MS Sharepoint services for Ubuntu/any linux distro

[toupeiro]

Is there such a beast in the works that anyone knows of?

[dark_harmonics]

Yea wow this is a good example of how ubuntu and linux in genereal needs to work on more compatibility components. This allows confortable windows user to just use their stuff under linux.

Sharepoint is a good example. My company uses this and i cannot actively edit the documents on there. It would be wonderful if there was a folder-view access componenet for linux.

Altiris deployment console will also be nice to have because it is another component i need to do my job.

Right now these are all in my virual xp machine :( i dont even want to have to boot that freakin thing up one day soon hopefully :(

[Shibby73]

FORGET SHAREPOINT and their LOCK-IN strategies!

http://weblog.infoworld.com/openresource/archives/2006/05/the_future_of_l.html


I think if your going to buy a server... then buy one that is awesome!
FIRSTCLASS www.firstclass.com

It works on any operating system with clients for each (even Linux) and also has a better browser
interface than Sharepoint with much more easy administration that supports TRUE online collaboration with rich features.

Where I work they got sucked into using Sharepoint... hey it is better than nothing and it was FREE to them since Microsoft is spread like a cancer here. But compared to my work with Firstclass which I did on my own... it is a horrid experience to use Sharepoint. Especially in a highly locked-down environment with Citrix & Juniper... making remote access like running a thin client on your own powerful computer. Their data security and forced use of Sharepoint has killed my creativity and made my life harder. Everytime I try to do anything with Sharepoint I have to keep logging in again and again... pretty stupid, especially when I used a RSID and special password to get to the thing in the first place.

If you want to try out Firstclass then check out my personal private server at www.stansgnosticus.net (the main webpage is more my fun with the ability to make and distribute webpages from the server).

-Steve (Shibby73)

[dark_harmonics]

Yes i would love to take over the management of our IT department but i dont quite think that is feasible. My point is that this is another example of how Linux will need to accommodate Microsoft products to conquer the market. The more compatibility, the more likely people who try ubuntu are going to stick with it.

[mwacky]

Everytime I try to do anything with Sharepoint I have to keep logging in again and again... pretty stupid, especially when I used a RSID and special password to get to the thing in the first place.
--There are ways to make SharePoint stop this in your web browsers settings.


I have been using SharePoint for quite some time at work and am curious about open source collaboration servers. A couple out there are 03 Spaces (http://o3spaces.com/Page/sp44/ml2/nctrue/index.html) and Metadot (http://www.metadot.com/). Has anyone compared these to SharePoint?

[elvis]

Yes i would love to take over the management of our IT department but i dont quite think that is feasible. My point is that this is another example of how Linux will need to accommodate Microsoft products to conquer the market. The more compatibility, the more likely people who try ubuntu are going to stick with it.

I'm not trying to be rude, but it's fairly obvious you don't "get" free software.

Ubuntu/Canonical don't want to conquer anything. They want to offer a free (as in freedom) alternative to proprietary software.

They, like most Linux distro developers, have no interested in promoting vendor lock-in and proprietary standards.

The Ubuntu developers aren't the ones that need to support Microsoft. Microsoft are the ones that need to offer free (as in freedom) solutions to the world, and desist with their vendor lock-in strategies.

I, and many other people, will stop using Ubuntu if they "accommodate" Microsoft by falling in line with proprietary, non-free software. Thankfully, Canonical and the Ubuntu developers base their own software design philosophies on these same standards, and by doing so offer the world a real shot at computing freedom.

The world existed just fine before Microsoft showed up, and will continue to exist just fine when they are gone. Nobody needs to accommodate them to exist, nor to be functional or profitable in business.

[dark_harmonics]

I'm not trying to be rude, but it's fairly obvious you don't "get" free software.
.

Yes that is a little rude and presumptuous. I do understand the concept of free software. It is about freedom to edit and manipulate the code of your programs to better suit your needs and then to freely distribute those changes. And no i didnt get that out of a book.

My point is that we live in a world full of proprietary software. Since I, along with lots of other people, cannot choose what my organization uses as a standard, I am stuck without a good solution to this issue.

Doesn't open office offer at least minimal support for Doc formats just for this reason? Doesn't Ubuntu offer a completely separate OS that contains only free software for pointlessly obsessive users like you? Ok maybe not pointlessly obsessive. I will give props to you for supporting the cause.

I agree with the free software concept but I live in the real world. I love Ubuntu for its ease of use, great eyecandy and mostly for its native functionality and compatibility with my other software.

I don't think of it as against any principals to take the proprietary nature of microsoft's campaign of domination and rip them apart with compatibility. Give us who want to support free software another option that offers a viable user experience.

Microsoft is the current dominator of the end user's market. This in my mind makes it important to offer support for apps that people need in order for it to be possible for them to switch. Without the great work on making things more compatible (done wholly by the linux community and definitely making Microsoft uneasy), we would have no programs and plugins like Wine, Exchange support in evolution, or document compatibility in open office.

One day, I will learn enough programming to add to the insurmountable task of adding a VIABLE option for end users.

So if Ubuntu's goal isn't to take over the market with its free concept, then what is bug #1 really about?

[elvis]

So if Ubuntu's goal isn't to take over the market with its free concept, then what is bug #1 really about?

It's about providing free alternatives for users.

Your post, and I quote:
Linux will need to accommodate Microsoft products to conquer the market.
provides no long term thought. "Accommodating Microsoft products" is not a road to end-user freedom. It's a road to more vendor lock-in and pain for users.

Does OpenOffice support Microsoft DOC format? Yes it does. Is this a sensible long-term strategy? No, it's not. A sensible long-term strategy is pushing an open and extensible format as the preferred format for all document software (ie: ODF). A sensible long-term strategy is to move away from proprietary lock in and towards open standards that allow freedom for all vendors, commercial or otherwise, to provide alternatives to the public at large.

Emulating Sharepoint does not make Ubuntu "better". Providing a sensible groupware alternative that uses open standards, and Microsoft joining in on the decision making process to ensure their customers benefit from the design decision while still being open and free is the right solution.

In the short term, if you want compatibility with closed, proprietary systems like Sharepoint, there is only one solution: get Microsoft to give the specs of the code to the free software community under a sensible license and without NDAs. Only then can the community build tools to talk to Sharepoint.

And given Microsoft's history of corporate crimes, what do YOU think their response to the above would be?

Again, embracing or even emulating Microsoft IS NOT the answer to Bug#1. Providing free alternatives that don't rely on Microsoft's vendor lock-in strategies, and assisting users to migrate away from Microsoft products is the real answer.

And if you don't get that, you really don't completely grok free software.

[dark_harmonics]

Ignoring the fact that Microsoft dominates the market only leaves more people without a choice... Do you really think that Microsoft is going to change their strategy of making everything proprietary? This will in the end be their downfall but for right now it cant be ignored that they own the market. Isn't it better if people can have a workable alternative?

I do care about the battle for open source formats, but first you need to convert a good portion of people to your software. It cant be expected that anybody could open a document saved in an ODT format. People from my on-line school, Job websites, professional associates would not be able to open it.

Would you post your resume in ODT format?

How can somebody transition to Linux and support open source if they cant use their computer?

I'm not talking about compromising the long-term goal of free software. I'm talking about viewing the situation with a realistic perspective. You said it yourself, it would be impossible to convince microsoft to play along. So the response is to just leave end users with no viable option but to keep using Microsoft. Doesn't this just ignore the truth of the situation: Linux is a tiny (but growing I hope) portion of the end user market.


Open office is definitely gaining steam. Isn't it a little coincidental that open office also is one of the products that offers compatibility options?

You and I can agree on something. The desire for a better, more supported, and more widely used alternative to Microsoft. I would rather my software be open source and not just for the price. I do agree with the concept of the freedom to manipulate every aspect of your computer's software to improve it.

[koenn]

It cant be expected that anybody could open a document saved in an ODT format. People from my on-line school, Job websites, professional associates would not be able to open it.
Well, actually, they can - all the have to do is get a free (no cost) ODT compatible text processor / viewer. That's the point od open source software and Open document formats and open standards etc.

The opposite is quite true : you can NOT expect anyone to open a MS-word .doc file without buying Microsoft software, or stealing it - or download one of Microsoft's Office Viewers, and then buy or steal a copy of Windows to run them on.



Would you post your resume in ODT format?
Depends ...
If I'd be looking for a job with google, redhat, canonical, ... I certainly would consider it.

[dark_harmonics]

The opposite is quite true : you can NOT expect anyone to open a MS-word .doc file without buying Microsoft software, or stealing it - or download one of Microsoft's Office Viewers, and then buy or steal a copy of Windows to run them on.

Microsoft does have viewers but you are right about them being proprietary. The thing is, it is expected in the real world that you would be able to open them. Some people even send docx documents now (even more annoying as there is no open source converter that i've found yet).

Why is this just expected? It is because end-users dont even concider that there is an option. They just blindly use and trust microsoft products. The majority of people fit this category and this ignorance is the reason why the small cluster of linux users need compatibility.



Depends ...
If I'd be looking for a job with google, redhat, canonical, ... I certainly would consider it.

At least you are being honest about the difficulties.

[koenn]

this is way off topic, I just wanted to point out how wrong your claim was that ODT is impossible to read.
I prefer open standards, mainly for pragmatic reasons. I somtimes use proprietary formats, for pragmatic reasons.

[elvis]

Would you post your resume in ODT format?


Yes. In fact, I do. It's a basic litmus test for me. If the person on the other end of the connection cannot read it, there's a very good chance I don't want to work for them.

Of interest, I currently have one fultime job and 7 other part-time/contract clients that I support, and I work roughly 80 or more hours per week. I regularly turn down work from people who have found my ODT resume on my personal website and sent me job offers, as I already have too much on my plate with this much work and a family that I never get to see.

Back on topic: once again you are missing the big picture. You want the free software community to waste it's time trying to crack open closed and proprietary standards to be considered "compatible" with non-free software. This is unacceptable. Instead, customers should push software vendors to better support open standards to promote better communication between various vendors and their customers.

Your solution is short term, and narrow minded. The long term solution is what should be sought, and making sacrifices along the way does not help anyone in the long term.

[dark_harmonics]

I could resort to trashy belittling comments here which point out how your viewpoint is close-minded but that sort of attitude only shows arrogance and hypocrisy.

I don't see how your professional credentials apply but most people would answer no to that question. Most of us are just happy to have found a decent IT job. Most IT employers where i live would only be able to ready my resume in .doc, including the one I work for. In fact that is the only format that monster.com accepts. Bet your services are wonderful. I just don't see how it relates .

The fact remains that real people still need a way to access documents from company standard systems. This may not fit your lofty dreamworld where everything is free and open, but it is still reality for a lot of people.

In fact, only know 1 or 2 people who don't use Microsoft products. This is very sad but very true. It would suck if we just couldn't share ideas because of an OS choice.

Both sides of the fence remain locked in their viewpoints unable to compromise. Great for the end user huh?

Sharepoint is another example of the way that people really are trapped into using Microsoft products.

Luckily for me, I don't need to pay for the licensing of another OS just to open documents from my co-workers because my company has corporate licenses. I am fortunate. Other, normal people who would use Ubuntu and maybe switch to an open source platform are not...

Hopefully one day there will be enough compatible components for me to trash my XP virtual machine and go full Ubuntu like I have on all my home computers.

In final conclusion, I would like to say that I am not trying to fight for proprietary formats here, I agree that this is the wrong way of doing things. It is also the only way that me and others can communicate with those who are less educated on the situation. I try to convert as many people as I can but I can't convert the world.

Microsoft isn't trying to add support for open formats and programs into their software and it can be expected that they never will. Bastards. So I guess that leaves those who do try to fight them without a good way to use things like sharepoint. Damn. Oh well. Screw them.

Sorry if i went off-topic in a dead thread.