The "Bye, Ubuntu" thread

[spacedogg]

Sorry guys and gals, I'm gave it a shot and I;m going to have to say good bye to Linux and Ubuntu. Without wireless support and an easy way to install programs, this is something that I'm not going to get. I'm a windows user and that's all there is to it.

I tried, but it just isn't going to work.

[tim15856]

Bye!

BTW, there are easy ways to install programs if they are in the repositories.

[MetalMusicAddict]

Sorry but why do people feel the need to announce this?

[aysiu]

Sorry but why do people feel the need to announce this? It relieves stress, I guess?

[Adrian]

Sorry guys and gals, I'm gave it a shot and I;m going to have to say good bye to Linux and Ubuntu. Without wireless support and an easy way to install programs, this is something that I'm not going to get. I'm a windows user and that's all there is to it.

I tried, but it just isn't going to work.

Maybe you can try another distro. SUSE has been successful in identifying hardware for me (haven't tried any wireless stuff though). Linspire, Mepis, PCLinuxOS are known for their ease of use. Maybe one of them is better for you.

Take a look at distrowatch (http://www.distrowatch.com) and read a little about the different distributions. Sure, it will take some time, but you will learn a lot on the way (and you will appreciate that later, I promise :) )

Anyway, use whatever feels good for you. If using Windows feels better for you, then use Windows. Having a choice is nice, isn't it? :)

[BigOldCar]

"Why do people feel the need to post this?"

Well, understand that he's actually doing everyone a favor by listing the reasons the product didn't work for him. Most people use Windows, so for Linux in any variety to have a shot at growth it has to appeal to a Windows-user's expectations. This guy took issue with the lack (or apparent lack) of support for wireless equipment and the installation procedure for additional software. If many other users are also turned off by these issues, it's something for the programming community to try to work on.

S.W.

[aysiu]

If many other users are also turned off by these issues, it's something for the programming community to try to work on. Except that Ubuntu developers don't haunt the Absolute Beginner Talk forums to see what they should be improving on. And, frankly, the indirect "suggestions" in the original post didn't really suggest anything specific or anything the Ubuntu developers can help.

A lot of new Ubuntu users want to install stuff outside the repositories, but I wouldn't be surprised if this new user thought it all had to be .tar.gz instead of Synaptic.

[BLTicklemonster]

Utter frustration.



So anyway, I think that Ubuntu, given time, will be right up there with Windows in ease of use.

Maybe he'll be back.

[aysiu]

So anyway, I think that Ubuntu, given time, will be right up there with Windows in ease of use. I think it already is. Too bad you have to install it yourself... maybe that preinstallation thing will be "right up there" with Windows soon.

[matthew]

Sorry guys and gals, I'm gave it a shot and I;m going to have to say good bye to Linux and Ubuntu. Without wireless support and an easy way to install programs, this is something that I'm not going to get. I'm a windows user and that's all there is to it.

I tried, but it just isn't going to work.Best of luck.

[dueY]

How is using Synaptic not easy? Even using the terminal is not that hard to learn!

[JimmyJazz]

Sorry guys and gals, I'm gave it a shot and I;m going to have to say good bye to Linux and Ubuntu. Without wireless support and an easy way to install programs, this is something that I'm not going to get. I'm a windows user and that's all there is to it.

I tried, but it just isn't going to work.

you should just give synaptic a shot it doesn't get much easier than that, and what wireless card do you have? 80% of them work out of the box (the ones that don't are usally the cheap crappy ones)

[fuscia]

"goodbye, cruel world (sniff)."

as to the comment about letting the developers know what needs to be worked on, via this thread - everyone knows wireless needs work and everyone knows a retarded drunk could use synaptic.

[ade234uk]

First time Linux user expects everything to work out the box without any effort whatsoever. It really gets on my tits when people throw in the towel like this. Computers where never meant to be this easy.

[KiwiNZ]

Computers where never meant to be this easy.

Why not ?

[fuscia]

Computers where never meant to be this easy.

"the best laid plans of mice and men often go awry."

[Derek Djons]

Sorry guys and gals, I'm gave it a shot and I;m going to have to say good bye to Linux and Ubuntu. Without wireless support and an easy way to install programs, this is something that I'm not going to get. I'm a windows user and that's all there is to it.

I tried, but it just isn't going to work.

Maybe Linux isn't something for you... that's no problem. I took myself quite a while before I could understand the big. I realized I could spend hours, days and even months dealing with one problem after the other, posting my *** of in return to work with an OS I didn't understand wasn't going to work. So I dove into bookstores and bought myself some books. So graduatelly within months I started to understand the history, the spirit and the use of Linux. It gave me that right push and after that all went like a knive through butter.

Maybe such an approach could be inspiring or useful for yourself. You don't have to be running Linux to learn about it and understand it. But once you do them both, you can switch back if you like.

[BSDFreak]

"Why do people feel the need to post this?"

Well, understand that he's actually doing everyone a favor by listing the reasons the product didn't work for him. Most people use Windows, so for Linux in any variety to have a shot at growth it has to appeal to a Windows-user's expectations.

So basically you are saying that for Linux to grow it should be a bad Windows imitation? Did it ever occur to you that Linux is growing BECAUSE it's not like Windows? Linux would lose most of it's userbase if it went in that direction and with that userbase goes the developers.

It's not really a problem, there is Windows and those users that like windows better than Linux should use windows and they do.

This guy took issue with the lack (or apparent lack) of support for wireless equipment and the installation procedure for additional software. If many other users are also turned off by these issues, it's something for the programming community to try to work on.

S.W.

It's different than Windows, which is a good thing, most problems can be solved if you have a bit of patience and if you're willing to learn.

[jeffjj]

I always get frustrated when I read posts like this. I have only had one hardware problem since using Linux...and that was my fault. Whenever I buy a piece of hardware I always google until I feel comfortable that what I am buying will work. Once I even bought a slightly older motherboard because the newest model required a slight change in the kernel settings. Only once did I get burned because I bought a printer on a whim only to have it not be supported. What made me mad was the printer to the left at the store was fully supported and with identical features. Since then my printer does finally work but I had about a year with limited capabilites. I'm not sure if I can think of anything else other than computers that people for some reason just expect will work with what they have with no effort in doing research. If you look at the insane number of posts regarding sound cards its ridiculous.

I also agree with the posters that say just do your homework on the different distro's and you will find one that works. Especially now that most distro's have a live CD where you can try it before installing. I hooked up a friend of mine with Linspire because it was the only distro that worked with all his hardware right off the bat, including the troublesome wireless card. For other people usually the solution is to look on this forum as it is the best I have ever used.

[ade234uk]

I used to think that it would be good to make Linux exactly the same as Windows but these days I could not think of a worse thing to do. Gnome is individual and it need to stay that way.

[blackant]

Maybe you can try to get a dual boot first.
Use windows as your main, then learn linux along the way.

Anyway, all the best with windows. :P

[Arktis]

What isn't fun is trouble with trying to get something like a currently unsupported wireless card to work when you've got no experience with the command line. This user came up against that wall and it probably frustrated him to no end. I remember that feeling. :(

[XQC]

So basically you are saying that for Linux to grow it should be a bad Windows imitation?
So basically you define "Hardware Support" as a bad Windows imitation?

Frankly, I can't say anything about the programs install issue because it IS easier than Windows (IF it is in any repo) but lacking hardware support, especially for WLAN and WPA, is a valid issue. If it's Ubuntu's fault or not doesn't unfortunately interest the casual PC-User.

[BSDFreak]

So basically you define "Hardware Support" as a bad Windows imitation?

I think this is the third time this happens today, read what i responded to.

Frankly, I can't say anything about the programs install issue because it IS easier than Windows (IF it is in any repo) but lacking hardware support, especially for WLAN and WPA, is a valid issue. If it's Ubuntu's fault or not doesn't unfortunately interest the casual PC-User.

Never said it isn't, the solution is to buy hw that you know will work with Linux (you wouldn't be surprised if a Sparc station or a Mac didn't work at all with Windows because you wouldn't buy that hardware if you were going to run Windows).

[Arktis]

you wouldn't be surprised if a Sparc station or a Mac didn't work at all with Windows because you wouldn't buy that hardware if you were going to run Windows.
Well, this is kind of a flawed example. Linux runs on a variety of architectures, so hardware support is a bigger deal. Anyways, migraters/dual booters should ideally have their current hardware working OoTB. If they run into a wall like this and have no CLI skills or general understanding and familiarity yet, it's definately going to deter them. Having OoTB functionality for certain hardware is not always a reality for a variety of reasons which aren't the fault of Linux, but it's still a problem nonetheless. But on the other side of the same token, I can remember lots of personal experience with problems getting people's hardware to run under Windows, too. Let's not forget that.

[BSDFreak]

Well, this is kind of a flawed example. Linux runs on a variety of architectures, so hardware support is a bigger deal. Anyways, migraters/dual booters should ideally have their current hardware working OoTB. If they run into a wall like this and have no CLI skills or general understanding and familiarity yet, it's definately going to deter them. Having OoTB functionality for certain hardware is not always a reality for a variety of reasons which aren't the fault of Linux, but it's still a problem nonetheless.

Actually it isn't a flawed example, you shouldn't buy hardware that doesn't work with the OS you intend to run it on, you don't buy a Sparc station if you are going to run Windows and you don't buy an unsupported WiFi adapter if you are going to run Linux, simple as that.

If running into a wall like this deters them then perhaps they shouldn't be running Linux in the first place, realize that i don't care if they are running Linux or Windows, Linux isn't for everyone, there is a choice to run another OS instead and everyone is welcome to make that choice, i really couldn't care less.

Having ootb functionality for "certain" hardware is rarely a reality for ANY OS but by checking if it's supported beforehand you eliminate the chance that it isn't.

[Arktis]

Yes, if I am building a Linux box, I should be certain to get 100% Linux compatible hardware. But if I am switching/dual booting with my current hardware over from Windows to give Linux a try, that's a different story. That describes most everyone new to Linux. Note that these are the very people I am talking about.

Edit: Oh, and note that I said "ideally", please.

[BSDFreak]

Yes, if I am building a Linux box, I should be certain to get 100% Linux compatible hardware. But if I am switching my current hardware over from Windows to give Linux a try, that's a different story. That describes most everyone new to Linux.

And if i'm switching to XP i'll can't use a K6-III 550 (it's fast enough but XP won't install with anything less than PII) but i can run Ubuntu just fine on that box.

There is a problem with certain hardware on Linux, there is a problem with certain hardware on every OS, it's not Linux specific but nobody complains about Windows not running their hardware.

I'd be interested to know what wifi adapter this guy was running that he couldn't get to work.

[Arktis]

And if i'm switching to XP i'll can't use a K6-III 550 (it's fast enough but XP won't install with anything less than PII) but i can run Ubuntu just fine on that box.So windows suffers from an artificially created perpetual hardware upgrade cycle while Linux does not. And? Sorry I don't see your point there...
There is a problem with certain hardware on Linux, there is a problem with certain hardware on every OSYes I've already mentioned something to this effect. I think you're way too agro. If I say I understand someone else's frustration and that the situation is less than ideal, acknowledge that it's not Linux's fault and note that Windows has these issue too, would you say there's something wrong with that? No, right? Well that's good because that's just what I have been doing in this thread.

Hardware support is an issue no matter how you want to explain it, though. There's a lot of compatible hardware still out there that Linux can't use yet, and it should be able to use it. Yes, as I have said already, this isn't Linux's fault.

The guy who started this thread was under the impression he could get wireless to work anyways. He found it frustrating and unfamiliar, and so decided to give up. I can remember the feeling, can't you? It was his choice to abandon Linux altogether even if you or I disagree. Can't you at least acknowledge that the learning curve coupled with hardware issues can be a problem, though? We all had it. You're going to pretend it doesn't exist?

[Viro]

you should just give synaptic a shot it doesn't get much easier than that, and what wireless card do you have? 80% of them work out of the box (the ones that don't are usally the cheap crappy ones)

I love these broad sweeping statements, that 80% work out of the box and if it don't well, it was crappy to begin with. I have had no small amount of trouble with getting my D-Link DWL-122 network adapter to work eventhough it's supposed to work out of the box. It wasn't cheap. And it sure isn't crappy.

Look at the list of wireless network adapters supported by Ubuntu and realize that there are many more wireless network adapters out there that aren't supported. Ubuntu is great but it still has a long way to go as far as wireless network adapters are concerned.

[xequence]

Without wireless support and an easy way to install programs, this is something that I'm not going to get

Cant get much easier then typing a few words and having it auto download from a 300KBps server and auto installing =P

Anyway, have fun with whatever OS you choose now.

[Vlammetje]

well 'easy' way to install proggies is available and actually easy, provided you're willing to find out how it works.

Wireless however is an issue, and I guess without proper wireless connection there's little point in continuing for now.

Have fun installing and setting up your next OS though.... if you weren't dual booting you're in for a few hours of joy ;)

[BSDFreak]

So windows suffers from an artificially created perpetual hardware upgrade cycle while Linux does not. And? Sorry I don't see your point there...

Windows doesn't run all hardware, neither does Linux, when Windows doesn't do that it's a problem with the hardware, when Linux doesn't there is something wrong with Linux.

Yes I've already mentioned something to this effect. I think you're way too agro. If I say I understand someone else's frustration and that the situation is less than ideal, acknowledge that it's not Linux's fault and note that Windows has these issue too, would you say there's something wrong with that? No, right? Well that's good because that's just what I have been doing in this thread.

You adressed me, i didn't adress you and i have posted nothing that goes against what you just said, i have tried to explain just that with examples.

Hardware support is an issue no matter how you want to explain it, though. There's a lot of compatible hardware still out there that Linux can't use yet, and it should be able to use it. Yes, as I have said already, this isn't Linux's fault.

This is exactly the issue, you say it's compatible, compatible with WHAT? If it's not compatible with Linux and that is the basis then it's NOT compatible.

The guy who started this thread was under the impression he could get wireless to work anyways. He found it frustrating and unfamiliar, and so decided to give up. I can remember the feeling, can't you?

A lot of things work via ndiswrapper (which i consider to be an abomination).

Considering that my first OS for a PC was SCO Unix and after that i ran Slackware i have never had these problems, i can remember the frustration when trying Windows though, but i don't whine about how windows is sooo hard, if you check my posts you'll see i'm perhaps more harsh against those who whine about how bad Windows is. I have a powerbook, i'm running Linux on it, i want to dual boot with windows but it won't run on it, should i got to a Windows forum and tell everyone that there is something wrong with Windows?

It was his choice to abandon Linux altogether even if you or I disagree.

I don't really care what he uses, it's not my problem, if he like Windows better then he should use it.


Can't you at least acknowledge that the learning curve coupled with hardware issues can be a problem, though? We all had it. You're going to pretend it doesn't exist?

You are assuming that everyone is recently learning Linux, i've been running Linux in one version or another since 93. I do find Windows a lot harder, just to get to where i can edit user policies, and if i'm not a part of a domain i can't set per group permissions... It's not that it's hard really, it's that it's impossible and the system is crippled by default.

[BSDFreak]

I love these broad sweeping statements, that 80% work out of the box and if it don't well, it was crappy to begin with. I have had no small amount of trouble with getting my D-Link DWL-122 network adapter to work eventhough it's supposed to work out of the box. It wasn't cheap. And it sure isn't crappy.

Look at the list of wireless network adapters supported by Ubuntu and realize that there are many more wireless network adapters out there that aren't supported. Ubuntu is great but it still has a long way to go as far as wireless network adapters are concerned.
You are wrong, the chipset of most of those adapters is supported (it doesn't matter if it's a D-Link, Linksys or whatever they use the same chipsets and if the chipset is the same the driver for that chipset works).

For your adapter and a horde of other adapters like it install linux-wlan-ng-firmware and run the containing script. Then install the resulting deb.

That's how hard it is to install your adapter, that must be several minutes of work?

[Gowator]

Hardware support is an issue no matter how you want to explain it, though. There's a lot of compatible hardware still out there that Linux can't use yet, and it should be able to use it. Yes, as I have said already, this isn't Linux's fault.

The guy who started this thread was under the impression he could get wireless to work anyways. He found it frustrating and unfamiliar, and so decided to give up. I can remember the feeling, can't you? It was his choice to abandon Linux altogether even if you or I disagree. Can't you at least acknowledge that the learning curve coupled with hardware issues can be a problem, though? We all had it. You're going to pretend it doesn't exist?

How can it be compatible if it doesn't work with Linux?

The problem is exactly as BSDfreak states ... people go and buy hardware to run with XP and moan if it doesn't work with Linúx .. people who do that should just stick with windows in the first place.

As it happens I can get a Mac, Sparc or AIX box to run linux but other than a NT version for alpha I can only get Windows to run on a very limited subset of hardware. In addition they have collected this hardware over time and are not willing to disguard or eBay it to replace it with a compatible version...

I can even take HW from a SPAC and stick it onto an x86 and do a bit of soldering and actally get the thing working ... try doing that under Windows...

Threads like this are similar to the I just bought a SUV and I can't get the tyres from my compact to work with the new SUV threads I presume go on in SUVusers.org or wherever :D

Last XMAS my father and mother both got linux and I bought both of em an external modem because I knew one had a winmodem which was partially supported and the other not... but the problem is Linux is not expensive enough... if they had paid $400 to upgrade to XP pro and then found the old device they had since win95 no longer workled they would just but a new one but because its linux they blame linux for not supporting a device specifically made for Windows!

Well big deal .. let me know where you work .. if its a hardware store I'll bring back that shovel I bought last week because its useless at chopping logs! What .. you gave me the shovel for FREE... well I still want to complain that even though it shovelled all thos leaves off my drive it still is useless at chopping logs and not much good for starting a car either!

[neoflight]

Sorry guys and gals, I'm gave it a shot and I;m going to have to say good bye to Linux and Ubuntu. Without wireless support and an easy way to install programs, this is something that I'm not going to get. I'm a windows user and that's all there is to it.

I tried, but it just isn't going to work.


hmm.. atleast you are aware of the existance of linux...thats a good leap indeed..

[Bandit]

Sorry but why do people feel the need to announce this?
Think they are looking for simpathy...

Here let me help..
You can find "simpathy" in the dictionary between "****" and "syphilis"...
There we go.. I did my good dead for the day....

[KiwiNZ]

Ithink we have covered this subject

[poofyhairguy]

Sorry guys and gals, I'm gave it a shot and I;m going to have to say good bye to Linux and Ubuntu. Without wireless support and an easy way to install programs, this is something that I'm not going to get. I'm a windows user and that's all there is to it.

I tried, but it just isn't going to work.


Thanks for trying. At least you will never regret what you might have had!

Come back some time in a few years if you wish.

[nocturn]

Sorry guys and gals, I'm gave it a shot and I;m going to have to say good bye to Linux and Ubuntu. Without wireless support and an easy way to install programs, this is something that I'm not going to get. I'm a windows user and that's all there is to it.
.

About the wireless, you haven't said what your problem was, is your card not working?

About installing programs, there is a dead easy way, use synaptic. It is much easier then the Windows dogma, but it is different. I know this puts many people of, but different does not mean wrong.

[SL0MO]

I'm going back to windows after almost 7 month of Ubuntu experience.
I started off with Hoary and was amazed by the progress linux had made (last time I installed linux was 3 years ago - Slackware ).
Then came Breezy, it had alot of improvements and I know for sure this will continue in further releases.
I spented hours and hours of learing and tweaking and gained alot of knowledge, but after all it's not worth the effort.
i.e spending 3 hours the get vlc to work exactly the way I wanted with GTK2 interface. I asked myself : Shouldn't I spent that time with something usefull (friends, going out...)

Anyway, my 2cents:

-Slower performence in general, GUI less responsive (Gnome)
-Although apt system is very cool, things like not be able to update to new firefox 1.5 smootly i.e. bugs me.
-lack of really good applications I use alot i.e DVDDecrypter, Foobar2000, Exact Audio Copy.
Alternatives like Grip, dvd::rip,.. were ok but didn't had the same power.
Running through Wine worked, but with varrying results. (slow ripping although dma was on, not be able to rip a track while EAC ripped it without problems)
-no NTFS write access (I know, not linux's fault)
-small things like:
copy a file from cd to hd : no permissions on the file (viewed from the system's perspective = ok, userfriendly = nok)
media plugins for browsers not always working (fault of website developpers probably but annoying anyway)
cd in drive, not be able to unmount it for some reason, not be able use the eject button on drive so reboot is only solution to get cd out.
...

What I'm gonna miss:
-command line usage
-using 'free' software
-secure feeling
-nice community, forums..
-....

While you're reading this I'm already deleting my ubuntu partition.
Anyway I'll check Ubuntu out in a few years again!

[earobinson]

-Slower performence in general, GUI less responsive (Gnome) Being fixed in dapper, why not run hoary till then?

-Although apt system is very cool, things like not be able to update to new firefox 1.5 smootly i.e. bugs me. This is in the backports no?

-no NTFS write access (I know, not linux's fault) I think there is ntfs write support in beta, but the real question is why do you need it?

-using 'free' software A lot of the free programs that you use in linux have windows ports so you can keep on supporting us, gaim, openoffice, firefox just to name 3

-nice community, forums.. We dont mind if you drop by and say hi, or help out other users.... you could also dual boot no?

NOTE: since this is not a support issue I have asked the mods to move it to the community chat
EDIT: Thanks VVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV

[nocturn]

Moved to community chat

[StefanoCole]

Since you want to go back to Windows but you miss some Ubuntu features why don't you set a dual boot system (Windows, Ubuntu)?

Stefano

[s1gnAl]

Since you want to go back to Windows but you miss some Ubuntu features why don't you set a dual boot system (Windows, Ubuntu)?

Stefano

I agree, I dual boot with my laptop and I find myself using linux way more than Windows, although I will admit my main box is still running windows, but only for gaming. Most of my other tasks are performed on my laptop and I have a server running Ubuntu exclusively that I use for bittorrent, media storage, etc....

Being a longtime linux user myself, I too have seen the vast improvement over the years, although not quite where I want it to be yet, it is getting closer every day to a total Windows replacement for me.

[frodon]

When you say slower performence, i have to ask you which processor you use because you can really increase the performence by using the kernel which match your processor, especially for pentium 4 because you don't have hyper-threading enabled with the default kernel.
See this link for more details : http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=85917

[ssam]

firefox could not be backported because it is used by many other packages to display html. a new version of firefox would need a new version of all those packages.

at some point in the future gecko (the mozilla rendering engine) may be split out into a seperate package, which would make this sort of transition possible.

SL0MO be sure to try out dapper when it arrives. you should find it a bit faster.

is Exact Audio Copy really more powerfull than grip? i find that grip has all the options i need, good error correction, and is fast enough. maybe it could be faster, i set it to not start encoding untill it has finished ripping, that way it rips a whole bunch of albums, and then can deal with all the compression afterwards.

[Mr_Grieves]

cd in drive, not be able to unmount it for some reason, not be able use the eject button on drive so reboot is only solution to get cd out.


Automatix would have solved that problem for you, as it did for me.
Quote from http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=66563


Capabilities:
31) Enables ejection of CD when CDROM drive button is pressed.

[Azion]

Pity to see, but I can understand where your coming from.
Does of us that do have the time to mess with Linux, get great advantages

[poofyhairguy]

Hmm....this might get bad.

Well...you are welcome back if you want to come back sometime.

Yet another piece of evidence to support the theory that Ubuntu (and Desktop Linux in general) is not the best OS for middle ofthe road Windows users.

[aysiu]

Yet another piece of evidence to support the theory that Ubuntu (and Desktop Linux in general) is not the best OS for middle ofthe road Windows users. I think you and I are agreed in this. In general, middle-of-the-road Windows users are best suited for Windows. Simple-needs or high-skills users will love desktop Linux.

I'm a simple-needs user, and I don't foresee myself ever going back to Windows... except at work. Though, if I could get a job using Linux, I'd be pretty happy with that, too.

[Cesium]

When you say slower performence, i have to ask you which processor you use because you can really increase the performence by using the kernel which match your processor, especially for pentium 4 because you don't have hyper-threading enabled with the default kernel.
See this link for more details : http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=85917

At least I have some good news from this thread. This is the first I saw the piece regarding updating your kernel to match your processor. I just read Frodon's thread and updated the kernel for my Pentium 4 with hyper-threading and now notice a huge improvement! Thanks Frodon (and Poofy). :)

[ardchoille]

Well, when I switched to Linux from Windows, I threw away my Windows disks and vowed never to return to it. So I had to make Linux work for me. One thing I have found is that if one distro doesn't work for you, another may be exactly what you needed. I went through 11 distros before finding one that worked for me, I didn't give up.

If Ubuntu is not for you, you may want to try other distros. Each has it s good and bad points.

[index_0@ya.com]

Hi,

I hope u can feel from my hearts agony thru the title .When i wanted to run a Open source OS, i felt a thrill to find something new and fresh that i cant find in windows/mac.The following is my opinion/thought i wanted to say, if u do u love this OS pls i am not cursing u . In my adventure to hunt down the OS , i installed and tried
Mandriva , Fedora 2,3,4 , Xandros so on . Till i found Ubuntu hoary , something changed ,i fell in love with this OS, Ubuntu shining and saying made for humanity.

Very soon, i upgraded to breezy and ofcourse eagerly awaited for the next version (as many did).The breezy was troublesome for me as newbie and i faced lots of problems in running/finding softwares to run and like my webcam installation was not fine and went without it.

At that point of time, i wondered if were to run a Windows as NEWBIE , will i ever find hard to setup my internet connection or to set a configure settings to my harddrive AND will i ever forget to set it up later ?

With a both goodnBad in mind , i used Windows(for games), and Breezy(everything else),Finally i heard tht Dapper is out and it's going to be impressive !!!

Really ? ....... It doesn't seems to be .... As it continued it legacy from Hoary ...

Take a look ,

1.

Recently, My 512MB RAM module went corrupted(thx to Windows),basically the RAM module was able to run for 1/2 hr or so and gets stopped , perhaps due to overheating.
Did u know, wht happened in Dapper? It simply reboots the xserver, AND sometimes it also hangs.
Did u know, wht happened in Windows? It said, "Windows safely shutdown due to a page_fault error"
error in a BSOD. Well, Windows had a mercy to shutdown my system and not to damage the hardware any further.Does the dapper produced only for good conditions? was it tested to be in a bizarre situation like these ? (Well, some say linux is robust) ,i think they have to do a re-test..

2.

I know most people have PPPoE connection, like me.But does the developers (even Mark ShuttleWorth) ever wondered the difficulty for a newbie ? There's is no GUI yet by default ,ever since from Hoary . There was "digg" recently telling Ubuntu can be used for Grandma's. I ll tell u there ll be no Grandma in this earth, who wants cofigure the internet connection thru the blue screnny "pppoeconf" command for internet setup.

3.
Well , I had setup internet now. Will it work ? ( !!! ... Nopee.. .. )Bizarre error startup up. On of my first day of surfing in Dapper, the connection simply reset/hangup after a idle timeout. Sometimes , the idle timeout lowers to <1min !!. How do i know this ? From my experience , i knew "plog" command can be used to know what happened. It stated some ".. No packet receive ..Modem hangup " .listings. Weird, started connection by "pon dsl.." this time connection wasnt made.Again "poff" and "pon dsl..." .Now it worked but later the same story continued later .

4.
Ok. now that i started to surf coming to firefox, what doed it have in loading the movies, it cant play most of the WMV,Quicktime movies as Neatly as it can nor does it have any support to flash 8 sites. Many of the favorite movie sites cannot be surfed by this.Even If i found, the movies are still dull, jerky.

5.
Let's stop the internet. I installed my video card driver Nvidia FX from synaptic.All fine and smooth here. Rebooted my system for safety. But i still find my firefox window ,to be sluggish when i drag them around left and right.So i thought for a moment, y did install the driver ???.The GNOME is already lightweight app, and with manufacturers drivers ,i never expected the graphics to rendered in this way.

6.
Coming to harddisk arena. I fed up trying to setup the DMA option for my hdd in the Admiminstration menus. Will this baisc feature me put up , in the appropriate menu? I wondered why Mark ShuttleWorth announced to postpone the Dapper release!. They told us for more polishing ! Where does the polish word stands for when i want to setup a BASIC feature like these or connecting to internet or even showing up a progress dialog during system hibernation !!!!

My IDE bus uses proprietary drivers in Windows ,which is considerably fast than generic mode.So i wonder wht the big deal in ubuntu since i dont have one for this os.

7.
And now my most frustrating moment that made me quit. When i put in the dapper cd thinking it'll fire up the boot, but in vain. Some say Linux can even boot on the old harware . My system is configured with AMD AthlonXP 1.4Ghz with Nvidia graphics and 128 MB (too low on RAM, i've lost 512MB earlier) and 7200 RPM seagate harddrive, And when i booted my system , it took >20 long minutes to enter the live desktop.!!!
OK .. let me stop straining the live CD , and i started to "install". It's a snail pace and finally came Mr.Grub ,to shoot out the weird situations. On the partition screen , i saw extra 0.0MB empty partitions already created for my previous breezy release. And since, breezy went fine with this, i formatted my previous root and swap partitions for dapper.
When final scanning is over, i saw another partition with 0.0MB next to root partition. So i have two 0.0MB partitions created by Grub!!. I thought it's noway near to a problem , i continued installation and something awkward happened. ... The installer crashed .. It gave me some stacktrace of the code. and asked me to report the bug.
Now ,a serious questions raised in my head, had the developers INDEED TEST the OS??? in strained/minimum situation ? if i cant boot in my system , wht abt older hardwares? will they capable of showing boot screen? ...

7.1
Now i plugged in new 512MB ram, and fired up the boot, booting alone was smooth , but the secondary disk where partition was made previously popped up an error message to "ignore or stop" installation due to disk sector read problems. So, i ignored the error , and continued and when i rebooted after installation thr were disk check errors and i found in one of my partitions all recovery files splashed in,after disk check !!My god !!! and the same error to ignore or continue popped up again.

Frustrated , i went back to windows, and looked at the partition table in Paragon Partition Manager to find one ext32fs primary(root) and logical bolcks are shaded with blue color indicating Invalid Drive !!! Wht' did the grub do?

I simply deleted partition and created a new partition table, and installed Ubuntu this time without any errors. (although Grub showed weird info )

8.

But wait a minute !!!. My mbr is gone now ,there's' no question to overwrite my mbr !!in the ubuntu installation !!. How cruel ???

9.

OK .fine i got the dual boot as of now. adjusted with it. after a while, i wanted to change the default boot to Windows instead of Ubuntu, since i would play nfsmw.So I took up the menu.1st and changed the "default 0" to "default 3" (this is ofcourse wrong , it would highlight 'Other operating System' menu item) ,I installed the grub into mbr by "grub-install /dev/hda1".Anyway as the boot menu was presented , something terrible happened ..!!

My WinXp didnt boot ,It said " Invalid parition type" Went back to ubuntu and reinstalled the MBR but in vain. Then i used WInXP cd and issued "fixmbr" command again in vain !!. Then i inserted CD again , and went to WinXP installation , there i found .... my Windows NTFS drive as FLAT, RAW, FORMATTED ...CLEAN !!!!!!. wht am i suppose do with it ? Only, Install a fresh copy of Windows !!! All my data's are all lost !!! Wht evn if i sue the Mark shuttleworth ? One guy in ubuntuforum said , he cant recover the data after the same incident.!

10.
As i can boot with Ubuntu, i wanted to take a break before deciding further.So ,i had a movie.to watch, which is rar (shreaded) archive, (the files are named as file1.r00, file1.r01 ...), when i tried to open with archive manager it failed. So i hunted for some archive managers, but all i found was command line programs and some needs to be compiled for ubuntu !!. Wow !! with all my frustration to open the archive , i fed up trying to read " --help" command switch. Desperate ,agony , no archive managers who can ease my pain (or any newbie's)!!!!.

11.
And i quit now. I reinstalled my Windows and evrything is up and fine now. I dont want to jump to ubuntu anymore and i am not the right person ,i think.
I'll stick with Windows XP, and tell u somthing , I've used Windows XP for two years continually untill Hoary to start messing up by little and dapper completed it. Are u guys telling me spy/mal/ad wares ?Well, I faced a couple of Viruses but, I SOLVED ,yeah ,I FIXED THEM, And i also use tools which i never need to sweat to find one. i use tools to guard my system and i did for 2 long years, i have tweaked it and i worked with it .

Last words,
Ubuntu I am going to miss u... but my heart is keeps saying
Good bye Ubuntu...

myubuntu@30gigs.com


There can be numerous BASIC things that i ( and others) can list here (i believe in ubuntuforums we find more!).But its already mid-night and i am drowsy

[vinodis]

This is a 'Gone Case'.

[nocturn]

From what I can read, your system is suffering from a hardware failure. Maybe the case has insufficient cooling or something else is wrong.

Windows did not shut down to protect your hardware but to protect your windows setup from damage, there is a difference.

Overheating protections should be done at the hardware level because software is too slow to respond to such events and can not adequately determine such failures (corrupted memory pages can have many causes).

[magomago]

I agree. Software does not cause your hardware to fail. Windows did not cause your ram to fail. If you have a bad module...then you need to replace it. Running it for a while and then stikcing in new ram makes no sense. And I'm suprised yuo got that far in ANY operating system with bad ram. I've had PCs just not install period beceause it freezes up


Also, the live cd IS NOT MEANT TO ACT AS THE MAIN DESKTOP, but a way to "try things out". It has to run everything from a) ram or b) CD. Your system, for a live CD, doesn't have a lot of ram. Infact 128megs ram is the absolute minimum for a live CD.


First get your hardware stable, THEN come complain about Ubuntu...because apparantly your problem goes deep

[ketsugi]

I've had the "invalid partition type" error before and it was EASILY FIXED. Apparently there's a bug (maybe with the Breezy installer, which is where I had the error with) which causes the installer to mark the NTFS partition as a different partition type. I think for me it was changed to some hidden HPFS/NTFS partition or something like that. The data was INTACT, it was just the partition table which was modified.

What I did was I booted from the LiveCD, ran fdisk and changed the partition type back to NTFS. After that I had no problem booting back into Windows.

[Phasmagon]

I can really understand your frustration.

Some people say that linux can do what windows do plus more, while other say that linux is just another OS.

Linux is not windows. It is not designed to work as windows and it not made for that reason. I really believe that trying to compare linux with windows is just like trying to compare apples with oranges. The're both fine but they have nothing alike.

Having said that I believe that most people disagree in things they can't really understand. They disagree about abilities between the two, when the difference is not in technology, but in philosophy.

In my case at least that is.

I really hate having people (microsoft) testing my legitimate copy of windows, with great agony, in case I might have stolen their software. I don't like stealing software, as much I hate having to prove it.

I hate having to prove my loyalty to microsoft every time I need an update. Finally I really hate software that is proprietary when that software is fundemental for the good use of my hard paid hardware (such as DVD players). There is no question about it. I won't let any-one follow me around stopping me from I what rightfully can do.

As far as your points go now, I will take the time to answer them but randomly as they come to me.

4. How do you expect proprietary movie codecs to be available to linux, when their manufactures do not support linux. WMV is microsoft's and they are not going to let it out. As for quicktime and flash ask them why the **** the do not support linux. Linux community tries to do its best as to provide what these people refuse to provide. But then you support these manufacters by formating your movies with their codecs...

1. I can't even start to remember how many times my windows froze while I was working, not due to hardware failure, but due to microsoft's incopetence to manufacture stable software. Nowdays their trying harder - I ll give them that.

7-8. How many times have you actually seen a windows live CD? I ll give you the answer. Unless you made it yourself, or some-one else made it for you, NONE.
How do you compare the maximum speed of a 52x cdrom (7 Mb/sec some can do 7.8) with your harddrive's which is at least tripple.
Have you ever tried to install windows to strained disk situation?
Have you ever wondered what happens if you have linux and you what to install windows as well? You know microsoft doesn't like competition. So what happens? You lose the ability to boot any other OS, unless you know how to recover.

People always whine about how to configure linux. Has any-one ever wondered what people who started of with linux have to say about windowses configuration?

As all things one does not know, one has to ask for advise.
When you change the menu.lst of grub you do not have to re-install grub. That is why there is a configuration file. But even if you do, when you want it to install in mbr, so it can 'see' the whole disk (/dev/hda) and not just the current partition (/dev/hda1) you use it on the disk(/dev/hda).

5. OK so you installed the module. Did you configured it? I guess not. In your windows installation did your graphics worked flawlessly out of the box? Didn't you have to install drivers? Now why these drivers are made for windows and not for linux? Is it linux fault that these drivers are proprietary? They shouldn't. They should be freely distibutable. After all you can't use them unless you have the appropriate hardware.

2-3 I can' really say anything about this since my internet connection is handled by a hardware router.

I have to say that I am not what you would call a linux geek. I have troubles solving problems as well. It's not so long ago (6 months) that I started using linux as desktop (only servers so far). I am the first to say how frustrated I am about bugs in software and thing that do not work as I'd expect. But I try to solve them. If I can't, I ask for help. And if no-one can help, I report. After all that is why ubuntu is called a community.

All the things I wrote here are not writen to pick on you. If you cannot cope with linux them just don't use it.If you prefer to pay windows and make your life easier by using barriers, by all means do that.
I use windows, because some things are yet windows territory.
I hate people saying that linux rules because it doesn't.

But keep in mind that there are several people who try to do their best to provide free software in the market, and they loose faith when they see people diminish their work, for no good reason.

[index_0@ya.com]

Alright Phasmagon u got the repiles poised on both sides.

But can u look at the basic points i try to mean,

Ubuntu Dapper has been released ,being told the best linux distro,
every person out there in the community believes in it ,but the point of intrest
is :

1.Dapper installer may not have been tested with the minimum requirements at all..

2.They didnt provide us the right "polish" as they claimed (and even prolonged the release date for) by not giving us an easy configuration utility for seting up the internet connection, hibernation progress, disk configurations and so on..

3.
Dapper did not have uniqueness to their distro , like Dapper may have unique high perfomance xserver, or easily skinnable window managers or an easy xgl configuration utility , etc,

4.
Dapper was released with a bug in the Grub installer itself , now that is not a stable product, neither a right polish .

And these are meant for Ubuntu developers , and not third party guys ...

[bbarrons]

just my opinion.
I worked with DOS when that was all I had.spent a few years working on unix (SGI irix) when it was my job. Installed and setup ALL versions of windows on any pc you can imagine.
Bought and installed Corel Linux in 99 ( I think) to find something other than windows. Since then I have installed many different Linux distros. left linux for a few years to let it mature. I then found Xandros and thought I had made it. I used that for the past year but became disatisfied with it and started to look again... I can stay married for 30 years to the same person but cant stay with an OS for too long..:-) ) After trying most of the distros out there I can honestly say that the ubuntu family has been the best.... by far..... nothing is perfect but the install has gone well on both laptop and pc. 2 very different systems, one very old and used.
I love a challenge and linux offers just that. something new everyday to look up or install or try.
There are 4 users in my household and 3 pc's..... everyone is now fighting over using ubuntu. The XP box is bigger, faster (dual proc) and plays games.....
iy wont be long before the windows box becomes dual boot.....hmmm I have another old box that could be a web/email server......I wonder if ubuntu is up for that???

[wpshooter]

Index:

I think you are trying to RUN before you are able to walk or even crawl.

First as others have suggested, you need to sort out what hardware problems you have on your system and get them fixed.

Second, I would suggest that you get yourself an older secondary computer (that does not have any other O/S on it - use a wiping utility to clear the hard drive) and play around for a while on installing and getting Ubuntu (the Dapper Drake version) configured on it, i.e. get your feet wet.

Having said that, I am NOT telling you that I think Ubuntu is to the point that I hope it will get to one day, but I believe it is making great strides towards getting there. If they will make some more inprovements in automating the process of installing software applications (i. e. get away from the terminal functions), in a few years this is going to be a whiz bang of an O/S.

But for now, have yourself one Microsoft system and one Ubuntu system - don't try mixing the two for now.

Hang in there.

[mgmiller]

I also have to say that you have/had serious hardware issues that would prevent any OS from working correctly. First get all your hardware problems sorted out and clean all the dust out of the inside of your PC case. Overheating and failed memory will cause any OS to do very weird things. Next, I agree, maybe you should try a clean install of Dapper on a "spare system", or at least a spare hard drive. You seem savvy enough to work on your hardware, try putting a spare drive in and disconnecting your windows drive, so there is no chance of it getting borked, and connecting the spare drive to the same ide connector where your windows drive was. This way you don't have to mess with your BIOS at all. Make sure the jumpers are set correctly on the new drive. Your system really should have at least 256 meg of ram (512 would be better). This is the same for windowsXP which is a slug with anything less than 512. Next, you will find your life much much easier if after the install you go to: http://easyubuntu.freecontrib.org/ and at the bottom of the page you will find the link to the install script. All you do is copy the 4 lines of text and paste them into a terminal and hit enter. Give your password when asked for and you get a beautiful GUI which will let you install all the fonts, java, flash, mp3 support, support for all codecs in the totem movie player, support in firefox for the movie player, and on the last tab, select the correct driver update for your nvidia or ati video card. This will not only download and install the driver, but will also configure it for you. You then only need to restart the gdm and xervers to have accelerated windows. But as a noobie, if you want to compare this to windows, if you installed a new video driver, it would require a restart, and that is really the easiest way to proceed here also. A simple restart, exactly like in windows and all these functions will just work. For additional support of video files, if you look in synaptic package manager for mplayer and install that, I have found that for some vidoe types I get better playback. For example it does a great job on the high definiton 720p video clips that you can download from the microsoft hd site. I have a friend with a WinXP box who can't play these files smoothly, but Dapper does them proud. This is no different than windows, where you probably use multiple players to support different file types, like real and quicktime and divx, etc. A clean install of the retail version of winXP will not play DVD movies. You have to buy software codecs or buy hardware, that may come with a dvd movie player that will add the codecs. Windows, does not have java support out of the box either, Ubuntu has a nice open source java package installed by default, but if it's not working for everything, the easy ubuntu package fixes that for you by installing the sun java support. Same with the default video drivers. With a clean install of windows XP, you have to visit many different web sites and download a bunch of drivers to get things working correctly. This is not noobie friendly. With Ubuntu, the easyubuntu package takes care of all that for you.

As far as DMA for your harddrives goes, that is set as on by default in Dapper, you should not have to mess with it. It should also set DMA on for your optical drives by default. If it does not, you probably have some other hardware issues that need to be addressed. Possibly BIOS set incorrectly, jumper settings on the drives, etc. I have found Ubuntu Breezy/Dapper to be at least as snappy, if not more so than win XP, when properly configured. I still use winXP at work and on 1 or 2 of my computers at home, but I am slowly changing them all over to Ubuntu as time goes by. The administration, care and feeding of a linux box is so much easier and care free than windows, it's like a weight lifted from my shoulders.

As far as PPPOe, I have no experience with it. I use a cable modem that uses tcp/ip. With Ubuntu, all networking and internet just work. No drivers needed. In windows, I often have to install drivers from the motherboard CD just to have networking and sound and many other functions after a clean install. Not so in Ubuntu, all hardware is detected and "just works". My experiences installing both OS's is much easier with Ubuntu, than with windows.

I am sorry for the frustration you have experienced, but if you can find it in your heart to just give it "one more try" using my suggestions, I think you will have a very different time.

Finally, I have no experience dual booting XP and Ubuntu, but I have heard there is a bug in the dapper installer for this. I am sure this will be fixed very quickly. When XP was released, there were many bugs that took months/years to fix. Many businesses would not upgrade to XP for at least 6 months because of that. I am sure there will be similar problems with the Vista release. Don't rag on Ubuntu/ Mark Shuttleworth for not testing, Microsoft is much worse in this regard. That being said, if you knew windows XP beyond the noobie or noobie+ stage, you would be able to recover your data after the problems you had.

One last thing, could you get ANYTHING LIKE this kind of user support for windows problems? It usually takes me hours to track down answers for windows problems online from a variety of sources. The Ubuntu community really cares and can help a lot.

Good luck and try to have a great day.

[srunni]

Sorry to hear about your troubles. I use Windows XP as well, and run Ubuntu through VMware Workstation for this very reason: there are a lot of problems. If you're going back to Windows for everything and you're worried about getting viruses, you just need 4 things:

1. ZoneAlarm Pro Firewall (NOT the free version)
2. Nod32 Antivirus/Scanner
3. A router (for the hardware firewall)
4. Common sense while browsing the internet

With these things you'll be fine, but think about trying Ubuntu in VMware, it's totally worth it.

[Henrypuppyhead]

I agree. Software does not cause your hardware to fail. Windows did not cause your ram to fail. If you have a bad module...then you need to replace it. Running it for a while and then stikcing in new ram makes no sense. And I'm suprised yuo got that far in ANY operating system with bad ram. I've had PCs just not install period beceause it freezes up


Also, the live cd IS NOT MEANT TO ACT AS THE MAIN DESKTOP, but a way to "try things out". It has to run everything from a) ram or b) CD. Your system, for a live CD, doesn't have a lot of ram. Infact 128megs ram is the absolute minimum for a live CD.


First get your hardware stable, THEN come complain about Ubuntu...because apparantly your problem goes deep

I have laptop that is only 5 months old. It runs very efficiently under Windows. It is hotter than hell running Ubuntu, Kubuntu, Xubuntu. Have installed and configured all power settings, hotter than hell. Have tried every power configuration only to have the computer lock up when it's been on for a while. Never have the same problem in Windows. It'll run all night and is considerably cooler. I run the laptop for any extended time with Ubuntu and the fan howls continually. I have no intention of toasting my laptop.

Works great in my desktop, sucks in my laptop. I'm not running some obscure configuration either. It's a HP with a Intel chipset.

Let's not put the carriage in front of the horse.

[adamkane]

Ubuntu is not a replacement for Windows XP. It is a free (gratis) alternative, that many people find useful and fun (and free).

Install Ubuntu on a clean system, and gradually find useful things to do with Ubuntu. It won't do everything. There are still a few things that require you to use Windows XP.

I have an Ubuntu machine for my school work and for programming, but I also have a Windows XP machine, so that my mother can edit videos, and so that I can play 3D video games.

(I only use Windows XP, because it came free with my computer. I would never pay $300 for Windows XP Pro.)

(I realize that Diva and Pitivi video editors are available, but they are not ready for prime time yet.)

[pubwho]

Well, I have to say it's a great credit to Ubuntu if all that people have to complain about is that it doesn't work on a broken computer!

I only use Windows XP, because it came free with my computer.

Windows may have come with your computer, but it certainly didn't come free with your computer. The cost of the OEM licence is part of the price you paid for your machine.

I'm like you though. I have one computer for games (XP) and one computer for everything else (Ubuntu).

[Tibor60]

I am also confused with the ubuntu 6.06, it was a mess to make it work. It simple messed up the device names and could not boot. All other systems (Knoppix, ubuntu 5.04, debian and the 6.06 text mode installer!!!) give the device name hdd5 for the booting HD, and hdex for the other HD. But the 6.06 live CD and the installed version of 6.06 give them other device names: hdh5 and hdax. And differing also the device names of cdrom and dvdrw. So the 6.06 text installer installed the system, and gave them a version of devoce names which than could not found by the booting system. It was a lot of investigating while I guessed this and corrected the /etc/fstab from the earlier version, which I have on the other HD... and now I think I should delete 6.06 because it is not good... I do not like when the device name row is changed but ok, new version. But the installer gives other then the sytem? IT IS A BIG BUG! And I am afraid that if such a serious bug can be in the installing process, than it can only worse in the full system...

[chollis888]

Well maybe I missed something but seeing as Dapper just went stable using anything prior to this would be consider testing, right? Maybe that was your problem.

As for myself, I waited for the stable release and just dist-upgraded to it. No problems here. I even installed XGL so I can do all the neat cube stuff, and still no problems, atleast none that could'nt be solved by readig the forums.

Next time you have problems, before you sling mud, check the connection between the seat and the keyboard. I've found when I have problems adjusting this (doing a little reasearch) normally fixes the problem:KS.

p.s. Try using partimage while your system works. (http://www.psychocats.net/ubuntu/partimage.html)

[JA2]

For all the users that have had hardware problems & frustration getting 6.06 installed, it would be interesting to see a list of those different system configurations.

Over the weekend, I replaced 5.10 with 6.06 on my assembled home system - with old parts I had lying about for awhile and also my Toshiba M30 laptop. I chose the path of reformatting my existing ext3 partitions (created previously with Partition Magic) on both these systems and installing Ubuntu fresh. Both these boxes dual-boot to XP for games & other stuff I haven't yet transitioned to Linux, and both are running well. I remember having an issue getting Xorg configured with the non-repository NVidia drivers, but then eventually switched to the repository drivers and all has been well since.

Some notes on my home box....

- AMD XP-1700, on cheap Biostar M7 mainboard (VIA 266MHz chipset)
- 512MB RAM
- Integrated sound, LAN
- nVidia 6200 AGP
- internal USB 7in1 card reader/floppy
- standard IDE HD (120GB)

@ Tibor60... what I/O bus types are your hard drives and CD/DVD drives (IDE/SATA/other) ? If all are IDE, I would find it strange that Dapper could not determine correctly the device names to use.

@ index_0.... it was sad to hear of your troubles with Ubuntu. Maybe you can catch the Ubuntu train on the next revision to see whether it suits you any better.

[nocloud]

yea, k/ubuntu really isn't good for newbies, if ur a newb, ur going to have a hard time doing anything other than the very basic functions....the learning curve isn't'exactly friendly...

[elamericano]

I am yet another user who had everything work on install, but I can agree with you on the following points:

1) Regardless of fault, it's easier to do proprietary formats wmv/flash on Windows.
2) The installer should warn you before wiping your MBR. And you should have the option to move grub with manual partitioning.
3) PPPOE and PPTP should have GUI programs to set them up integrated into Gnome.

Otherwise, it looks like you had not just a weak computer, but a broken one. I'd say if Dapper works on the vast majority of computers and fixes your problems with updates, then that's acceptable. To be honest, why didn't you stick with Breezy? Breezy was fantastic. If you weren't ready to stick with a new release a few weeks, then your expectations may have been too high.

As for going back to Windows, it's a tradeoff. Money (unless you already paid), security (deal-breaker IMO), maintenance (virii, malware, Windows f---ed up for no good reason - time to reinstall). Hell no!

[thero]

. For example it does a great job on the high definiton 720p video clips that you can download from the microsoft hd site. I have a friend with a WinXP box who can't play these files smoothly, but Dapper does them proud.
Files from the microsoft website are .exe, how do I view them?
microsoft website (http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowsmedia/musicandvideo/hdvideo/contentshowcase.aspx)

[nismoskys]

wow that sucks for you man.. sorry i cant offer you any help.. but i do hope you can get your problems fixed and a good running system. good luck.

[onehandwonder]

I'm "dual" booting with a 300GB harddrive with Windows XP, Gentoo x86, Ubuntu Dapper x86 (used to be 64bit but had problems with some programs), and Mandriva One. I'm 17 and I've been using Linux for a year and a half now, but I can tell you that some things, such as dual booting, take ALOT of research and learning from your mistakes to make it work. Ubuntu was definitely the easiest of the 4 OS's to set up on my computer, and the easiest to use. My only complaint about Dapper was the overwritting of the boot record, but with a few Google searches I was able to get grub to boot my other OS's (even Windows). From my experience, Ubuntu (and Linux in general) really aren't that bad with hardware compatibility, it just takes time to figure out how to get it all working, but after the first couple of times its a snap. Just be patient and in most cases you can fix those little annoying problems. Good luck to everyone thats having trouble!

[Tibor60]

@JA2: It is nothing strange in my system. There are the normal 2 IDE channels and one IDE-PCI card. The main problem I see even not for counting device names on a non-standard way, it would be not so confusing. But I definitly do not like that the text installer gives one version of device names, and the installed with this same text intaller system uses other device names. So the installed system can be booted only after editing the /boot/grub/menu.lst and /etc/fstab files from a rescue CD. I use linux for a long time already, and it was not a big deal for me. But I am not sure that a newbie will find the solution very quickly....

[bluemuffin]

this thread makes interesting reading. i've been dual booting with linux (ubuntu) for nearly a year now. it's more for fun and practice than real work since it still can't run the apps i need and is not supported by hardwares like printers, plotters, and digitizers.

i hope that someday (double hope that it would be soon) linux will finally become mainstream and be supported by all quality apps and hardwares out there. Windows is fine (even if i did have to reinstall mine twice this semester) but i'm willing to boot my paid for XP once that day arrives (I'm not buying Vista).

i hope that people will not get discouraged in using linux just becuase of a few setbacks. just think of it as growing up pains.

:)

[cwmaxson]

I've used ubuntu for 10 weeks now and love it. My problems are solvable. Things pretty much work with a little bit of help from community. It really ain't bad. It may not be the best there is, but nothing is. Besides, it's just an operating system. Pick one that works well for you and get over it.

Also, these things about ubuntu not being for noobs... blah, blah, blah, it really isn't tough to figure it all out. I thought linux was going to be far more complicated, and to my surprise, IT'S FRIGGIN' CAKE!

Oh and the hardware stuff, that sounds pretty sucky. Maybe try an abbacus?

[jgcamp99]

Wow, I can't believe some of the words in this thread.

Software doesn't make your hardware fail.

That's a joke isn't it ? poorly written code that doesn't do it's job will burn up hardware with overheating. It's critical to get a clean install of the most optimized code on any hardware.

Dual booting difficult and takes a lot of reading up on.

What is difficult about installing Microsoft first and letting the boot loaders manage that. An install not to your liking, what is so difficult about Windows Recovery and a simple fixmbr ? Partition Magic removes Linux partitions and the interface is intuitive and logical.

I'll say one thing for Linux and Ubuntu @ version 6.06, if Linux is hard @ this stage, you should have piddled around with it when it was Red Hat 5 or 6, maybe even 7.1 Seawolf. That would have been the relatively unstable Linux kernel days. I'm thoroughly delighted with Linux at this point in time. I have Windows XP and since getting Ubuntu, Windows was only booted to pave the way for it's replacement in my home. Updates for Ubuntu, not one of the 8 failed yesterday. I put 29 on an XP Dell system, 15 failed and with each subsequent retry, they continued to fail. It took me 6 attempts to finally get 29 updates on a system that is WGA authenticated. Microsoft can keep that approach.

[SirShaggy]

Wow, I am new to Linux and this forum. I had my beef a couple of weeks ago with Microsoft. I started looking around for an operating system that I could play with, tweak, without having to answer to Microsoft each time I made too many changes. I tried Linux once before and I failed it. I just didn't have the needed ability. I still don't, Linux has just became easier and better. I installed Madriva One and Ubuntu in two different systems to try them out. After a few days, all of my PC's have Ubuntu installed on them. Yes, I kept the old OS and am dual booting. Didn't know if I could make this work. In the last 3 days, I haven't booted XP once. Everything went smooth for me on three computers, One had Mandriva then Ubuntu. Both went well, IMO. I just liked the Ubuntu system so much more. In fact, I can barely keep in my seat! I am thrilled. Linux communities have made huge progress in the last 7 years! Look at all the boards. Look at all the wonderful people trying to help us noob's out. I have a lot to learn. I don't know how to do many things yet, I don't care. I am excited. I am sure I'll crash this a couple of times, don't matter to me. I crashed Windows XP 4 times, having to reload the whole OS each time, asking for Microsofts OK! My 5 year old son now has my old Laptop. I installed Edubuntu on it over the Windows OS. He is learning with me. We have managed to update and install optional software. I am sorry to those who have had troubles. Please, Keep trying. This is wonderful. What a freedom. Thank you so much to the WHOLE LINUX COMMUNITY for your efforts. Ubuntu, Right On!=D>

[runes]

Some things to do prior to installing a new OS (or old one)

BACUP BACKUP BACKUP....before any modifications to your computer whether it be a simple driver, a setting make sure you have a good backup of your documents and programs in case you have to reinstall!

Now that you have a backup here's what I would suggest:

On a sheet of paper:

Make a checklist of your hardware, including : your motherboard make, model, revision and bios version. Your cd-dvd rom make model and firmware revision, your make model of scanner, digital camera, usb camera, keyboard mouse and printer, your make model of monitor.

Next:
Go to the maufacturer of your motherboard and devices (or computer if it is a name brand such as IBM, Dell, etc.) and check if the board is compatible with the operating system you are installing.
If not, don't be discouraged! So long as you can get drivers for your hardware whether it be 3rd party drivers you should still be able to install providing as well that you have enough hard drive space and memory to boot...speaking of memory in your case you could have used MEMTEST a free memory diagnostics program to check the state of your ram PRIOR to installing the OS.

Ok since you were/are running windows...you could easily go to the maufacturer of your hard drives and download the testing software to see if your drives are failing...it will check the sectors and also use the S.M.A.R.T technology built into newer drives to tell you if there is a failure. If you should find one there will be an option to save the results to a file (on a floppy) and print so that you can RMA it (send it back to the manufacturer) for replacement if it is under warranty..they will obviously want a copy of your sales receipt so keep all receipts of what you buy.

Now if all your hardware is not failing...Flash your bios! Engineers are not psychic....they do make mistakes and they do correct them....Bios upgrades for your motherboard or name brand computer not only correct mistakes they also may add support for new operating systems, new hardware and features....bios upgrades for your cd or dvd rom drive could allow you to have better support for different brands of dvd and cd blanks as well as operating system support.

What about drivers???? You update drivers in windows for the video card and use windows updates...but linux is a bit different..did you actually go the the manufacturers web sites for your hardware and download the Debian-linux drivers for your hardware (burn them to a disc as it may be a bit of time untill you figure out mounting ntfs partitions)?

It's very easy to get angry and frustrated when something doesn't work...but you also must take responsibility to inform yourself and also take the initiative to get the tools/utilities to make things work.

From the post you made it seems that your harware already had existing problems prior to the install of linux so that shoudl have been taken care of before the installation..you also mentioned you lost your boot parametres for windows but had you backed up your work it woudl not have been so grave..also windows has a recovery console so you could have fixed that problem as well.

That being said at least maybe this message will give you a few pointers for a more successful install....also when you do get up and running use an irc client and log into #ubuntu chat they are excellent at giving support when you hit snags with Ubuntu.

[darkfibre]

I feel your pain. wpshooter's right, noobs should not try to run Linux on their primary PC. I also find it frustrating that developers, who put a lot of energy into proving polished applications, do not realise the importance of making sure that getting basic functionality is easy and well documented.

Like you I eagerly awaited Dapper's release and was overjoyed when the free CD arrived. However, I could not find out what to do with it! Ideally, it should have instructions on the cover AND a readme file which automatically opens when the CD is inserted. After spending hours online I finally figured that the CD sent to me can not be used to upgrade Breezy. I checked ShipIt and found that there was no option for ordering the upgrade CD.

Also like you, I have tried many different distributions. I have found that for a noob, getting things to work on Ubuntu took only about one fifth of the time that it would take to get other "easy to use" distros to work.

I use MPlayer and Opera and my experience has been that video and the internet works slightly better on Linux than on Windows. (Lags in Flash releases and download.cgi plugin problems are the only ones I've experienced.) Stability on Linux is tens of times better than Windows and you really can run you PC indefinately.

For the most part applications on Linux are a lot less flashy than Windows and many, many times more time-intensive to install. APT and other features used by Ubuntu have been a great jump forward in ease of use. Perhaps in the next couple of years, as developers conquer basic functionality problems, more time can be spent on making Linux accessible for non-supergeeks.

If not, we can always hope that Google brings us GOS...

[tomash_cz]

Well i stay here as a total newbie who is really hardworking to do next step forward to be less newbie than last week... it is a hard job as i am not a computer guy, proffessional or others who probably get much easier with linux.

But, I have to say, it's about love and trust in Ubuntu. A month ago,my breezy badger got messed up to the point that i was unable to fix it up (probably from my-newbie point of view). For a while I ran the windows, but could not give up with Ubuntu. I can not say exactly what keeps me always trying and believing in Ubuntu and linux as well, but i think it's all because the reasons mentioned by others above.

I tried to distro-update, but my update manager did not work. than i change the repositories and... messed up. I just decided to try Suse (naivly thinking that money makes linux more stable and friendly), I had a Live DVD of SLED 10.0. Things worked well, installation without any problem, but for the all heaven i could not set up my wi-fi. Later on, depressed and thinking how to find the lost way back to Linux, I found out that if one would like to get to the sky, s/he should start form the earth first. So i downloaded Dapper Live CD!

Ubuntu is back! I just wanna say thanks to all you guys hard working and spending your time for others like me, who can hardly evan wrote a single code. Installation was smooth, sound, wi-fi, everythings works and I am so happy, that I can continue to work on a open source OS. The most i like is a language support as I have to write chinese due to my job. In breezy i had complications, but dapper makes it really easy.

Well, I have the dualboot for the same reasons as other people do. But, if I can use Ubuntu I do not hesitate a while. Such a great, strong and willing to help community as Ubuntu is really hard to fine.

A word at the end: windows is not ubuntu, that's correct, because ubuntu is much better;) (really strong words for a newbie, right?:)

[akshaysrinivasan]

Well dapper,i believe isn't yet fully polished.i had problems with the live cd as well,the partitioner wouldn't start.then i had to resize a partition with gparted and use the free space to install. other than that ubuntu is better than windows for much of the things.

[Scythe!?]

I'm a IT technician and fix many pcs. The problems you are having is mosyl because of dodgy RAM. Windows did not corrupt your RAM, your RAM can only go faulty, no software can cause it. If you run some memory tests, you will find it will be faulty and have errors. Repalcing the RAM will fix many problems. Its surprising how many install and coping or even basic operation problems dodgy RAM can cause to fail.

[patrickfromspain]

I don't see your point at all. You scream out about a wide range of things, but finally, only the pppoe thing is a matter.

You blame about flash 8 (why don't go to cry to macromedia or adobe?), your installed nvidia drivers (did you bother changing nv to nvidia in xorg.conf? Or asking for help?), you shout out because ubuntu hanged (are you crazy? you had a faulty ram module...), you wanted to run the live installer with 128mb (192mb MINIMUM needed) and finally you come and say about movies, rar and **** like this: FOSS, you know what that is? By the way, enabling some repos and sudo apt-get install rar would have done the trick.

Ubuntu is not difficult at all if you want to learn. You wanted to go the Windows-user way. So, good luck. We don't need people like you in the FOSS comunity.

[mgmiller]

duplicate post sorry

[mgmiller]

duplicate post sorry

[mgmiller]

Quote:
"For example it does a great job on the high definiton 720p video clips that you can download from the microsoft hd site. I have a friend with a WinXP box who can't play these files smoothly, but Dapper does them proud."

Question:
Files from the microsoft website are .exe, how do I view them?


Answer:
I installed wine and the .exe from microsoft extracts the .wmv file to the .wine directory. It will place them in ~/.wine/drive_c/wmdownloads Then just click to play. (mplayer is smoother than totem for this). Having wine installed is handy for other things too, like updating my NUVI which has a windows only update file. It runs in wine and allows me to copy the update to an SD card which is inserted before starting the NUVI, it sees the update and installs it from there.

Off topic for a bit:
(Just to add some extra use to this post I will add a few lines for forum search purposes)
update nuvi
update nuvi dapper
updating nuvi

Further details for updating a Nuvi with wine in dapper. Upon running the downloaded installer file, the application will fail to detect your NUVI. That's ok, just exit the program. It has exracted all the files to, for example. /home/marty/.wine/drive_c/Garmin
Within this directory you will find a directory with the name of the update, for example, nuvi350_360. Within that directory you will find some files and another directory named nuvi. Within that directory is a directory named Garmin. This is the directory that you copy to the SD card. Copy the entire directory, not just the files within it. The SD card does not have to be blank, it can have other stuff on it. Insert the card into the NUVI and start the NUVI. After a bit it will detect the new update and ask if you want to upgrade. That's it. Depending on how old your firmware was, you may want to back up your waypoints.gpx file before doing the upgrade or they may be erased. After the upgrade, just copy it back where it came from. If you already had software revision 330 on your NUVI, this step is not needed.

Back on topic:
I am not using the wine from the dapper repos. I am using the winehq repos.

Just add these to your /etc/apt/sources.list (after backing it up of course.
sudo cp /etc/apt/sources.list sources.backup

Then use sudo gedit /etc/apt/sources.list

and add the following 3 lines:

## The wine sources
deb http://wine.budgetdedicated.com/apt dapper main
deb-src http://wine.budgetdedicated.com/apt dapper main

Save the file in gedit.

More info on adding wine sources to ubuntu can be found here: http://www.winehq.com/site/download-deb


Using the GUI, just run syaptic package manager and tell it to reload (you may have to do this twice), then search for wine.

Yes, I know it's quicker from CLI, but this is the noob friendly way to do it.

Oh yeah, one other quick tip, navigate to the ~/.wine/drive_c directory in nautilus and then click bookmarks > add bookmark. This will put a quick way to get to the drive_c in your Places menu.

One finaL thought. ~ refers to your home directory, so in my system the actual path would be /home/marty/.wine change yours accordingly.
.wine like all directories in linux that start with . is a hidden directory.
In order to see your hidden directories in nautilus hit ctrl h, when you're done hit ctrl h again to rehide them.

Sorry for all the probably obvious stuff, but I wanted to make this as noob friendly as possible.

Good luck.

[jimhaddon]

Im sorry, but for me, ubuntu just totally sucks. I respect the people who made it totally, giving up their spare time etc, but for me, it just does not work.

My major problem with ubuntu is the reliability. I've had it installed for about 6 months now, and in that time, i have had to do at least 12 fresh installs of it, for one reason or another. the last straw came when today, all was running fine, when i set up a samba share for my other windows boxes from the ubuntu machine, re-booted, and ubuntu would not boot. I have sat here for 2 hours trying to fix it. iv trauled through the forums, googled, and not one site can help. I never had this trouble with windows. When ubuntu's reliabilty has improved, maybe i will try this software again, for but now, im moving back to tried and tested.

FYI, usually when i boot ubuntu, i do this from a floppy that has GRUB installed on it. After i'd rebooted, all i get at the boot is 'GRUB'. Nothing else. Absolutely NO idea why it started doing it. Iv seached for how to re-install GRUB on a floppy, but every tutorial I have followed just does not work. I never ever had that trouble with windows, and I dont see why i should have to keep doing this with ubuntu!

[rfruth]

Let us know how the Vista thing works out :confused:

[thomasa93]

Well, I have have Ubunutu for several months and the only problem I have had is when the updates broke the X Server.

[vblanton]

I'm sorry to hear it jimhaddon,

ubuntu and kubuntu have never failed for me with samba, nor have I ever had to reinstall them in the last year I've been using them. BTW, why do you use a floppy disc for GRUB? why not just install it on the MBR and have it give windows as an option in the list? That is what my friends and I do. Well, good luck. Perhaps your issues will be solved *automagically* in ubuntu 6.10 (coming out in less than a month). Do give it a try if your not completely annoyed out of your skull. Also, I don't really use gnome much at all, but most of the SAMBA work i've had to do I've done in KDE and it *just worked*. why not try kubuntu? you can install it by typing "sudo apt-get install kubuntu-dekstop" in a terminal and then picking KDE from the login screen. Just note that all of the apps from ubuntu will be littered in the KDE/Kubuntu menu, and visa-versa.

good luck

[aysiu]

Im sorry, but for me, ubuntu just totally sucks. I respect the people who made it totally, giving up their spare time etc, but for me, it just does not work. Why can't we get more posts like this?

Notice the phrase but for me? Shows some perspective.

Sorry it didn't work out for you, jimhaddon.

[mssever]

Perhaps if you had asked more questions here, you would have had a better experience. 99% of problems are fixable, and I've never reinstalled in eight years of using Linux. I think that it's quite possible that your boot floppy is going bad. Floppies are terribly unreliable.

[jimhaddon]

Thanks very much for your replies so far. With respect to KDE. I have tried Kubuntu already. It did not install on its own due to a problem with ATI graphics drivers. I had a VERY long process to go through to fix that problem, and when it had installed, the next week, it failed, so again a full install was required.

With respect to the floppy. The reason I have to use a floppy, is because I am triple booting XP, Vista and Ubuntu. Ubuntu's Grub will not pick up vista which is why I have Vista's menu on the MBR, and GRUB on floppy.

In life im just a very unlucky person, so maybe im just really unlucky with ubuntu, I dont know, but for me, it just isnt worth this tremendous amount of hassle. Imagine having to do a fresh install twice a month. I may as well just be using the LiveCD!

[prizrak]

That sux :( Some people just have an OS curse. I for one cannot for the life of me get Gentoo to work. Try out Edgy maybe it'll be better. Maybe a different distribution would work, well w/e you go for I hope it works out well for you :)

[flargen]

Ubuntu's Grub will not pick up vista which is why I have Vista's menu on the MBR, and GRUB on floppy.
This works fine for me! You set it up exactly the same as if for XP (I think).

This was automatically added to /boot/grub/menu.lst:
title Windows Vista/Longhorn (loader)
root (hd0,0)
savedefault
makeactive
chainloader +1

[jimhaddon]

I have tried many different distros of linux, and ubuntu (believe it or not) has so far been the most reliable of the lot. Some of you may think well it has to be his hardware that is the problem. I can assure you this is not the case. Windows works absolutely fine, and I know this PC inside out as I built it myself.

What would probably be most useful at this point, and something that may just give ubuntu one last chance for me, is a way of restoring my current installation of ubuntu without yet another fresh install.

How would I re-install GRUB to a floppy, instructing it my installation's root is /dev/sda5?

I have tried many tutorials, most based on the fact that I have to copy stage1 and stage2 from /boot/grub which are for some reason not in there when i boot from LiveCD

[graigsmith]

I think that it's quite possible that your boot floppy is going bad. Floppies are terribly unreliable.

this is true. i usually only got 1-2 uses out of a floppy before the dust got to it and it started having bad sectors. this is the reason people don't use floppys anymore. floppies totally suck.

edit, if you had installed grub on the hard drive, you would have had much better luck.

[Jorge]

I really, really hope you get to read this. I am sorry to hear you are leaving, but I wish you the best of lucks.

I will not try to convert you to Ubuntu or to invite you back, this is just my experience, and I want to share it with you.

From some time now I was looking for an alternative to Windows and I always felt fascinated for the free software movement. The idea of open, non restrictive, non private owned software for the human kind was just too appealing for me. But, unfortunately, it was an idea I wouldn't ever be able to become real. Every time I tried a Linux distribution I was disappointed, I just could not work. Too much effort, too few results.

Until now. I wiped out windows from my laptop, as Ubuntu is much more stable and makes me more productive. And is fun! Although, my story with Ubuntu was not always a happy fairy tell. I started with Hoary (4.10), and uninstalled it, just like you. Then I tried with Warthy, and some time later I dropped it too. But since Dapper I have a fully functional machine: fast, reliable, with suspend to ram, wifi, pcmcia card reader, etc.

At the end my message is: stay close to Ubuntu. Give every new version a try, and remember why you wanted to switch in the first place. Among other things Ubuntu is great because of the amazingly active and open community interacting in the forums, and the commitment of its developers.

I wish to say thanks to them. And to you: please be back soon. ;)

(Sorry if I misspelled something. English is not my native tongue.)

[thunderduck3141]

im surprised at your lack of commitment or at least effort
breaking away from the norm has its downsides, but at least im not supplying the Legion of the Damned, i mean Microsoft, with money

[legomax]

but at least im not supplying the Legion of the Damned, i mean Microsoft, with money

WAIT! windows cost money? i built my cp, and i installed windows, but i dont remember every buying it.... are you sure it costs money???

[TheRingmaster]

WAIT! windows cost money? i built my cp, and i installed windows, but i dont remember every buying it.... are you sure it costs money???
Installing windows without buying it is illegal.

[croak77]

im surprised at your lack of commitment or at least effort


6 months of using Ubuntu isn't effort? :-k

[mozetti]

+1 to the bad grub floppy idea. If you're not getting a GRUB menu, then it's your bootloader that is the problem, not the OS.

[ago]

Jimhaddon,

You say you have had lots of problems, which is fine, you wrote 10 posts in all, 10/10 about how Ubuntu sucks, 0/10 about specific requests for help...

Maybe your CD was not burnt correctly (sometimes media is defective and/or high speed burns create a defective CD that will freeze). You made your life more complicated than necessary by insisting on booting from a floppy, when there is no need for it, since Grub can handle dual boot with Windows (the opposite is not true). Maybe your floppy is crap, or maybe you screwed up the parameters in your floppy and you got kernel panic (if you bork it up, do not complain). You tried Ubuntu on a VM, Microsoft VM... If you want to try a VM stick to VMWare player and use the Ubuntu image specifically designed for VMWare (http://isv-image.ubuntu.com/vmware/ ). And keep in mind that ubuntu is NOT guaranteed to work on all hardware, if it does not work properly with the LiveCD, simply try it on another machine but do NOT try to "make it work" on your unsupported hardware. Most hardware is compatible but some is not, you want to judge it when working on supported hardware or it would be like spitting on Windows beacuse it does not boot from a sparc machine... On the right hardware (which is not so difficult to come by), Ubuntu is by far one of the most stable systems around, it makes circles around windows...

It is possible to help you out, but if you do not ask it is difficult to be more specific, it seems to me you are more interested in complaining rather than fixing your problems...

[kuja]

I have tried many different distros of linux, and ubuntu (believe it or not) has so far been the most reliable of the lot. Some of you may think well it has to be his hardware that is the problem. I can assure you this is not the case. Windows works absolutely fine, and I know this PC inside out as I built it myself.

What would probably be most useful at this point, and something that may just give ubuntu one last chance for me, is a way of restoring my current installation of ubuntu without yet another fresh install.

How would I re-install GRUB to a floppy, instructing it my installation's root is /dev/sda5?

I have tried many tutorials, most based on the fact that I have to copy stage1 and stage2 from /boot/grub which are for some reason not in there when i boot from LiveCD

I hope you get to read this, if you feel like being curious anyhow:

1) You say that the files aren't there when you're running the livecd right? Well, you'll need to mount your linux partition first, navigate to its boot directory and copy the files from there, they *should* be there, though I doubt they would be in the live cd's boot directory.

2) As for your samba problem, it sounds really weird. In that scenario, maybe reinstalling samba would help - sudo apt-get remove --purge samba && sudo apt-get install samba

[tenn]

LOL it sounds like you are blaming Ubuntu because you cant set up a triple boot system correctly.
"My major problem with ubuntu is the reliability" This just highlights how little you know about the OS.

[idarco]

Windows has a tendency to install it's own boot manager over ubuntu's when you install it. It's actually Windows that's the source of your problems here. Believe me, I know from experience too. Installing Windows first, then Ubuntu yields much better results.

[jimhaddon]

First of all, when i installed ubuntu, it was over windows, so that is not the problem. Second, my problem with ubuntu THIS time is with grub, but have had MANY problems before with graphics drivers, sound drivers, USB drivers, all causing ubuntu to b0rk.

If you can see it from my perspective, I have tried my best to get ubuntu and other linux distros to work on this machine, and on others and have failed to do so. Maybe it is my lack of technical skills but one thing is for sure, i have had zero problems with windows.

Third... With respect to this problem with grub. I have already mounted my linux partition and tried to copy the boot files from there, but they do not exist. I have also downloaded GAG, the graphical boot loader, which ALSO failed to boot my linux installation. Is there anything else I can try without yet again a fresh install, which this time, I am just not prepared to do. Id like to see if I can fix this problem, as maybe it might help me with similar problems in the future, and maybe others that may be put off by linux's reliabilty, if it is acting the way it is with me.

I know you all say linux runs rings round windows, and that it is so stable yadda yadda, but in my case, this just totally has not been the case.

It is also not the case that it is the cd that is burned wrong. I burned two seperate CD's from two sperately downloaded images. Also i ordered a ubuntu cd through the post and neither one stops me from having to fresh install often

[kuja]

The fresh installing is likely the only thing that might be a result of technical inexperience. The rest of the things sound like problems if I've ever heard of them. Assuming that GRUB is actually installed, you can additionally find copies of those files in /lib/grub.

[dannyboy79]

I have already mounted my linux partition and tried to copy the boot files from there, but they do not exist.
Sounds to me like this is the problem. You somehow erased your boot records! It's not grubs or ubuntus fault that you erased your boot records. They don't just disppear on their own? If you for sure were able to mount your sda3 parition and look with in the /boot direcotry and they aren't there than I would say they're gone! It's to bad you never used Ubuntu IRC channel. I have had over 6 different things solved for my old Pentium MMX 266mhz with 128mb ram. I run Xubuntu on it and the IRC channel has helped me tons! Oh, i use xchat. sudo aptitude install xchat! :-)

[jimhaddon]

I did NOT remove boot files, im not that stupid. ALL i did was to rename the share names on of the folders in samba, rebooted, and thats it, gone!

[kuja]

The easiest way to get grub fixed is probably a reinstall, it's possible to do it without a reinstall, but it's more complicated and leaves room for possibly destructive error if a mistake is made. I recommend reinstalling with the Alternate cd, which should allow you to create a grub floppy as part of the installation process. It's a bit slower than installing with the live cd, and not as pretty, but it should work for your special case.

The alternative is running the live cd, installing dchroot from the universe repository, chrooting into the filesystem, mounting /dev, /sys, and /proc, reinstalling grub, and then creating the boot floppy. I call this method the hard way.

[xpod]

Well i too am real sorry to hear of someone deciding after 4 post`s its not for them.
Asking about what you dont know or cant find out about on here usually solves allsorts of issues.
Some folks just mabey cant believe their years of computer experience is`nt enough to solve some minor issue so then decide the OS is not for them and their going back to windows
I too have re-installed mabey 5 times in my 3 months so far on this machine and no doubt will have to again at some point.I dont believe if you`ve used it for so long that your present problen could not possibly be overcome......WITH a little help.
I dont have years of any OS experience but in my 7 months on a pc so far ive managed to overcome ALL issues myself OR.......by asking for a little help from all the good folks on here .....my few months of windows and "them" forums just were`nt the same:confused: ...Ubunto is the simple choice IMHO

Good luck regardless

[jimhaddon]

I eventually decided to do a fresh install once more. I have installed it to the same partition but formatted it first. I have also installed GRUB to the MBR, not that it will make any difference, it will fail eventually.

I now have more hours of re-configuring x-server to work with my gfx card.

[ago]

jimhaddon,

Boot from Live CD, and execute the following, replacing XXX with the partition where ubuntu was installed (something like hda2)

sudo mkdir /media/ubuntu
sudo mount /dev/XXX /media/ubuntu
sudo chroot /media/ubuntu /bin/bash

This should bring you to your hard-disk installation, now within the hd installation run

sudo mount -t proc none /proc
sudo mount -t sysfs none /sys
cat /proc/mounts >/etc/mtab


Now you can check if everything is missing, install files, look for boot files, reinstall kernel, run grub-install (grub-install /dev/hda)...

[John.Michael.Kane]

jimhaddon try to have some faith in the members here who are trying to help you.

One would be surprised at what the some of the members have been known to help a user fix while in the process helping them learn a little something.

If you have to take a break from the machine then come back.

[jimhaddon]

I have ubuntu running again now after a fresh install. I have installed samba and shared the folder, but now, my other windows PC's cannot see that folder! Ubuntu is useless!

[kuja]

Ubuntu is far from useless! Samba just has different defaults in Linux than it's Windows counterpart. In addition to setting the folder shared, you need to configure samba to use the security level "share", and you'll also likely want to set the shared folder to "public". Those were among the changes I had to make, but I had it up and going is after a couple of minutes. I can't explain the exact procedure to you because I'm more of a KDE type of guy. Oh, and after every samba configuration change, you need to restart the samba server. This can be done without a reboot:

sudo /etc/init.d/samba restart

[jimhaddon]

but wher are the samba settings?!

[kuja]

I can't really answer that for GNOME, though, in KDE there's a KControl module for configuring it. Hopefully someone who knows GNOME a bit better will be able to tell you. Perhaps you should start a thread on it? If you don't mind tinkering around editing it by hand (not a good idea if you don't know what you're doing), the samba configuration file is /etc/samba/smb.conf.

[jimhaddon]

all this crap just to share a folder? no thankyou!

[kuja]

All what crap?

[mssever]

but wher are the samba settings?!

Have you tried System > Administration > Shared Folders? Make sure that you hit the General Windows sharing settings button on the add share dialog and set the same workgroup as your Windows computers. Or, just edit /etc/samba/smb.conf directly.

[jimhaddon]

Yes, I have already done that. Makes no difference

[chaosgeisterchen]

Why can't we get more posts like this?

Notice the phrase but for me? Shows some perspective.

Sorry it didn't work out for you, jimhaddon.

I can second that. Problems will ever occur, but to damn the OS upon that for being the main factor of fault.. well, it's easy but it would not be a bit fair towards the people spending their time to improve Ubuntu.

Hope you get it working again - I killed my Kubuntu installation several times now, but it was all my fault. User interference on root level can often affect a *nix system I am afraid.

[lapsey]

I have ubuntu running again now after a fresh install. I have installed samba and shared the folder, but now, my other windows PC's cannot see that folder! Ubuntu is useless!

Windows XP in particular has a problem with samba. In windows, when you view the network shares, XP shows the computer but not any shares. Although I *think* this might just be a matter of putting 'browseable=yes' in the share config in smb.conf. That option is supposed to allow browsing of that share

So, enter the path manually instead: if the share name is 'ted', go to \\computer\ted (or however they write it in windows)

samba can be a problem for many many people regardless of operating system.

man that ubuntu, why doesnt it do anything properly!!!

[LMP900]

Sorry to hear that Ubuntu hasn't worked out for you, jimhaddon. If it doesn't fit your needs, then what can you really do, right?

But I have a feeling that you'll come back to the Ubuntu community in the future. ;)

[maniacmusician]

i'm glad that you gave it a fair and honest try jim, but it doesn't seem like you asked for help a lot. I can understand that you had a lot of troubles, but no one makes it alone. if you had asked, someone could probably have told you an easier/faster way to accomplish things.

[Compucore]

JIm I can only say this it was a learning experience for you. If it didn't work out for you it didn't I mean even for me I had to reload on serveral ocassions jus to get things right on my second dell. And tweak the snots out of an old Aptiva with a different version of Ubuntu to make things work out. (In this case on my Aptiva its Xubuntu.) Everything is fine. We all learn thigns like this. Myself I try and keep mental notes on thinsgs like this. Not to toot my own horn either. The longest time for my ubuntu systems over ehre were like 6+ months after tweaking them both. WHich is good on any system installed an how it is configured as wel. We all don't have the same home configuration at home for our ubuntu systems. So its a great learning experience.

Compucore.

[Koori23]

I'm sorry that guy had major frustrations with Ubuntu. I guess this is sort of like my experience with my BMW 318.. All I heard was "Great car, reliable" .. Uh-huh.. right.. I'm back to my 97 Honda Civic.. It's got some miles on her but she's still a trooper, a torqueless trooper but still..

I guess my experience with Ubuntu has been quite pleasant, to think the only reason I installed it was because it picked up my network settings without me trying to dig up my Comcast CD to get Windows XP to hit the Internet.. I never looked back since. After hearing all this.. I guess I was lucky..Or just too ignorant to figure things out for myself.. I was always asking stupid questions on this forum.. Ya know what though? I always got a warm welcome and the correct answer. I guess we're just one big transatlantic family connected not by blood but by modems and keyboards.. Go figure that one out.. I sure as hell can't.

[Denn1s]

so you ruined ur boot files and you are "switching" back?
your way of booting is quite weird, all you should have done was instal windows (not recomended) then ubuntu and linux will take care of makin your booting simple, wath does samba has to do with that?

[jimhaddon]

Samba has nothing to do with the boot, thats why its so stupid! all i did was to make a share on samba, and from then on, my ubuntu loads no more.

[dannyboy79]

Samba has nothing to do with the boot, thats why its so stupid! all i did was to make a share on samba, and from then on, my ubuntu loads no more.

the samba issue and your bott records missing are not related. When you add a samba share it doesn't erase any file so you can stop thinking that samba was the reason your box won't boot.

[maniacmusician]

jim: with all due respect, that is impossible. you either changed something and didn't note it down, or did something else that inadvertently changed some setting.

on the other hand, you are booting from a floppy, so you can't expect much in the first place. there are guides around here for triple booting with xp, vista, and ubuntu, using grub on the hard drive.

If you do decide to take another stab at ubuntu, please ask more questions this time around. Sometimes it feels like "hand-holding", but that's the best way to get through the first successful installation. Believe me, if you post, and we can help, we will.

[nikosft]

I think that if there was a restore option, to repair the system and revert it back to a previous state, people like Jim wouldn't abandon Ubuntu - and linux general. When you have to configure your system using commnds, which sometimes you don't even know what do they do, it is likely that you will damage something.I think this is one major feature Ubuntu lacks of.

[kazuya]

guys here tried to help, but I can tell, this poor fella had a heck of a time getting this to work. This is unfortunate that he could not accomplish his goal to successfully triple boot while using SAMBA. I have to applaude him for his efforts in trying to get going. But in the future, it would be wise to use the forum more. Sometimes, though in his defense, he may not get speedy resolution to his issue.

I always refer to the Ubuntu wiki. Do a search., etc..

We may need guides for this in the future.

Also reported outputs make a difference. Like when he mentions, it would not boot, what does not boot? What shows at the screen.
>grub error?

This is one case Ubuntu has issues versus a distro like mepis where it is very easy to repair grub upon corruption. Perhaps, in future Ubuntu, there would be an option to reinstall grub on MBR or other location..

Keep up the great work guys.


I respect his intention, but I said something like he is saying two years ago, but here I am finally back and happy I stayed the course. Upon being able to solve this issue, your knowledge propells even further..

I wish I had some issues like these, it would make me more proficient in troubleshooting as there are willing teachers on this forum. Now I can trouble shoot my friends window boxes somewhat. But this platform and the community allow it users to develop their skillsets if they so choose.

I have asked some really dumb questions, and I always get help most times. The dumb question you ask is the one you do not ask, because others may have similar questions.

I think it is good practice to do a search in the forum with keywords pertaining to your problem. I have solved many issues that way, but most by simply posting on here.

I marvel at the efforts of these people here. It is such a wonderful movement. Not just Ubuntu guys, but all other linux forums.. Guys just willing to volunteer their time to help others like me. And yet we still begrudge their efforts..

I am sure I speak for others when I say thank you guys. I also thank Jim for this post as his complaint would somehow lead to better ways to minimize and resolve this and future issues. He is one of the folks that indirectly give rise to some crazy sort of innovation or better development..

Just be patient with the folks here sometimes.. Take care all.

[jimhaddon]

Ok, so you're all asking me to ask a question instead of just sayin its crap. Here is my question. I now have ubuntu up and running with samba. How the hell do i get it to show on a windows box. I have set browsing in samba settings to 1, and i have also just tried the domain/folder address i windows instead of browsing, and it STILL doesnt work!

[sonny]

FYI, usually when i boot ubuntu, i do this from a floppy that has GRUB installed on it. After i'd rebooted, all i get at the boot is 'GRUB'. Nothing else. Absolutely NO idea why it started doing it. Iv seached for how to re-install GRUB on a floppy, but every tutorial I have followed just does not work. I never ever had that trouble with windows, and I dont see why i should have to keep doing this with ubuntu!
Why do you have grub on a floppy?, have you had the windows boot on a floppy too? That's just dumb.

[jimhaddon]

ok, now I have it sharing, but now, its asking me for a password that I dont have!

[sonny]

Ok, so you're all asking me to ask a question instead of just sayin its crap. Here is my question. I now have ubuntu up and running with samba. How the hell do i get it to show on a windows box. I have set browsing in samba settings to 1, and i have also just tried the domain/folder address i windows instead of browsing, and it STILL doesnt work!
I think you'll find your answer here: http://ubuntuguide.org/wiki/Dapper#Samba_Server

[sonny]

ok, now I have it sharing, but now, its asking me for a password that I dont have!
It's because in Linux samba needs a user, you have to create a system user then add it to the samba user list, go to the webpage in my previous post, that'll clarify everything for you.

Users in samba are usefull, for example all my unversity friends have acces to my school documents folder, but can't see my music, family photos, downloaded stuff, my mom can see my family photos folder, my dad only has access to my music folder, a friend of mine has access to music and downloaded stuf (we share things, and from my laptop I can access everything.

[.t.]

I'm sorry for the post that was here. I understand that it was unacceptable. I'm not going to try and explain why I posted it. ](*,) It's good to see that the mods do such a good job!

[xpod]

Glad to see your still at it mate......if you really believed it was crap you would`nt have stuck at it this long im sure;)
Im quite sure the answers you need are there somewhere and you`ll soon be feeling like the "plank" i do everytime i realise how simple something actually was .....once ive been pointed in the right direction:-k

I dont even know what samba is other than what ive gathered from here but do you really need it right now???

Do what i do\did with stuff i found too complicated....leave it,get to know the os a bit more then come back to it in a week or two once you`ve got a better grasp of things???

The "step back" can do the world of good.....It`s so easy to get wrapped up in one issue and become blind to what really needs done..

Just how i see it after my mere months on one of these things pal

Good luck..Dont give up on it just cause you cant share windows....;)

[jimhaddon]

look mate, iv really done my best to try and get this working. Ubuntu as i know, is meant to be easy to use? I've been trying for two weeks JUST to share a folder with windows. If windows behaved this way, no-one would ever buy it!

[xpod]

None of our 3 pc`s are conected and i would`nt know where to start....yet,but if i desparately need something from the windows one i stick it on a cd and bingo......its shared as soon as i stick it on here

Sounds like an important file for ubunto to be so bad:confused:

EDIT:have you tried running sfc /scannow without an xp cd........it took me weeks to learn how to suss out re-directing the bloody thing to look up it`s own a**e for the missing or corrupt dll`s etc instead of requesting a poxy cd i did`nt have....
That did`nt make xp crap........just meant I was a plank

[Lopsicle]

If windows behaved this way, no-one would ever buy it!

If only that where true :mrgreen:

[jimhaddon]

iv got it. ix finally fixed it. wow that was a long slog. Problems were:

Folders NOT set as browsable in samba
No usersin samba

[xpod]

PLANK!!!!!:mrgreen:

EDIT welcome to the ubunto club AND my own personal "plank" club

EDIT....try "beryl"..its great:twisted:

[cunawarit]

look mate, iv really done my best to try and get this working. Ubuntu as i know, is meant to be easy to use? I've been trying for two weeks JUST to share a folder with windows. If windows behaved this way, no-one would ever buy it!

Let's be fair here.

I take your point that some things in Linux can be very obscure when compared to Windows where most settings are right there in front of you, and quite often all you need is a little bit of exploration to figure things out.

But Windows also has issues, for every seamless install where everything works just as the user intended there is another where the user has to figure out what hardware so he can go online to hunt for the right drivers.

Also Samba is very popular, I have no experience setting it up, but I'm not inclined to believe that it is as unreliable and obscure as you think. Try reading up on it some more.

[jimhaddon]

I totally understand your frustrations but im just trying to look at this from the perspective of a dumbass end user. IF i had been one, i would never even think of doing this, going into config files and editing.

[pelle.k]

GAG!
http://gag.sourceforge.net/ > download gag46.zip > burn iso > boot cd > have fun!
(this way, install grub to boot partition, and let gag take care of booting the partition for ya! if mbr becomes overwritten, then you will always have GAG on cd to put it in mbr again...)

Oh! and if you decide to leave ubuntu - welcome back! :D

[ago]

iv got it. ix finally fixed it. wow that was a long slog. Problems were:

Folders NOT set as browsable in samba
No usersin samba

That had been suggested as soon as you mentioned your problem...

http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=1610493&postcount=40

By the way, samba is much more than a tool for "sharing" folders. It is an enterprise level file/printer/authentication/domain server. The equivalent of Windows Server...

[Bobajot]

It is an enterprise level file/printer/authentication/domain server. The equivalent of Windows Server...

Now you are making me nervous I know all about the reliability of dem enterprise windows servers!

[cunawarit]

Now you are making me nervous I know all about the reliability of dem enterprise windows servers!

Let's be fair here, this time from the other side.

If you knew all about it, you'd know that Windows 2003 Server is a very stable OS. My experience with it is using it as a Web server. Setting up a Web farm isn't complicated and its easy to achieve 100% uptime. I simply have never seen a 2003 machine crash, ever... Even the one at work that is basically a dumping ground for whatever random development project comes along.

[Bobajot]

Let me put it simply the Windows servers got rebooted every day the Unix ones stayed up for months. Oh and it wasn't done for fun they just couldn't handle volume. That's a couple of years ago but I doubt if much has changed - I retired on health grounds but on the bright side it wasn't Windows that caused it:p .

[jimhaddon]

GAG!
http://gag.sourceforge.net/ > download gag46.zip > burn iso > boot cd > have fun!
(this way, install grub to boot partition, and let gag take care of booting the partition for ya! if mbr becomes overwritten, then you will always have GAG on cd to put it in mbr again...)

Oh! and if you decide to leave ubuntu - welcome back! :D

If you read my previous posts, you will see that I already tried GAG and it didnt work.

[cunawarit]

Let me put it simply the Windows servers got rebooted every day the Unix ones stayed up for months.

If they couldn't handle the volume rebooting them was only a temporary solution.

Were you running a server farm? Did you not contemplate more machines? Or a change of OS if you were doing exactly the same task with the Unix server. If the Unix servers were able to handle the same load for the same task, why were you not using Unix for everything? I find it a bit shocking that a company is able to put up with server that need to be rebooted every day and they don't either get more servers, try to optimize what they have, or change to Unix since they already know that they are able to run those without needing the reboots. I think our jobs would be on the line if critical servers needed rebooting every day!!!

In two years since I have been working with Windows 2003 I've never had any such problems. Nor of the people I know who run Windows 2003 Servers and are able to guarantee uptime.

PS: The worst problem we have had with 2003 was on one machine (all on its own, not in a farm saddly) that IIS would periodicly every 2 days or so just stop replying to requests. To get it to work again you needed to do an iisreset... I ended up writing a program that ran in another server that sent requests periodicly to that machine, then another program on the troubled server that would listen that program and it would run iisreset when it told it... It worked till we were able to get someone to take a look at the machine and fix the problem.

[hellmet]

this is true. i usually only got 1-2 uses out of a floppy before the dust got to it and it started having bad sectors. this is the reason people don't use floppys anymore. floppies totally suck.

edit, if you had installed grub on the hard drive, you would have had much better luck.
its there in the very name..
FLOPpy

[Bobajot]

Last I heard there was at least 80 of the things all getting volume related issues if they stayed up without reboot. Planned outage especially on a worldwide regional basis is easy to live with when its unplanned and in somebody's prime time things get a tad more uncomfortable and since its volume it happens mostly whilst they are working on line. There was some web stuff but mostly intranet.

The decision to use Windows was not based on operating considerations; excellent Unix solutions existed and were in use but somebody wanted to get in bed with MS. I ain't at liberty to talk much about it least not on a message board if I said it was FUBAR and then some gives you some idea.

[mozetti]

I totally understand your frustrations but im just trying to look at this from the perspective of a dumbass end user. IF i had been one, i would never even think of doing this, going into config files and editing.

Well, if you had read the instructions for SAMBA and/or the HOW-TO posted here, then you would have known you need to do this.

[factotum218]

12 reinstalls, useless, not the same as windows...
Sounds like me back when I first tried Redhat about 10 years ago.

[Ambimom]

Just want to say that after my horrible experience with the installation of Edgy, I have returned to Windows XP. Not only did the upgrade take 12 hours to download; it was broken when it arrived and it took me several more hours to fix the installation. That was only the beginning. Everything that worked on Dapper, no longer worked. My printer, my webcam, Firefox, et.al. were recognized, but none of them were operating. Opera browser could get onto the Internet, but flash no longer worked because of the upgrade; and Firefox just crashed everytime it opened.

I tried to reinstall Dapper, but all it did was repartition the partition so I had two different Linux versions installed. And to add insult to injury the Dapper wouldn't boot because it didn't have enough room.

Thankfully I have Norton Ghost and Partition Magic; though I still needed to restore the master boot record directly from Windows.

I may reinstall Dapper at some later date, but for the time being, I just want something that works!

Good luck everyone. I guess the answer is that Ubuntu Dapper is ready for some, but Edgy isn't ready period. Nothing should be so buggy.

[Synikk]

I'm still on 6.06. After reading about how buggy 6.10 is for some people, I'm putting off installing it for a while. And when I do install it, I'm going to do a clean install. You might have better luck that way. Sometimes upgrades cause bugs.

[MemoryDump]

I never perform upgrades.. going with fresh installs is always the best way.

[Stereotypical Rage]

Edgy was a nightmare for me too, but I won't be leaving anytime soon because I'm not a quitter and the only way for me to learn is if something breaks. I am sticking with Ubuntu because I hate crap and that's what XP and Vista are UTTER TRASH.

My story is as follows....

Downloaded Edgy, burned it and all. Went to install it, loved the new menu options before install. Tried to install it and at the USplash screen it froze. Rebooted and tried again, this time I got to logon screen and it froze. So I decided to try it on Safe Graphics mode, that got me farther, but it froze with 22% I believe. Wanted to try 1 more time.... That failed too. At that time Dapper was already gone. So after about 3 hrs. I frantically looked around for a Dapper CD. None found. I did find a Breezy one. Installed it. Tried a dist-upgrade and that failed due to initramfs-tools. So I searched my room some more, then I found my Dapper DVD from Linux Pro Magazine out of England. Installed Dapper again. Then I did a dist-upgrade from my Edgy CD that I burned. SUCCESS! Aside from it still freezes at logon. I have to boot to Recovery mode and it's fine. The problem is with ACPI or something. I need to get around to filing that bug as that bug has existed since Warty 4.10. >_< Needless to say Edgy is cool, but it took me AGES to get there. It was fun none the less.

[skymt]

You should think about just sticking with Dapper. It will be supported for a long time yet.

I'm sorry Edgy didn't work out for you (it worked perfectly for me). I hope Feisty works better for you.

[nyinge]

I did a clean install of Edgy on my ThinkPad X30, and it's been working flawlessly. I think the problem lies in the new X implementation with newer graphics cards.

As for the download, I used the torrent and got it on the cd in less than half an hour.

[kerry_s]

I think it's the installer that's buggy. I used the same cd and the first 2 installs were screwy, the 3rd install is perfect. ;)

[squeky]

I had a night and a day of thinking to myself "isn't this supposed to just work?!?!". I tried not to think about it, asked specific questions here, got some great answers, and got it working. Started the update last night around 6 PM and I had everything resolved tonight at 6 PM. Take a break, think, breathe, and good luck if you decide to try again.

I know the feeling of wanting to stick with XP after saying "screw Edgy", but I just had to push forward :D

[PWill]

Which upgrade method did you use?

[Ambimom]

This is my final word. If we are to believe Ubuntu is for human beings, then Edgy falls short of the mark.

To the individual who suggested I was a "quitter," I respond that Linux is a tool. It is a means to an end, not the end itself. I use a computer to get things done, period! I am not a programmer or a developer and have no interest in becoming one. I am a user.

Obviously I have learned that Edgy is not meant for everone, but I upgraded according to the explicit instructions provided on this website, which I add, neither suggested or instructed on how to perform a clean install before upgrading.

Luckily after a very frustrating number of hours, I was able to restore my XP master boot record and delete the Linux partitions.

I will probably re-install Dapper all over again in a while. But I need a cooling-off period.

Dapper was the first Linux installation I tried. Since I've already learned how to fix my sound card booting problems; install codecs and fonts, and create a static IP, et.al. the reinstallation of Dapper will not be as traumatic as it was when I began.

I'm not the only person who's had problems with the Edgy upgrade release. All you have to do is read this forum and the collection of blogs being written. Let's keep this in perspective.

[Tetchy Tony]

My laptop dual-boots XP Pro (sorry!) but I use half the HD to try Ubuntu versions, in the hope I can one day switch reliably. BB worked instantly, incl WiFi, so I was converted. But DD (update, and cold) killed the WiFi so I never used it - apart from fiddling fruitlessly with lots of DOS-like stuff about 'wrappers'. EE wouldn't run at all from a live CD, but the 'Alternate' install worked perfectly AND gave me back a wired LAN (but still no WiFi). I then spent the whole night doing unattended Automatix (spent most of its time on fonts!?) and now there seem to be some tempting wizard-like utilities there to try. But the whole thing is immensely SLOW eg 20+ seconds to open Firefox and an age even for a 'terminal' so experimenting seems uninviting. Mouse pointer is fast enough (but hangs for seconds on end while the innards are churning). I'd blame my hardware, but XP Pro is slick as ever with a heap of apps. Whatever can it be doing with all its cycles?

[Dinerty]

Sorry to hear you had such a bad time installing and getting hardware to run under Edgy, did you try downloading the Edgy CD and installing it that way?

Upgrading Dapper to Edgy can be simple or it can be abit of a traumatic time, I recommend you try downloading Edgy and burning the CD and trying it that way, even if you have Windows XP installed now, you can just run the LiveCD and see if it detected your hardware then, if it does try installing it that way by either total format of drive or partition.

[gfahey]

Sorry to hear about this.

I know it's no help to you but, my install with 6.10 was the best install I've ever done. By far. Not one glitch (and I always expect them). This done on a 5 year old Alienware box with 1.7 Pentium IV/512/ATI AIW Radeon 9600. Installed ATI drivers perfectly.

However, as one poster stated, LEARN from this. It's all good believe me. You'll be better off down the road and I would counsel you to try it again. Be stubborn and persistant with it. That's what I do. Previous versions of Ubuntu would never allow me to go beyond 800x6oo resolution. Edgy was the first that allowed me to run 1280x1024 along with the ATI driver. I wouldn't be soured by Ubuntu. Every version makes the next one better. As in my case. I have found regarding Linux distros that it very much depends on your hardware. SUSE 10.1 excelled on my box. Mepis was a pain. Some distros wouldn't even install. Maybe Ubunto Edgy isn't for your setup. Try another distro (SUSE works great too) and Google installs of the version you are installing. I get great info seeing how others installed and updated.

Cool off. Come back to it later and just get better at it. That's the "thing" about Linux. You CONQUER it and feel great about it! IMO, it's well worth the effort. When friends/family come over they are amazed at Linux and think I'm a genius! Now? I do installs for them on their frustrating-swiss-cheese-security Windows boxes and they love it! I got an old Acer box at THE LOCAL DUMP and installed Ubuntu on it for my kids! They love it. I updated it with Edubuntu too and now they have a "school machine".

It's worth the blood and the sweat. Hat's off to you for trying. Take a break and get back into it my man. You'll be proud of yourself and so will anyone here as well!

[davarino]

To Ambimom... (and as an aside to some others)

Edgy is a nightmare to me, too. I believe there was no reason for releasing it in the form it came in, except (possibly) for the once-in-six-months scheduling. It was not adequately and widely tested... we could go on and on. But I won't impute wickedness: our community simply could have done better. I will be much more involved in future.

Ubuntu is a broad concept... and involves mutual respect. That's a hard commodity to come by, it seems, when people feel hurt or disrespected by statements like "this is a nightmare".

There is no real excuse (aside from feeling hurt) to call people quitters for backing out of a project that has been inadequately prepared.

I'm a "quitter" when things don't work... I do not like investing 6 hours of time on things that some much younger people are willing to devote 3 days to: because there are other things that are even more important to me than my computer system. My grandkids. My community.

If the younger and braver are willing to have a go at cleaning up the Edgy mess, they have my full blessing, and I will be very thankful. But a little civility is in order toward those who walk away from the mess. I'm sorry you were insulted.

[heinouskyle]

After I upgraded, I was no longer able to play any sound. I went to System > Preferences > Sound, and changed everything to my VIA something-ot-other sound devbice. Now everything works fine.

I don't know what all you people are talking about with the Nvidia drivers and X not starting. I didn't have any problems with that.

I did have to download new extensions for Firefox and stuff, but I expected that.

[Starlight]

For me, after upgrading almost nothing works... only the failsafe terminal session does, but I can't even use the internet because there's a bug with Ralink wireless cards... apart from that, for me Edgy always shows a blank screen when booting, my Radeon 9550 video card drivers don't work well.... so my Ubuntu is totally unusable. I'm going to reinstall it, but I think if there's a problem with wireless drivers, then it will be still unusable because I won't be able to get online...

[RudolfMDLT]

Edgy was Nightmare Bye Bye - Yeah, I feel the same, though I'm way to stubborn to let edgy win me yet! If by December through updates and tweaks I haven;t fixed it I'll ditch it for Dapper.

[supergrapeman]

Edgy was Nightmare Bye Bye - Yeah, I feel the same, though I'm way to stubborn to let edgy win me yet! If by December through updates and tweaks I haven;t fixed it I'll ditch it for Dapper.

Well, I've moved to Edgy ok now.

I upgraded my dapper installation a couple of weeks back, and had a major wireless issue.. which I managed to work round using ndiswrapper. Others were hitting wireless issues, too: http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=281660. Aside from that, no issues with the upgrade.

As this installation had originally been "hoary", updated through "breezy" to "dapper", I thought I'd reinstall from scratch. I did this (same wireless issue, and an nvidia issue), but all ok now.

It might have been problematic getting there, but I'm happy with this fresh install - it feels noticeably quicker, particularly things like boot-up time.

My advice is - gauge whether you upgrade to edgy on two things. One, your technical skill to get things fixed if they break. Two, whether you really need to upgrade, right now. If you're running dapper ok, and it ain't broke, why not stick where you are?

[DJ Wings]

You'd rather leave for Windows than look for tech support? Aight, then bye, don't let the door hit you on the way out. I'm having problems with my system right now (X won't start because the packages aren't completely upgraded, and DPKG just broke), but I'm not quitting. I'll reinstall from my Xubuntu CD, hack sources.list, and sudo apt-get dist-upgrade; sudo apt-get install xubuntu-desktop. Sure, I'm not a newb who's lived my whole life in the comfy, sickeningly blue... thing that Microsoft calls an OS, and know how to do this, but Edgy is for people like me, who like living on the edge. If you're a home user, go back to Dapper- it's stable, and it's not as outdated as, say, Freespire.
EDIT:
My laptop dual-boots XP Pro (sorry!)
Nothing to be ashamed of. Even hardcore Mac users are doing it with Boot Camp because they need compatibility. And besides, I think MS Paint > XPaint for pixel-by-pixel editing (GIMP still absolutely pwns both of them, though), and I need my iTunes! Feel free to LART me now. Oops... :-#
Again, my $0.02. Skype's rates are STILL too high- your "2 cents" has to be under a minute.
Juuust kidding.

[Zendarin]

It really wasn't too bad for me, just a few minor to semi-problematic errors. After about 10 minutes I figured them out, and I've only been using Linux for a month:)

Don't give up on Linux or Ubuntu!!

[jem7v]

I agree that if Ubuntu is supposed to be Linux for normal people, Edgy is a dismal failure. Updaters shouldn't crash three times and leave your system unbootable, and you shouldn't have to rely on booting into your backup OS to find the answers to the problem with your prefered OS. (I still haven't found a solution, in fact, and my video card isn't even new or cutting edge - it's 6 years old. Working drivers should f-ing exist by now, and they Did in Dapper. I'm hoping they'll get fixed soon and I can stop using a slow, generic driver.)

Mind you, I also think that most people should be holding off upgrading for a week or three instead of jumping into the newest release within a day of its official release and being disappointed in it, especially when they can browse the forums and see that almost all the opinions being expressed on the forum are to the effect of "the upgrader is very broken and my computer had fewer problems in dapper - I hope they release fixes soon!"

[th0mas]

I never perform upgrades.. going with fresh installs is always the best way.

i, kind of, agree with this.
In the past, i've upgraded from warty to hoary, then from hoary to...
Each time there were some problems. The best way is unfortunately to do a fresh install if you want a proper release. Well, ubuntu.com is the official site and it doesn't talk about upgrades afaik.

On the other hand, having problems make you learn !

[highneko]

I never perform upgrades.. going with fresh installs is always the best way.
That's what I did. There were very few problems I had, and I ended up fixing everything easily. Ubuntu is the best. Windows is crap. ;)

[j0217995]

Sorry to hear you had such problems upgrading to Edgy. I had run Edgy in VMWare almost since the repos were announced. I finally did a clean install of Edgy and somehow messed up the install. Now should I blame the install problems on Ubuntu or the fact taht I screweed up? I blame myself, I tried to do other things while I was installling and wasn't paying attention. So I just reinstaleld and nothing is giving me problems.
I just like to ssay great job developers :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

[entropic_existence]

I had problems with upgrading, tons of conflicts with X, Firefox, and ATI related packages that broke the upgrade to the point that Dapper was unusable. So I downloaded the Edgy Install cd and did a clean install.

I had a few problems with the ATI installer for my X1400 but fixed it in less than a day. Sound was terrible but it was because Alsamixer had every channel turned way down so I fixed that. Automatix upgrades took along time due to the heavy loads but I expected that.

All in all I am happy with Edgy, and it did one thing I could never get working properly with Dapper or any other distro and that was getting an XGl/Beryl session properly installed. I use plain KDE for most of my work since it is far more stable and less resource hungry but sometimes it is nice to experiment with the interesting effects, 3D desktop, etc.

I don't consider myself an advanced or experienced linux user, although I have been using it for Computational Biology research and development for about a year or so now. I like things that "just work" but sometimes it being broken (as long as it is fixable with something short of a re-install) teaches me alot more about what is going on under the hood.

Edgy seems good and stable for me right now, definitely enjoying it.

[uitra]

"Edgy is a nightmare to me, too. I believe there was no reason for releasing it in the form it came in, except (possibly) for the once-in-six-months scheduling"

I agree. The mouse pointer in x, has a _____ under it. All my e mail in evolution gone to oblivion (Imap folder empty)... Cant stream media over LAN (could with dapper)

I want to use ubuntu, not use my time bug fixing ubuntu. I am a USER.
This relase, behave on my PC more like a unstabel beta.

The release has potential, it is sexy. Keep up the good work.
But next time dont "trick" me into upgrading something that is no good for me.. I feel like I should have been warned. "Edgy can break your system consider Dapper LTS"

"JUST ANNOUNCED: Ubuntu 6.10, code named Edgy Eft, has been released with many exciting new features. Visit the download page for CD images"

"Ubuntu 6.10, the newest Ubuntu release: If you would like to benefit from the latest Ubuntu features, this is the release for you"

[_lynX]

This is my final word. If we are to believe Ubuntu is for human beings, then Edgy falls short of the mark.

This is not a fair assertion. Edgy works perfectly for myself and a number of other people. Sure, there may be some problems, but there's a reason why Dapper is a stable release and Edgy is an unstable release (every 4th release is considered stable).

But next time dont "trick" me into upgrading something that is no good for me.. I feel like I should have been warned. "Edgy can break your system consider Dapper LTS"

That is true. The download page does note that Dapper has a long-term life cycle, whereas Edgy doesn't, but it doesn't explain what that means, nor does it provide a warning the Edgy may be less stable than Dapper. Possible note should be added?

[mattheweast]

Upgrading from Dapper to Edgy worked really well for me.

What technique did those of you who had problems use to upgrade? The only recommended procedure is to upgrade using update-manager.

[yalding]

Upgrading from Dapper to Edgy worked really well for me.

What technique did those of you who had problems use to upgrade? The only recommended procedure is to upgrade using update-manager.
It does not matter which technique we use to upgrade. It seems many complains are from the broken ATI graphics drivers including mine.

I hate to see a black screen of death. Now I have a fresh install of Dapper again. I hope they stick a warning against upgrade on top of this forum.

[angkor]

but Edgy isn't ready period.

The upgrade to edgy went without a hitch on my system. It took about 1 hour to download the necessary packages and it installed with 0 errors. So it is safe to say it is ready...just not for everyone.

[angkor]

I feel like I should have been warned. "Edgy can break your system consider Dapper LTS"


There have been plenty of warnings on this site (such as this one (http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=286209)) and others.

It's not called edgy for nothing. Even back in July when dapper was released Shuttleworth said that Edgy would be a lot more experimental and people who wanted stability should consider staying with Dapper. If it ain't broke don't fix it.

Always expect breakage when dist-upgrading to a new release. I download the installCD, burn the .iso and then I do a dist-upgrade (using aptitude) and if the upgrade fails I can do a clean install.

Hope things work out for all of you, whether in Edgy or Dapper.

[Téragone]

I had big problem too with Edgy. The live CD don't boot. I was able to install (fresh install) with the alternate CD but the 3D driver doesn't work.

I fall back to Breezy since Dapper have a problem too with the 3D driver.

My notes :

Hoary : 10/10. no problem at all:-D :-D
Breezy : 7/10, still need a manual patch install for the 3D (ATI):)
Dapper : 5/10, 3D not working very well:(
Edgy : 1/10, live CD not working. 3D driver not working at all.](*,) ](*,)
Feisty : ????:-k

3D acceleration is important to me since I do 3D modeling as a hobby.

I will keep Breezy for now. Will try Edgy later.

Don't want to go back with Windows so maybe OSX.

[prendreuncafe]

You should consider uninstall AIGLX if you got an ATI card. That's the only way I've found to make fglrx working again...

[Artificial Intelligence]

We have sticky a link in the newbie forum also which warns people (or check my sig) that Edgy is a testing Platform which have been developed in a period of 4 months.
Plus there's been alot of warnings from everywhere else.

Also note that Edgy 6.10 is considered a development platform for testing new ideas,and technology. Use of this version,and coming versions there after are at your own risk.

You are urged to used caution,and advised to know and understand how to fix your own issues.

If people don't like edgy roll back to dapper which are quite stable and stop complaining and use the energy to bug report.
Alot of new things was been tested in edgy also beta versions of diffrent applications have been tested.

If new people have problem with edgy please link them to the link I have in my signature before advancing further so we can minimize threads like "Ubuntu Suxxor!!!111" threads.

Thanks.

Thread closed due to there's plenty of threads about the subject.

[source]

Yes I have found that the xbox 360 only works with windows and PC to Xbox music and file sharing only works with windows likewise. I needed a crossover cable for a network bridge for "network Manipulation" on games for my advantage. The only real reason i switched to ubuntu was for hacking purposes. C99 shells work solely on the linux kernel but i have found a way to make them work on windows. Linux needs emulators to do things windows has as default. Sure ubuntu has faster booting time, but with a little registry tweaking and batch files, windows could be even faster then ubuntu. The terminal is a great tool but i find it easier to just download stuff simply without the use of text based methods.


I say this because i am switching back to windows my friends. The hype with linux is over rated because people want to be "free" or "different". I say, a computer with windows pre-installed isnt 300 extra dollars for an OS really. Oh and MS office comes pre insttalled also. The greatest of linux's open source software Such as GAIM and FIrefox all work on windows. While on Linux you need to emulate windows software. My games are faster on windows also.


Goodbye Ubuntu Community.

yours truly,

A windows user.

[bigken]

Bye :shock:

[ner0tic]

just put linux on your xbox.

[JayTee]

Later, have a nice day! When the trojans start eating your hard disk or you find your identity stolen by a keystroke logger you better not start whining.

[Dual Cortex]

Bye to you too.
PS3 FTW!

[Anonii]

Bye to you too.
PS3 FTW!
PROTIP: 600$ is not a reasonable price.

[Dual Cortex]

PROTIP: 600$ is not a reasonable price.

But waiting in line, buying, then selling at over $1.5k gives me enough reasons!

EDIT: Just checked out ebay... preorder selling at over $4.6K

[blendmaster]

Why would you expect an xbox to work with Linux, you do realize it's made by Microsoft?

Microsoft usually refuses to allow any coordination with Linux when it comes to their stuff.

Have you tried dual-booting? For stubborn stuff like this, you can have both Windows and Ubuntu...

I guess what you do with your pc is your decision (I mean, if you don't want complete control over it, and want to "rent" an operating system [the Windows EULA states that you only rent it, you do not own it], it's your decision).

[xpod]

I dont know why anybody would want to change OS`s just to go use programs that emulate windows programs.:-k ..Thats what i thought "dualbooting" was for"?

I say, a computer with windows pre-installed isnt 300 extra dollars for an OS really

I`d say you were probably right:D
Good luck.......you`ll probably need it;)

[Chayak]

A note that you need windows media center to work with the Xbox 360. Office may be preinstalled on a windows computer but you better believe that you pay for it.

I rather like avoiding the license hasle with CALSs for window servers X.x

[NorthCoast]

Hey I'm brand new here too. But instead I'll say hello and not goodbye.:p
crossover cables, emulators, yada oy. Linux likes for you to have a networking/communications clue that's true. But when you do then *nix does backflips over the wiNdoZe for everything I need it to do. But if you only want to play with the little toys then MS is your best choice for sure. For me it is the worst choice.
bye:-k

[deanlinkous]

That is a troubled bye message. I honestly cannot say I understood half of what he was saying. Hate to see you go... especially because your xbox network bridge crossover c99 thingy would not worky???

[SoloSalsa]

A note that you need windows media center to work with the Xbox 360. Office may be preinstalled on a windows computer but you better believe that you pay for it.
That's the first complaint I had against the 360! Having a shnazzy Vaio with XPMCE 2003, then paying another $160 for the MCE 2004 upgrade. We didn't pay it again for 2005 (there is none for 2006+). Go PS3! (and less-go Wii)
Also, I've never had Office bundled. They all come with Works. My (once mid-high end) laptop came with Word 2000. The closest was a two-month Office 2003 trial. That had to be unlocked. For the trial! And we lost the little sticker with the sixty-character code. So we've never made use of it.
But really, he sounds smart, so don't make fun of adware with him. We're too good for him, anyway :mrgreen:.

[raqball]

Hasta-La-Nachos

I think that's Chineese for bye :)

[Dead_$partan]

Source,

Your post sounds really amatuer and I get the impression that you dont really know what yout talking about.

Good luck with windows, sounds like it suits you.

Dont be ignorant to Linux, remember its 100% free, windows will cost at least £100 for an OEM, over £200 for retail. Compair both and you cant diagree with Linux, its free for goodness sake.

I cant do half the things in windows that I can do with Linux.

AN xbox 360 isnt a reason to choose one OS over another.

[raqball]

AN xbox 360 isnt a reason to choose one OS over another.

Unless you are 12 and trolling :)

[Chayak]

Sounds like a script kiddie wanna-be who wants to cheat at online games, not exactly the type you would want in the ubuntu community anyway.

[msak007]

The greatest of linux's open source software Such as GAIM and FIrefox all work on windows.
You don't have Amarok :p. Goodbye and good luck.

[OffHand]

C ya later.

[jon schroeder]

Gimme' a pile of computer parts and a linux distro and I'll get you an all 'singin', all dancin' data center in a few hours. With that other OS.. I'll need a few lawyers.

[bswilson]

Yes I have found that the xbox 360 only works with windows and PC to Xbox music and file sharing only works with windows likewise. I needed a crossover cable for a network bridge for "network Manipulation" on games for my advantage. The only real reason i switched to ubuntu was for hacking purposes.

If you were either too inept or too lazy to make Ubuntu network with your Xbox or Windows systems via the standard protocols that they all support, you were probably a shitty hacker too. Bye!

[Chayak]

Gimme' a pile of computer parts and a linux distro and I'll get you an all 'singin', all dancin' data center in a few hours. With that other OS.. I'll need a few lawyers.

Amen to that! Oh and don't forget a CAL for each user or connection that could be made to that data center, not to mention the license fee for the windows server OS itself all in a convenient YEARLY package.

[WalmartSniperLX]

just put linux on your xbox.

Lol my friend did that and now hes a major modder too ;)

[WalmartSniperLX]

Why would you expect an xbox to work with Linux, you do realize it's made by Microsoft?

Microsoft usually refuses to allow any coordination with Linux when it comes to their stuff.

Have you tried dual-booting? For stubborn stuff like this, you can have both Windows and Ubuntu...

I guess what you do with your pc is your decision (I mean, if you don't want complete control over it, and want to "rent" an operating system [the Windows EULA states that you only rent it, you do not own it], it's your decision).

?? what do you mean? Who cares about what microsoft thinks or wants. You can get linux working with complete support on any xbox platform :D My friend did it to both his xbox and 360 and it ROCKS!

[stalker145]

...Linux needs emulators to do things windows has as default... The greatest of linux's open source software Such as GAIM and FIrefox all work on windows. While on Linux you need to emulate windows software...

Well, not that he'll hear it, but hasta la bye-bye to source.

Ummm, aren't we talking about different files here and not emulation? :-k Maybe I'm confused (I am new, observe the beans) and need to edshoekayt myself on the ways of operating systems.

Emulation is a different animal... Gaim, Firefox, and countless other programs are written for multiple platforms. They are not normally run in the "emulation" program (e.g. Wine) but as a native application.

Ok, this is sounding more like a lesson than the original question I had intended so I hereby STFD and STFU :-D

[izalac]

They are not normally run in the "emulation" program (e.g. Wine) but as a native application.

Wine Is Not an Emulator :P

[NorthCoast]

whatz an xbox? :-#

my 8 year old can do the Ubuntu dance without any complaints. But she's not a haxor chic. Just easily gets the job done.

but let's not troll him back for the big rebuttal. 1st post bye byes are never good on their return engagement. He's right that 'Doze is the right OS for him.

It ain't political, just logical.

[Chayak]

?? what do you mean? Who cares about what microsoft thinks or wants. You can get linux working with complete support on any xbox platform :D My friend did it to both his xbox and 360 and it ROCKS!

Your friend is running linux on the Xbox 360? I wasn't aware that anyone had cracked the code checking routines in it yet. You'd think free60 would be up to date on that kind of thing as they are associated with the group who did xbox linux. :rolleyes:

Just FYI each Xbox 360 apparently has the flash encrypted with a per box key that's contained inside the CPU and runs a hypervisor that checks the running kernel if it doesn't match you get a panic and the box shuts down.

[d3v1ant_0n3]

Have fun with the DRM!

He reminsd me of the time I was in Yahoo chat and some lil l33t h4x0r kid was deleting things from my Windows folder on my C:\ drive.

Except I don't have windows (or a C:\ drive) on this computer.

[deepwave]

Bye. Man all these goodbye and complain threads are becoming dull.

[slimdog360]

If you were either too inept or too lazy to make Ubuntu network with your Xbox or Windows systems via the standard protocols that they all support, you were probably a shitty hacker too. Bye!

hahahhaaa

[mrgnash]

Goodbye Microsoft employee.

[ubuntu27]

Yes I have found that the xbox 360 only works with windows and PC to Xbox music and file sharing only works with windows likewise. I needed a crossover cable for a network bridge for "network Manipulation" on games for my advantage. The only real reason i switched to ubuntu was for hacking purposes.


Goodbye Ubuntu Community.

yours truly,

A windows user.


Well, SOurce.

Good luck for everything.
If you decide for come back just remember that you are always welcome to be here as long as you have an open mind to learn new things. :)

Before I say goodbye, let me give you some links that could be of interest to you (I hope so)

Links related to Linux and xBoX 360

http://www.xbox-linux.org

http://www.xbox360-hacks.com/

http://wiki.free60.org/


Goodbye!

[darkninja]

Well at least this guy's reasons for leaving are a bit more interesting then the usual "OMG PHOTOSHOP/WIRELESS/RANDOM HARDWARE/GAMES DON'T WORK"!

Well good luck in Windowsland strange XBoX script kiddie guy!

[MedivhX]

LOL!!! Who says that you must emulate... You can find a Linux replacement for Windows apps...

May the viruses be with you.

[AlphaMack]

And here is yet another LINW post for these kinds of threads:

http://linux.oneandoneis2.org/LNW.htm

[zcal]

Cursed be the day I ditch my new friend, Ubuntu, because of a game console. Does anyone remember the good ol' days when we bought a console simply to play games?

Serve me up a Nintendo Wii please. :mrgreen:

[Ashrael]

"The border between the Real and the Unreal is not fixed, but just marks the last place where rival gangs of shamans fought each other to a standstill."

-Robert Anton Wilson

[Stew2]

Well, at least he tried it :) , most people who try Ubuntu eventually come back to it :D .

Regards,
Stew2

[ComplexNumber]

source
in your very first post(2 days ago) on the forum you said this:
I installed ubuntu today and am very excited to begin my new OS experience. The fast loading times and great interface are perfect and i plan on staying a linux user foreverit seems you are quite an impulsive and fickle guy, so i would be inclined to take what you've said in this thread with a pinch of salt. a person who is forever going for the easy option for any given situation, and who is forever being driven by the latest whim. i wonder how long it will take you to have a change of whim next time.

[Rhubarb]

I hope you're going to do some cheating on some of the x360 online games.
I've seen a few online console (xbox) cheaters, it's good to see that m$ can keep its name as a hackable brand name.
After the update blunder earlier this week that some xbox users experienced, I can't understand why someone would choose an x360 (or anything m$ for that matter)?
http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2006/11/09/xbox_update_blunder/

[migla]

Dual boot, so you can have the xbox-bridge (and some games) sometimes and the rest of your tasks free, open source, fast-booting, virus free, cool, indefinitely customizable, powerful, educational, interesting, evolving and with a helpful and knowledgeable community.

(and I'm sure there's lots more to be said)

Yay! Linux!

[Mathiasdm]

Yes I have found that the xbox 360 only works with windows and PC to Xbox music and file sharing only works with windows likewise. I needed a crossover cable for a network bridge for "network Manipulation" on games for my advantage.
Well, what a surprise! Who would've thought the Xbox 360 (Copyright Microsoft) doesn't work with Linux!
The only real reason i switched to ubuntu was for hacking purposes. C99 shells work solely on the linux kernel but i have found a way to make them work on windows.
So you only used Linux to break into computers? (This is the conclusion I came to after looking for "C99 shell" on Google)
Good riddance!
Linux needs emulators to do things windows has as default.
Well, that's kinda logical, you know. Windows software (logically) doesn't run natively on Linux.
Sure ubuntu has faster booting time, but with a little registry tweaking and batch files, windows could be even faster then ubuntu. The terminal is a great tool but i find it easier to just download stuff simply without the use of text based methods.
That's what 'Synaptic' and 'Add/Remove programs' are for?


I say this because i am switching back to windows my friends. The hype with linux is over rated because people want to be "free" or "different".
Err... People use Linux because they prefer it, not because they 'want to be different'. Perhaps you were using it for the wrong reasons...

I say, a computer with windows pre-installed isnt 300 extra dollars for an OS really. Oh and MS office comes pre insttalled also. The greatest of linux's open source software Such as GAIM and FIrefox all work on windows. While on Linux you need to emulate windows software. My games are faster on windows also.
1. Nope, not 300 dollars. Only about 200, if I remember correctly.
2. MS Office doesn't come pre-installed. If it does, your computer is at least 200 dollars more expensive than it would be if you bought it without Office :p
3. Well, that's not Linux' fault. It's the fault of the people that make those Windows programs.


Goodbye Ubuntu Community.

yours truly,

A windows user.
Bye.

[Gargamella]

You just committed an other error:Xbox 360, a MS product and really worse than PS3 which has also linux (Yellow Dog Linux 5.0)

[Old Pink]

Oh and MS office comes pre insttalled also.

For $***/£** extra.

If you were to head out and buy standalone XP, it wouldn't include office.

[viper]

Whats with all the commotion, the guy obviously wants to go so let him go, thinking he just likes the attention anyway........asta la vista

[Artificial Intelligence]

Closed thread due trolling (a.k.a. unconstructive feedback to the community).

[LincolnMarkVII]

You could try saying nothing to them, and respecting the fact that they use something different than you and are happy with what they have.

I've always disliked computer/OS-snobbery. First I hated Amiga users for their smug self-satisfaction.. then Mac users once the Amiga fell flat on its face.. and now many Linux users are starting to rub me the wrong way. Reading some of the things on this forum, while I'm sitting here contemplating deleting Ubuntu and going back to a Windows install because none of you can be arsed to respond to a problem elsewhere on this forum, I've come to understand why I hate computer/OS-snobbery.

You see, I'm an Atheist living in the South. I'm also one who finds christianity highly offensive. Yet I am surrounded by it. I've even left a job because the boss's father tried to convert me while I was trying to work. I've noticed a pattern with people like that. First they try to entice you to their belief system/group/whatever, and then when you're not receptive to it they belittle and mock your beliefs (or lack thereof) in an attempt to either shame you into conversion to their faith or to make themselves seem/feel superior to you. Sound familiar? As I write out this quick reply, I see a post above it saying "Try something like, "I understand, not everyone has the courage to learn new things. It's probably too difficult..."". If you can't sway them, belittle them, is what that says. Utterly shameful and repulsive.

As I progress further in life, now past my 35th birthday, I am coming to the realization that I am tired of "belonging", and all the people out there trying to make me "belong" to one group or another and expecting me to rabidly support whatever I'm supposed to "belong" to. Atheist or Christian, American or Terrorist, Ford or Chevy, Democrap or Repugnant, "red state" or "blue state", rock or rap, PC or Mac, Windows or Linux, AMD or Intel, ATI or nVidia, paper or plastic, one football team over another, college or pro, whatever. I find myself increasingly disgusted with the pressures exerted in society to further these pointless "belongings".. what Roger Waters of Pink Floyd would call the concept of "us and them".. and the absurd importance people put behind them.

When I sit back and look at threads like this, all I see is a bunch of people desperate to belong to something, and desperate to find ways to bash people who belong to something else.. and desperate for "converts". Well I joined your little cult for awhile, and now I'm going back to the land of people who don't give a damn about what OS they use as long as it does what they want it to do. I'm sure you'll find endless ways to bash me for it, but I frankly don't care. You'll probably expend far more effort bashing me for saying this than you would've expended helping me with the problem I've had for the last 24+ hours that has soured me to Linux in the first place.. and that's sad. What's sadder is that you most likely don't realize how sad it is.

Ever since I installed Breezy Badger awhile back, I've had this nagging feeling in the back of my head about Linux. To sum it up, it feels like I've been given some unnatural hybrid of Windows XP and DOS 5.. with all the things that annoy me now when I look back at being an old DOS user, and little of the benefits of all the advancements that came after it. I can't just install City of Heroes on this machine, for example, and make it play as soon as the install's done. I'd have to fiddle with Wine or whatever, tweak this setting or that setting, etc. I just want it to WORK. I don't care if it gives me geek-snob-cred to have an OS not designed by "teh evil Bill Gate$" or whatever. Maybe if you people expended a little more energy making it "just work" and a little less energy finding ways to bash the "competition", you'd hang onto more people like me. Of course, you'll probably dismiss all this with things like "well we don't want you anyway".. or various other ways of making it my fault to absolve yourselves. But if you don't want people like me using your OS, then where do you expect to gain marketshare vs. "teh evil Windoze"? If you answer with dismissive comments, then you just prove me right about it being some little cult to belong to.. and prove wrong any statements about wanting to honestly make gains against the dominant player.

More than likely, you'll just skim over this and dismiss me as a Linux-basher or a "Windows slave". Well if just wanting my computer to work when I want it to makes me a "slave", then so be it. I guess I'm a "Ford-slave" for wanting my car to start when I get in it and turn the key, as opposed to turning the key and having the wipers come on or whatever. Enjoy your "belonging", if it means that much to you.

[aysiu]

I'm sorry, but did you even read the original post? It was the friends and relatives of the OP not respecting OS choice, not the OP herself.

Sure, the title "Microsoft-slaves" is a bit off-putting, but the people described within the first post actually are Microsoft-slaves. Not all Windows users are (and I don't think the OP intended to imply that all Windows users are)--only those that feel the need to berate users of non-Windows OSes and spread lies about Linux.

Clearly you have a chip on your shoulder, though, and relevancy to the topic isn't as important to you as just blowing off some steam. That's cool. Every now and then, we all feel the need to rant.

[LincolnMarkVII]

Well you can count me in among the Ubuntu naysayers after this experience, so I guess that makes me a "Microsoft-slave". Also, I'm glad you could dismiss everything I said by labelling it as "venting". Another method of belittling, just not as direct as outright ridicule. Thanks for that.

It's funny you should have that sig talking about "the Linux Desktop myth".. it took me far more screwing around and multiple re-installs to get Linux to work right on this computer than I've needed in many Windows installs over the years, for other people. But I suppose that's my fault too.. or I was just "venting".

Now if you'll excuse me, I have to figure out how I want to go about saving what info is on this computer before I nuke it and put 98SE or something on it. Going to have to Email myself all my links or something, because it doesn't want to play nice-nice on my network.. add that to the list of my frustrations with it.

[LincolnMarkVII]

In the middle of Email tranferring everything I don't want to lose, I thought about something: I'll give this OS one last shot at staying on this computer IF one of you can come up with a compelling argument for it that doesn't involve Windows-bashing. Doesn't have to be a ten page tirade about it, it could be a sentence or two. I'm sure you're probably asking yourself, "Why should I make the effort for you, after everything you've said?" and there's a good possibility none of you will answer on that basis. But, if you can't answer for me, how can you answer for anyone else you hope to "save" from the "horrors" and "myths" and what not of Windows? How do you know that you won't "convert" a friend a week or a month from now, and that friend won't get similarly fed up when the poop hits the fan and look to leave in disgust as I'm close to?

[aysiu]

No one should have to convince you to stay with Ubuntu. No OS suits everyone's needs. If Ubuntu doesn't suit your needs, use something else.