*** Topics that may/will be included in this forum ***

[matthew]

It is not our goal in the Ubuntu Forums to eliminate discussions or silence people. In the past, we have closed threads on these topics simply because they have been discussed numerous times, and never with any sort of resolution.

This forum is a bit of an experiment. Instead of closing those threads, or moving them all into megathreads, we are going to move all discussions on the following topics, discussions that do not include any new insights or information, to this forum, where you can continue to discuss them, while those who are tired of seeing these topics discussed can ignore the conversations completely.

If you have a suggestion for a topic to be added, please post in this thread and we will consider it...no promises, though, and we may not answer every request, even though it will be read.

Problematic topics not currently listed in this thread will not be moved to this forum, but will instead be discussed and dealt with as needed among the staff. If new topics are added, they will also be added to the list.

Topics that may be included in this forum are the following enumerated elements in addition to any topic that is recurring, either during a long period of time or short, and doesn't have anything new to add to the subject.

Current Forum Topics:


Linux is not ready for the desktop, Windows vs. Linux, or "Why doesn't Linux do things this way???"

GNOME vs KDE (or other desktop environments...if no new insights are being presented) and it's analog, will Ubuntu ever make KDE the default instead of Gnome.

vi vs emacs
Automatix is good/bad/heaven-sent/evil/will-break-your-computer/no-it-won't
Should <name-Ubuntu-derivative-here> be allowed to exist?? (i.e. Ubuntu CE, Ubuntu ME, Linux Mint, etc.)
Does Ubuntu need antivirus software?
The <beta> version of Ubuntu is not ready for release!!!!!!
How can we take something named $development_nickname seriously?
Ditch the brown color scheme, and why don't you just learn to change your desktop theme like everyone else?

Naggy, whiney, or otherwise unhelpful "the developers should do X" sorts of posts that are not constructive in nature or "why don't the developers do things that are impossible and go against their own design goals?
My programming ideas/skills are better - Nah _mine_ are better - Doh, that's what I just said - Grr.. Show me your code - *Bang*
64 bit v. 32 bit; Is 64 bit ready?; Why isn't 64 bit as good; (obviously excluding actual issues that may arise with using 64 bit software)
Google is taking over the world!
Ubuntu vs $OTHER and all rather meaningless comparisons of operating systems, they are different for a reason!

[happysmileman]

Merge all the similar Automatix threads into one, for example pretty much all the threads here could be summarised in:

"Is Automatix a good piece of software?"
"Automatix ethical?"

Also I don't see a KDE-GNOME flame-war, we really to separate that from the other threads to hide the immaturity we all have (even me), but I think it should be moderated, or maybe there should be a thread about KDE/GNOME with all opinion and uncited "facts" removed, and just compiled into one list of the Pros/Cons of each.

Probably being a bit ambitious or haven't spotted the flaw in this yet but just throwing out my opinions

[crimesaucer]

...how about all of the Firefox/Opera browser debates?

[p_quarles]

"Viruses for Linux" threads might be a good candidate for the list as well. The mega-thread is a bit daunting for anyone who honestly wants to know if they need an av scanner.

[RAV TUX]

It is not our goal in the Ubuntu Forums to eliminate discussions or silence people. In the past, we have closed threads on these topics simply because they have been discussed numerous times, and never with any sort of resolution.

This forum is a bit of an experiment. Instead of closing those threads, or moving them all into megathreads, we are going to move all discussions on the following topics, discussions that do not include any new insights or information, to this forum, where you can continue to discuss them, while those who are tired of seeing these topics discussed can ignore the conversations completely.

If you have a suggestion for a topic to be added, please post in this thread and we will consider it...no promises, though, and we may not answer every request, even though it will be read.

Problematic topics not currently listed in this thread will not be moved to this forum, but will instead be discussed and dealt with as needed among the staff. If new topics are added, they will also be added to the list.

Current Forum Topics:

Linux is not ready for the desktop, Windows vs. Linux, or "Why doesn't Linux do things this way???"

GNOME vs KDE (or other desktop environments...if no new insights are being presented)
vi vs emacs
Automatix is good/bad/heaven-sent/evil/will-break-your-computer/no-it-won't
Should <name-Ubuntu-derivative-here> be allowed to exist?? (i.e. Ubuntu CE, Ubuntu ME, Linux Mist, etc.)
I just realized you can post in this sticky ;)

Typo above "LinuxMist" should be "LinuxMint",...on the subject of other OS's like LinuxMint for example these could be placed in the megathread about the distro under the appropriate sub-furom; in this example Debian.

In fact LinuxMint already has a sticky thread under the Debian sub-forum, all LinuxMint threads could be merged there into a LinuxMint megathread:

reference:
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=299756

My other idea is in the "Other OS" forum is simply create a "Ubuntu derivatives" subforum and move all the Ubuntu derivative threads there. They are currently under Debian(and everywhere else) but there is enough Ubuntu derivatives to warrant it's own sub-forum.

The same kind of MegaThreads could theoretically be made for Firefox, Opera, Konqueror etc

A dedicated web browser forum with the perspective web browser sub-forums would be more helpful.

This would make it easier to navigate, for different subject matter within a subforum.

Also I started a thread here on this forum(Recurring Discussions (http://ubuntuforums.org/forumdisplay.php?f=302)):
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=3446096#post3446096

I didn't realize this sticky was postable, please see the quote below from that thread:

While the concept I understand and the intent worthy, placing it as a sub-forum on the top of the cafe makes it predominately displayed and creates a forced perspective to the recurring needless threads that it is meant to eliminate.

I have no beef with this, the problem is when I go to the user CP to turn this particular forum off, I don't see it listed.

Unless, I simply missed it?

If not already, can it be somehow edited so this particular forum as with all other forums can be turned off, if we choose not to see them?

[matthew]

I fixed the typo. Thank you.

Thanks, everyone, for your suggestions.

I'll reply to the other question in that thread.

[bodhi.zazen]

Can we add discussions on antivirus to this sub forum ?

[matthew]

"Viruses for Linux" threads might be a good candidate for the list as well. The mega-thread is a bit daunting for anyone who honestly wants to know if they need an av scanner.Can we add discussions on antivirus to this sub forum ?
Added.

[bodhi.zazen]

@p_quarles

Lets see if we can support anti-virus questions by answering the OP, then closing the thread, and referring the endless debate here ?

I'll work on an antivirus "post closed".

Edit : How about this :

Anti-Virus scanning on Linux is of limited utility as there are no know linux viruses "in the wild" so there is essentially nothing to scan for.

In addition Antivirus is reactive, not proactive meaning it can not protect you from the next Linux virus until AFTER it is released, not before.

A potential use of linux antivirus is to "protect" windows or if you are running a mail server, and even then, IMO, Windows antivirus is better then Linux antivirus.

In the end, the choice is yours to make, but I would be willing to bet that the more experinece one has with Linux (Ubuntu) the less one feels the need for scanning / for viruses.

If you would like to learn a little about Ubuntu security, see this link :

Ubuntu Security (http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=510812)

If you would like to discuss antivirus on linux, see this forum:

Recurring Discussions (http://ubuntuforums.org/forumdisplay.php?f=302)

[p_quarles]

Are you thinking of trying to make this a sticky note, maybe in the servers/security forum? I think it's a good idea, and the note does a good job of covering the main points that many of us have repeated numerous times.

I can't close threads, obviously, but I'll certainly link to the correct forum.

[bodhi.zazen]

Well, I was thinking of using my last post as a standard response to the recurrent antiviral threads.

As I envision them, they come in two types :

1. Genuine requests for information.

2. Recurrent discussions.

For #1 I would like to allow the OP to ask a support question, but then close the thread once answered to "cut off" the endless discussion. This is how I envision using my last post. asked/answered/closed with reference here for discussion.

For #2 -> Move here.

If you like you are free to copy/link all you like, and report a thread as needing closure / moving here and the other mods with take care of the rest.

[matthew]

I added a topic about "the <beta> version of Ubuntu is not ready for release...we always seem to get this sort of thread right around this time...I've seen it for Breezy, Dapper, Edgy, Feisty and Gutsy. It is called a "beta" because it is not yet ready for release...

[matthew]

I added the perennial complaint about names like "Feisty Fawn" and how they "obviously" make it "so hard" to take Ubuntu seriously.

[p_quarles]

Just noticed that someone has revived the old "sudo is a security risk" -- "nuh-uh you'd need physical access" topic:
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=572089

Admittedly, that doesn't recur as frequently as the others, but I thought I'd mention it in case an admin thinks it might belong here. :)

[bodhi.zazen]

Just noticed that someone has revived the old "sudo is a security risk" -- "nuh-uh you'd need physical access" topic:
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=572089

Admittedly, that doesn't recur as frequently as the others, but I thought I'd mention it in case an admin thinks it might belong here. :)

Thanks I jailed the thread and gave an infraction.

[Rui Pais]

Hi,
can the eternal and always recurring discussions on "ditch the brown" be considered as nice candidates for this section?

[matthew]

Hi,
can the eternal and always recurring discussions on "ditch the brown" be considered as nice candidates for this section?I think it fits, although there is a legitimate discussion about a new color scheme for Hardy Heron, so we might not want to include those.

I'll add "ditch the brown" to the list for all those other instances where people are just complaining, followed by others telling them to just change their theme like everyone else does.

[Rui Pais]

I think it fits, although there is a legitimate discussion about a new color scheme for Hardy Heron, so we might not want to include those.

yes of course.
I was thinking on all those more generic discussions essentially based/argued on personal tastes or, arguments like "looks old/70's/.../90's", "look like poo" or "everybody knows neerd/techie guys prefer blue variations", etc.

[matthew]

yes of course.
I was thinking on all those more generic discussions essentially based/argued on personal tastes or, arguments like "looks old/70's/.../90's", "look like poo" or "everybody knows neerd/techie guys prefer blue variations", etc.I agree. If/as you see them, use the report post and staff can start moving the threads.

[mips]

I think it fits, although there is a legitimate discussion about a new color scheme for Hardy Heron, so we might not want to include those.
.

Got a link to that discussion please ?

[matthew]

Got a link to that discussion please ?The ubuntu-art mailing list (https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art) is where that is taking place, combined with some meetings and discussions (http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20071101-hardy-heron-visual-theme-planned-at-the-ubuntu-developer-summit.html) during the recent developer summit. Here's a link to one discussion (http://www.mail-archive.com/ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com/msg03970.html) that I know of.

I don't have a forum link, but I wouldn't be surprised to see it being discussed in here somewhere as well.

[Rui Pais]

I agree. If/as you see them, use the report post and staff can start moving the threads.

ok,
here some i have in my mail box:
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=285916
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=397408
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=397408
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=500497

if i see any more, i'll link here
Thanks.

edit:
a few i get it random from a basic search (this subject is really recurrent :) )
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=477078&highlight=brown+theme
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=563458
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=405684




I don't have a forum link, but I wouldn't be surprised to see it being discussed in here somewhere as well.
here one on H. Heron looks:
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=565685

[matthew]

ok,
here some i have
Thanks. I was offline for a few days, so it took me a while to look at these. Some are in various development forums that are closed for posting, so I'll just leave them there. Some that are old and short, I think I'll also leave where they are since they have long since died off and are somewhat hidden.

I did move some, and I think we should move all new threads on the topic.

[Rui Pais]

Thanks. I was offline for a few days, so it took me a while to look at these. Some are in various development forums that are closed for posting, so I'll just leave them there. Some that are old and short, I think I'll also leave where they are since they have long since died off and are somewhat hidden.

I did move some, and I think we should move all new threads on the topic.

No prob :)
Sorry about the old ones i just searched my mail box, and of course forget that some of them would belong to sections now closed or dusted by the time :) (it's a subject that naturally appears at ubuntu development sections...)

Anyway, it seems that i post some links duplicated and failed at least one recent, must have copy+past the wrong link:
Do you like the default Brown Theme ?: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=591257

Thanks for the extra effort in keep this forum more clean and legible.
:)

[matthew]

Thanks. I moved it.

[p_quarles]

Can we add "Ubuntu/Linux/Gutsy Gibbon is a stupid/unprofessional/hard-to-pronounce/sucky name" to the list of things that belong here?

[matthew]

Can we add "Ubuntu/Linux/Gutsy Gibbon is a stupid/unprofessional/hard-to-pronounce/sucky name" to the list of things that belong here?I think this rule (that already exists) covers that. :) Feel free to move posts like this here.

How can we take something named $development_nickname seriously?

[p_quarles]

Done. I somehow missed that rule when I was checking it.

[23meg]

I propose adding threads debating the usefulness of Compiz, which is entirely subjective.

[djbsteart1]

These aren't quite so pointless as they do provide information, but they are also quite subjective as the choice of distribution is often down to taste, but there are a large number of threads that are very similar/identical about what distribution you use, they all have a poll, and the odd comment linking the threads together. Maybe here is the wrong place for things like this, but if someone who is new to the idea of hundreds of OS's, I imagine that these said lists could be frustrating and daunting.

[Kilz]

Per this discussion (http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=620989) I think that you should include such topics as
Is 64bit ready?
64 vs 32bit

and the ever popular

Should I install 64bit

These exist in huge quantities in the 64bit forum. There is a sticky that links to about a dozen of them in the hopes that new ones dont appear. But it is a never ending stream.
Please add at least one to your list of posts that may be placed here so mods are aware of the reoccurring nature of them. Like this reported jem. (http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=756990) :D

[LaRoza]

Per this discussion (http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=620989) I think that you should include such topics as
Is 64bit ready?
64 vs 32bit

and the ever popular

Should I install 64bit

These exist in huge quantities in the 64bit forum. There is a sticky that links to about a dozen of them in the hopes that new ones dont appear. But it is a never ending stream.
Please add at least one to your list of posts that may be placed here so mods are aware of the reoccurring nature of them. Like this reported jem. (http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=756990) :D

http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=4734044&postcount=20

[Kilz]

Thanks LaRoza, sadly I anticipate a swarm of these type of posts after Hardy is released. It would be nice if one of the topics in my last post was added to matthew's list to show in fact at least some of them belong here.

[LaRoza]

Thanks LaRoza, sadly I anticipate a swarm of these type of posts after Hardy is released. It would be nice if one of the topics in my last post was added to matthew's list to show in fact at least some of them belong here.

Bring them on!

I edited Matthew's post *flex*

[matthew]

I edited Matthew's post *flex*
Thank you.

[LaRoza]

Thank you.

Don't thank me until you see what I wrote...

[articpenguin]

you should move topics about like
Does linux need defragging
how do i defrag

[LaRoza]

you should move topics about like
Does linux need defragging
how do i defrag

They are already moved here. I guess it just has to be added to the post.

[joshmuffin]

Just a suggestion but what about a sub forum dedicated to "vs."

A place for all the:
vi vs. emacs
Windows vs. Linux
stuff

I can think of about 10 regularly argued ones.

[darrelljon]

Why isn't the first post in this topic (http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=3439660&postcount=1) in a "frequently asked questions" (or "frequently posted topics") sticky topic in Absolute Beginner Talk (http://ubuntuforums.org/forumdisplay.php?f=326)? This is where I would expect most recurring discussions to first appear. This would save completely new users from registering only in order to post one post saying "Does Ubuntu need antivirus software?".

[bodhi.zazen]

Why isn't the first post in this topic (http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=3439660&postcount=1) in a "frequently asked questions" (or "frequently posted topics") sticky topic in Absolute Beginner Talk (http://ubuntuforums.org/forumdisplay.php?f=326)? This is where I would expect most recurring discussions to first appear. This would save completely new users from registering only in order to post one post saying "Does Ubuntu need antivirus software?".


It is sometimes a fine line between a FAQ and a recurring discussion.

FAQ are obviously frequent questions by new users and these are welcomed. Security (antivirus / firewall / etc), permissions, mounting, wireless, etc will all fall into this category.

Recurring Discussions (RD) occur when people take these FAQ as an opportunity not to answer the question or educate new users, which is what we would prefer, but rather engage in the same old debates. Recurring discussions typically are opinions or debates and relativly devoid of any useful content (although that is a bit of a generalization).

If you see FAQ on the forums, please help answer the question.

Of you see a RD, please report the thread. It is a judgement call sometimes and we *try* not to be heavy handed re: moderation.

[Dullstar]

Just a suggestion but what about a sub forum dedicated to "vs."

A place for all the:
vi vs. emacs
Windows vs. Linux
stuff

I can think of about 10 regularly argued ones.

That's a great idea!