freezes (the bug-fixing apparent in the changelogs seen in the last weeks is nothing short of amazing) but, on the other hand, you always feel like something is escaping your reach.

I must admit though that if it weren't for the I/O bug and some ACPI issues I'd probably put gutsy close to "Best Ubuntu ever". And, yes, progress since Dapper is enormous.

[constrictor]

Been using this since tribe 3 and it's met and exceeded all my expectations so far.

[Vadi]

Scratch that.

Wireless got even worse. Yes, it's a big bad word. In Fiesty, all I had to do was install the ndiswrapper driver, and then connect it to the card with ndiswrapper -a.

Did the same thing in Gutsy, ndisrwapper reports that device is in. However, it's not seen by iwconfig, ifconfig at all. Tried a bunch of other commands from the help files, saw that my belkin card was "UNCLAIMED". Somehow, it was claimed just fine in Fiesty.

After half hour more of cursing and almost ready to downgrade, I did something like "ifconfig wlan0 up" or somesuch, and it almost came alive. Then I had to fiddle with the network gui, manually connect to a network, didn't work... turns out the checkbox was missing.

And, in the end of the day, I of course connected with Wicd. Not the default network manager.

Really, why break things? Whyyy.

[nowshining]

i voted Yep. Not really ready for prime time. as I miss read and thought the happy was at the top, lolz anyway I think it is going to be dud for intel board users in the sense they will not incl. a fix until 2.6.23 kernel or they should at least incl. the 2.6.22-12 kernel - latest of that version for intel board users until the newer kernel comes out due to that one bug of not being able to boot up intel boards with SATA and such drives, etc.. like I said above. Also I hopefully was able to back .12 up to a CD.

Yep backing it up to a CD from my cache archives incase of an re-install or something ,etc.. However I might try the CDs tho and do a live test to test if it will run. :) as I did lock the kernel version of .14 in synaptic so I wouldn't get bugged about it. lolz So far no more updates and yes I even locked the openoffice because on dialup downloading a new version just about every other day was horryfying lolz and last update was for the sparc machine anyway - a fix for them..

[stefgls]

Imho, Gutsy *is* already a dud, not even seen from the "what-works-what-not"-perspective.

It simply reveals serious problems in the whole release process: Bugs get marked as critical, get milestoned for a beta or RC..... and are idling untouched now in the release (except someone had the brilliant idea of setting it's priority lower again). And these are not bugs in optional stuff or exotic hardware not working, but essential things like TTY's or CD-ROMs .

The second thing i notice is that especially the kernel destabilizes in the last 2 weeks before release. I get the impression of trying to either push new features in (which cause problems then) or failing to fix the bugs from the alpha and beta phase. And these are not upstream bugs, but sometimes simple configuration errors, or misjudgements of the real world situation.

The question to ask is how long can you let a release schedule run on if it's quite visible that the amount of work, the amount of developer capacity and the remaining time just don't fit the equation?

I find it a questionable practice to just let a development cycle not finish, but stick the label 'Release' at an arbitrary time point at the beta.... doesn't look professional, and surely won't help Canonical to get more mindshare in the business market

[floke]

High expectations too make *buntu a victim of its own success.

But I do worry about this one.

It just doesn't 'feel ready.

[sdowney717]

so far it is a pain.
I have extremely slow typing in firefox.
If it is not fixed and a lot of people who have ATI video cards also experience this, they just wont want to use it.

[Druke]

I'm curious when all ,you who are calling it a dud, started with ubuntu. This kind of sentiment has always existed at upgrade time, but it is rather unprecedented this time and i'm curious if it has to do with ubuntu's growth during the feisty run,

[ajackson]

so far it is a pain.
I have extremely slow typing in firefox.
If it is not fixed and a lot of people who have ATI video cards also experience this, they just wont want to use it.
Does that not suggest the problem lies with the ATI drivers rather than Ubuntu?

[ajackson]

I'm curious when all ,you who are calling it a dud, started with ubuntu. This kind of sentiment has always existed at upgrade time, but it is rather unprecedented this time and i'm curious if it has to do with ubuntu's growth during the feisty run,
Linux is trendy now a days and Ubuntu seems one of the most popular distros so we get a lot of the OMFG this sux brigade becoming users (not that I'm saying all people who complain are of that type but you know that minority is growing).

[Druke]

o we get a lot of the OMFG this sux brigade becoming users (not that I'm saying all people who complain are of that type but you know that minority is growing).

my thoughts exactly

[floke]

22:10 where I am.

Current results =

20% Not good
20% Ok
60% Good to OMFG

People seem to be keeping the faith...

[tolremeno]

I'm curious when all ,you who are calling it a dud, started with ubuntu. This kind of sentiment has always existed at upgrade time, but it is rather unprecedented this time and i'm curious if it has to do with ubuntu's growth during the feisty run,
I started linux with feisty and had it running pretty damn well towards the end, although setup was a huge headache. Now I'm using gutsy (and have been since beta). Gutsy runs a whole lot better and was far easier to set up (esp with the display), but several key things are broken (eg networking) that worked in feisty.

[Cannaregio]

Shouldn't this kind of polls be made AFTER the release of Gutsy?

Gutsy will be released tomorrow, duh. We are all using (and judging) a beta version. (In best case: I have even seen people using and judging a pre-beta version as if it were "the real" Gutsy).

So maybe we should kinda shut up and hold judgement until release. Until tomorrow, that is. Patience, serendipity.

This said, beta or not, it runs quite well on my box :-)

[floke]

Shouldn't this kind of polls be made AFTER the release of Gutsy?

Gutsy will be released tomorrow, duh. We are all using (and judging) a beta version. (In best case: I have even seen people using and judging a pre-beta version as if it were "the real" Gutsy).

So maybe we should kinda shut up and hold judgement until release. Until tomorrow, that is. Patience, serendipity.

This said, beta or not, it runs quite well on my box :-)

Consider this a beta poll ;)

Besides, we all have opinions.

Maybe in a week's time you should post a poll and we can compare the results.

[ericesque]

I had completely opposite experiences on my notebook and my desktop-- although it was the desktop that had issues, not the notebook.

The desktop choked on the restricted drivers (nVidia)-- although i'm noticing that there seems to be general issues with the latest drivers.

The notebook on the otherhand worked flawlessly. In about 3 clicks I had Compiz Fusion working like a dream. About 30 and I had AWN running like a champ. Couple more and my notoriously buggy wifi was up with WPA security for the first time. Keep in mind, this is all off the liveCD! No reboots, no manual configs.

I haven't thoroughly tested the RC. Tomorrow I'll be attempting an install using Wubi on my desktop. For now, it gets my vote of good, but leaning hard toward best ever.

[supernovus]

I upgraded two weeks ago.

I had an initial problem that my wired network had not been re-enabled in Network Manager, which was an easy fix (Enable the device, woo...). Also, the upgrade-manager did not remove compiz-extras which was conflicting with compiz-fusion. I had to apt-get remove compiz-extras myself, then the upgrade installed the 'held back' packages.

Once those two problems were solved, everything else seems to work great, and Gutsy actually fixed some bugs from earlier releases, like the one which made usplash just show a blank screen when booting which first showed up when I upgraded to Edgy (and Feisty didn't fix it).

Also, compiz seems to actually work properly with full screen apps now, which is very nice.

Overall, I'd say this should be a pretty good release, even if it has a few issues they need to work out. I hope they focus on stability for Hardy if its to be the LTS release. Bug fixes and minor feature enhancement, but nothing as radical as the 'regular' releases. Then for 8.10 go CRAZY.

[JAwuku]

Gutsy a dud? Not in my opinion.

I'm running 7.10 RC, the 64-bit edition, and it is very straightforward to set up, especially Flash and NVIDIA drivers.

In Feisty, neither of these worked, plus getting Beryl/Compiz to work was not easy.

Only one gripe, which has existed since the Edgy days, the buggy rt73 drivers are still loaded by default. Not a problem, as I can blacklist them and use the official GPL Ralink wireless drivers instead.

[mivo]

Well, I don't really like generalizations. I think that Gutsy may have benefited from a few extra weeks of development. So my personal choice is to wait a couple weeks or so until the developers had a chance to respond to some of the release/post-release issues. But that does not mean that I complain or think Gutsy is a "dud". It's a work-in-progress, and since Feisty works really well and stable for me right now, I don't have much a problem to wait a couple weeks (or at least until I've seen the release feedback). I'll also try the release Live CD to see if my system still freezes as it did with the build of early last week.

I don't fully understand the impatience and eagerness to upgrade on the 18th. There have been opportunities all along, and it's not like there won't be daily updates after the 18th. So if someone has concerns that it may not be fully ready tomorrow, just wait a few weeks. If you are confident that it will work flawlessly on your system, get it tomorrow or even now.

This isn't a Windows release or a video game that you must have on the release day to be "cool". :)

[Cyvros]

I went for "No. I think its gonna be good!" Wireless, Compiz and Xgl by default is all fantastic, but somehow (I didn't even think this was possible) everything except GNOME works (every component works separately, but I can't use GNOME...).

Plus, between Feisty and the Gutsy beta, I've lost an entire hour of battery life.

But, overall, it's easier to use (the new Appearance dialogue is great) and more convenient.

[nowshining]

I was a feisty user just a few months or so prob. about 2 or 3 and then just a couple of months ago or so I became a beta tester as I know it's BETA, however since it is close to release a mere hours and deemed final and gold, my complaint stems from that, tho I never did do really an upgrade from a windows version to another, heck tho Gutsy the upgrade runs great because I'm using the 2.6.22-12 kernel which is the only one that works Again my only complaint tho is the kernel and not detecting SATA, ATA drivers, etc., and A lot of intel board users are going to be upset when they find this out - they could at least keep the .12 kernel on detect of an intel board.

edit: Even tho I upgraded it still run WAY better than windows ever did for me, even tho I vboxed them. :)

Anyway it's not ready for primetime. However I do plan on keeping Gutsy and what I have now, I also plan on getting the .12 source code from someone on this forum from which who has it and adding the patch for the Completely Fair Schedular :) then i'm staying put.. hehe

[ÜbuntuMensch]

Yes. Of course it is a "dud."

None of you will like it, especially not those of you who are checking the release threads every 20 minutes.

Don't even consider to download an ISO - you might be tempted to try the live cd.

At least, don't download it tonight, or tomorrow, even, when decent honest Ubuntu users with good personal hygiene and faith in humanity will be enjoying the free-est OS on the planet. USA! USA! USA!

Sorry, too much Ubuntu!

[leexgx]

well thay need to fix an Very importanted Securty bug with the Live installer

when installing off the live cd at some point it connects to the ubuntu servers it checks for updates but some times fails when an network connection is there, it remove All online sources untill you reboot and read them your self (norm user will not understand that na will no longer get Any update warning)

allso the wireless was hard to use and i managed to make my ubuntu unbootable (stuck at WPA at boot up loading ubuntu) untill i removed the card (i think)

but i strongly recommend if your an new user to use Kubuntu due to it been whare you expect them (main menu button), more things you plug in seem to be better automated, more config options

[floke]

So, no new updates from RC?
I guess my usplash is still dead then?

Not a good start.[-(

[kripkenstein]

Well, everyone's experience is their own; here is mine.

Dapper was good, Edgy was surprisingly stable and solid given the name - I preferred it over Dapper because it had better applications. Feisty was actually quite buggy and disappointing on my hardware and the applications I use on it... I almost went back to Edgy, but I persevered. Been running the Gutsy RC for a week now, and it looks like a repeat of Edgy - stable and polished :)

One thing bothers me, though, for some reason Firefox seems to have poorer performance than Feisty. Might be just me and the AJAX-ey sites I use though.

[adamorjames]

It's not looking too great for me. No Kernel updates, which means if I do a clean install my sound will be soft. :( Yes I'm using a laptop... with HDA Intel. Kernel from Tribe 5 I think, 2.6.22.10 or something like that.