To those who still have Windows, when can you get rid of it?

[stinger30au]

i will ditch windows all together when Ubuntu supports my Canon USB lide20 scanner natively, and i can run DVDAB decrypter in Ubuntu

[Samuelh3]

Only reason I keep windows around is the Outlook email client. Evolution is slow at best when connecting to exchange. I'm a heavy outlook user and Evolution just doesn't do it for me.

[didli]

I will throw Windows by the window when I will find something better than the *dobe Creativ* Suit*... or when this one will be port to Linux (which I doubted).

[frokki]

I will stop using Windows when Force Feedback works perfectly in Ubuntu.

[Fakircho]

Hi

For personal use i gave Ubuntu a go and pretty happy with what it delivers. Excluding some wireless problems.

However i am an architect and to be able to make full use of it I have a collection of programs that must use in order to be able share data with other people i work with.
Once i can run AutoCAD, Sketchup, Photoshop ( which i believe already runs on Ubuntu ) and Indesign i can be completely Windows free.

I know that there are alternatives to the programs i use i am forced into standards set by industry and there is no getting around that.

So until wine or something similar gets much better i will have to continue using Windows.

[kuddo]

When companies will start to create software updated for linux distros...i will give up Windows and forget that ever existed... Wont we all ?

[Starrfoxx]

Yea, basically. There's another guy on here that has taken to calling it "Wintendo" for that reason, and I have to agree....
I boot to Wintendo to run Doom 3, Oblivion, Civ 4, and UT2k4. And I know that last one runs native under 'Nix, but not as smoothly, and not with a gamepad.
For everything else I use 'Buntu or PCLOS.

Yeah, I've got Oblivion also, plus The Sims, Sims 2, Age of Empires series, Flight Simulator, several MMORPG's, and a few more.

For everything else, I'm trying to find alternatives to run them in Ubuntu.

[Salpiche]

the only reason I keep windows is for the moments when I am helping a friend on some of many windows issues, Xp or Vista, and it is only in a virtual box environment, thus there is no M$ partitions on any of my computers.

[bobbocanfly]

School requires it for homework, Photoshop is irreplacable, as is Counter Strike and Halo (The only good thing to come from Microsoft?)

[andrebrait]

I'll delete my windows partition when I get Half-Life 2 to run in Linux with the same performance I get in Windows (something around 40FPS. In Ubuntu, I never got above 20FPS). I have an AMD Sempron 3100+ with a **** GeForce 5200FX.

[GordSellar]

I'd need to have a word processor that's actually completely functional. OpenOffice has so many bugs that my writer friends and I have all decided to stay away from it until it's actually working. I use Abiword for now, and it's mostly good, but I always have to go look at my files in Word before emailing them anywhere, since that's how the people buying my stuff will be seeing it.

That and the fact that I live in Korea, and pretty much everything here only really works properly with Windows, from the majority of websites (especially banking or webshopping) to local wireless networks that rely on some kind of crazy proprietary software to open the connection.

Hell, the University admins keep updating the horrid campus network security, and every bloody time I have to call them so they can come and be told someone is running Linux, and please to make the network not think that Linux is a virus... (Happens about three times a year.)

If there's ever a sign that Linux has succeeded, it's when South Korea adopts it as the main OS. Because I've NEVER seen a country so thoroughly Windows-oriented.

[karellen]

I'd need to have a word processor that's actually completely functional. OpenOffice has so many bugs that my writer friends and I have all decided to stay away from it until it's actually working. I use Abiword for now, and it's mostly good, but I always have to go look at my files in Word before emailing them anywhere, since that's how the people buying my stuff will be seeing it.

That and the fact that I live in Korea, and pretty much everything here only really works properly with Windows, from the majority of websites (especially banking or webshopping) to local wireless networks that rely on some kind of crazy proprietary software to open the connection.

Hell, the University admins keep updating the horrid campus network security, and every bloody time I have to call them so they can come and be told someone is running Linux, and please to make the network not think that Linux is a virus... (Happens about three times a year.)

If there's ever a sign that Linux has succeeded, it's when South Korea adopts it as the main OS. Because I've NEVER seen a country so thoroughly Windows-oriented.

you are not alone man, it's the same here in Romania. everyone uses windows and Linux is seen more like a curiosity/hobby/something to spend the time with

[osarusan]

To get rid of Windows for good I'd need two things: 1) to have my tablet pc work fully functional in linux (i tried really hard and got a lot working, but not enough, so it just didn't cut it) -- that includes better support for alternative text input such as handwriting or at least a better and easier to setup onscreen keyboard, as well as an easy GUI for bluetooth connectivity, and 2) Civ4 working on linux.

I already use Ubuntu almost exclusive on my desktop (with the exception of Windows for Civ4), but after a week of desperate hard work fiddling with ubuntu on my tablet, the frustration got to be too much.

[meindian523]

School requires it for homework, Photoshop is irreplacable, as is Counter Strike and Halo (The only good thing to come from Microsoft?)

CS runs on Linux too.....!

[WesFlash]

PocketPC PDA doesn't work with Linux.

Synching my PDA is the only thing holding me back now. If I could pull away from it, I'd switch to Linux.

[desertboy]

The only things missing for me are

1. Rosetta stone (French edition)
2. Autoroute style program
3. Games (I have a 8800gts)

Having said that Rosetta stone and Autoroute run fine in virtualbox with an XP guest and I broke my vista install so I am and have been Ubuntu user for some considerable time and when I move to France there's even less chance I'll bother using windows at all.

Windows doesn't feel like computing anymore it feels more like one of those speak and spells I had as a kid.

Better hardware support would go a miss either.

[mysticmatrix]

Better support for games.
Either Wine or Intel drivers don't want me to plat counterstrike 1.6.
This is why WinLOZE still stays on my PC. Will ditch it once I get a nvidia.

[desertboy]

The only things missing for me are

1. Rosetta stone (French edition)
2. Autoroute style program
3. Games (I have a 8800gts)

Having said that Rosetta stone and Autoroute run fine in virtualbox with an XP guest and I broke my vista install so I am and have been Ubuntu user for some considerable time and when I move to France there's even less chance I'll bother using windows at all.

Windows doesn't feel like computing anymore it feels more like one of those speak and spells I had as a kid.

Better hardware support would go a miss either.

After playing around with wine I can ditch windows all my games work fine as does Rosetta stone and autoroute can be ran on my old P3 laptop. I just deleted my NTFS partition, bye bye windows. Last user to ditch it don't forget to turn the light off.

[victor_c26]

To answer the thread title: I don't think I want to get rid of Windows, since I actually like it.

A shock, I know, but I haven't had any problems with either XP or Vista. I guess you could say I'm a jack of all trades computer user.

The thought of multi-booting my computer with multiple OSs gives me a feeling of joy that I just can't describe. :)

[ForgottenOne]

CS runs on Linux too.....!

Yes steam based games do run on Linux, but they only run decent if you have a decent computer like yourself. Those of us that have subpar computers get really poor performance, I for example lose over half of my FPS when using CSS on wine/linux.

The only things keeping me from using linux more is:

Games/ Game Performance
Trillain
Paint Shop Pro
Misc tasks

I have a friend who would be using Ubuntu exclusively, but his sound card isn't supported, so a no go for him. Another friend who is a noob just couldn't go through the steps to get everything working, once linux/ubuntu is more noob friendly and has a ease of use for the new comers it will be more widely excepted.

[ExSuSEusr]

I don't think it can be anymore noob friendly :)

[mr_boo1711]

Ok, ok - I may as well join in here...

A few reasons for me...

1) I still have a slight fear of NOT having windows. Now this will go away in time, I guess its only due to the lack of experience with Linux.

2) A lot of what goes on in Linux is terminal based text - which I am really slow to pick up on! (Which is a point - if anyone can point me in the direction of a quick ref for terminal commands, that would be fab [just while I remember])

3) Its a common trend here, but there are a couple of games I play regularly over a LAN/Internet. (Being Dawn of War and Fear mainly). Havent tried WINE yet - so i've no idea how successfull that will be.

..that's prob about it really. I love the challenge of trying new things and being a little more unique and thats what drove me to Linux in the first place. I dont particularly dislike Windoze, it's just that it costs a lot for something thats far from perfect and it more importantly isn't personal enough for me - if that makes sense?! I mean, you never see two linux desktops the same, and that simple fact says a lot for what linux is about in my opinion. The other thing being that is that if you need support for Windoze your just as well ](*,) where as with Linux, you post a 'Someone help me!' msg and you get 3 zillion useful replies - 'nuff said really! :D

[keeper-of-the-real]

TWO REASON!

1. It runs Technical certification software CD's.

2. Windows Media Center and Hauppage WinTV-PVR USB2.0 with remote support.

That's all.

But I run Windows in linux for the CD's, so I guess only for media center.

[mysticmatrix]

Better support for games.
Either Wine or Intel drivers don't want me to plat counterstrike 1.6.
This is why WinLOZE still stays on my PC. Will ditch it once I get a nvidia.

CS runs now on Gutsy Beta. Bye Bye Windows....

[Enverex]

CS runs now on Gutsy Beta. Bye Bye Windows....

CS running isn't anything to do with Gusty...

[disraeli]

Mainly, these reasons:

- Audio, Video and Image editing / manipulation
- Videogames
- Software I need and that exists only for Windows

[rahimveron]

One reason:
Lexmark X1185 AIO: Scannr does not work, though i have not booted to XP for 2 months. Scanning is not important for me but in future this may be sorted. Damn Lexmark for not providing the driver.

[strawberryjam]

As soon as i can get ubuntu studio to do all my work...ie music recording, video compositing, midi editing etc.

I read all the time of how Ardour, Muse and the like works for people, but it still eludes me. Cant get rid of xruns in jack, cant get my audio to sound right or do my mastering properly.

Once it gets easier to configure and i can just switch on and get to work, i will switch permanently.

Until then...it windows xp for me, even if it does crash once an hour. :(
At least i meet my deadlines and still have my job.

[mwilsonemt]

Reasons:

1. My wife is stubborn and refuses to get rid of Windows.

2. A few websites I use have crappy designers and the sites only work in IE.

[bigb_thedestroyer]

3. Microsoft Sam. I like that voice very much.



I hope that isn't the voice you fall asleep to!?:-({|=

[dimbulb1024]

My DVR with XP and BeyondTV keeps Windows on one of my machines. I haven't felt confident enough with my limited GNU/Linux knowledge to jump to Myth or such.
My laptop, which I use for everything else, is strictly Ubuntu.

[chrisch]

DVDShrink is the the only thing left on my Windblows partition. I have gotten it to run under Wine, but it just doesn't work flawlessly so I just deal with that lost space that is my XP partition.

[vikrant82]

Sometimes, WIN XXXX is the only place where you find support for lot of your hardware.

Like the other day, I had to re-flash by DVD writer and Windows was the only way to go about it. Or how about upgrading BIOS firmware etc.

Basically I leave it for hardware troubleshooting for an aging laptop.

[Cannaregio]

Blimey, this is a long thread!

What prevent me...?
networking; MS-Office; Anquet mapping software; Digiguide (tv); Mailwasher; Starry Night Backyard; Age of Empires; Trainz; .... I could go on. Lots of investment in that software!

M.

Dunnow about trainz (haven't tried it yet), but I can assure you that JTTrainDriver (Train Driver (http://www.gamespot.com/pc/sim/traindriver/index.html)) works perfectly in wine with Ubuntu Gutsy beta.
In fact you don't even have to install it through wine: you just copy everything in a folder somewhere on your box and then start JTTrainDriver.exe through wine. If you have chosen the correct resolution (the bigger, the better) you won't notice any difference vis-à-vis windows.
Well, maybe it's a tag quicker and more stabile than in windows :-)

So you can enjoy those beautyful steam locomotives, and the nice hilly british landscape in GNU/Linux to your heart content!

I was keeping a windows partition for games like trainz,
I don't think I'll need it anymore :-)

[Ishumaru]

I love Ubuntu, I just started out on it though but it serves most of my purposes besides my broadcom wireless card and chat rooms in kopete. I didnt even bother trying to keep windows with a 60 gig hd, besides, Ubuntu is just more fun to mess around with and you can do more stuff.

[motoperpetuo]

I can't figure out how to get a standard Russian keyboard in Ubuntu. You can switch to a Russian keyboard, but the characters are all in the wrong places, for some reason. Frustrating.

[jbaerbock]

I have an install of XP purely for games that don't run so hot with my 3D card drivers in linux. Yeah I have an ATI....sigh....

[vishzilla]

with gutsy, i think its time to get rid of my Win. Had enough with it.

[l34th3r]

I started using linux again last week after not using it since 2004. A few points I'd like to stress:

1: I cant believe how far linux has come. It's bad ***. I want to switch completely, NOW! ( My luv u linux! )

2: There's no way I can totally switch yet. Meaning.... I've only broken (had to reinstall) it once so far.... I need to break it at least two more times, to feel confident about the safety of my work (livelyhood). Totally switching could mean the choice of steak or beans and rice.

3: If you feel like me, dont switch until your comfortable knowing absolutely no data/work will ever be lost. I've found losing data is not possible yet, but I have lost settings, functions, installed Dependency's that took forever to setup, causing me to reinstall. I read once it works don't tweak it, It will break. I also read " If it's not broken, your not learning". Learning is the attraction for me with linux. The participation and shared knowledge is vast and more helpfull than any school ( if you know how to read )!

4: I'm hooked! Many thanks to the comunity participant's who take the time to answer all of our concernes, fustrations and doubts. I know i have joined a comunity that cares about our needs and willingness to teach. Hat's off to you all. I hope to be as helpfull soon.

5: Don't switch untill you have broken it a few times.......... Beans and rice don't taste as good the seventh day!

My first post,

Lance

[jbaerbock]

Wouldn't being able to break it mean it is not safe? It makes no sense to say you must break the system a few times before you can trust your files on it...

[newman]

Ubuntu is OK for just internet browsing or to type a simple text file.
My HDTV card doesn't work well. MythTV sucks ***. ATI video drivers get like 2 FPS. Office applications don't format properly in OpenOffice. Power management doesn't work. Hard disc is always trashing.
I think I'll just stick with Vista.

[jbaerbock]

Ubuntu is OK for just internet browsing or to type a simple text file.
My HDTV card doesn't work well. MythTV sucks ***. ATI video drivers get like 2 FPS. Office applications don't format properly in OpenOffice. Power management doesn't work. Hard disc is always trashing.
I think I'll just stick with Vista.


I don't know I have been rather productive with GIMP and the openoffice.org suite. Yeah ATI driver support right now is bad but it will get better and till then just dual boot. My power management works fine and my HD seems happy enough. Just remember than just because you are having problems does not mean everyone else is.

[General_Ts0]

how many threads are there going to be about this ? Of course in this Community Windows is going to "suck" because we're in a pro-Linux domain. Vice versa. Most Linux snobs (and I'm working on becoming one) trash talk Windows but have to yield to gaming as the main time to revert back.

So..... what are we going to do about that ? Make Linux have more gaming goodness ? Ok, then I'm sure we agree, let's get to it. At least we agree on the problem to go and solve.

[jbaerbock]

General_TsO I love your chicken, very finger lickin' good!

[LLauranzonIII]

when my ipod dies.

ubuntu full time on the laptop. vista on the desktop, once 7.10 comes out it'll be dual boot on the desktop.

[Speedoo]

Oops. Missed the poll. But wanted to post anyway. I need Windoze on one of my machines to transfer programs from Tivo. I've been told the Tivo box uses a Linux OS, so I don't understand why they don't offer "Tivo To Go" for Linux, but for now, the only way to transfer programs from the DVR to my hard drive is via Windoze. Now if I could just figure out how to burn them to DVD (under Linux OR Windoze!)

[Corlesa]

I have Ubuntu on an older laptop but am waiting for my X61 tablet because, from what I understand, although a lot of things work, many don't work well and some don't work at all yet. I'm anxious get Linux on it though.

[hellion0]

On my desktop? Nothing. Soon as I get my replacement memory, I'm putting Feisty on it. The only things that were holding me back were my scanner and DJing. Before, I needed SAM for that, but with Nicecast running on my Mac, it's no longer needed there. As for the scanner, xsane is a little bit of a pain, but it does work, so that's covered. Gaming is no concern, as all the gaming I do can be done under Linux. (Console emulation - NES, SNES, Genesis, GB(A).)

As for my laptop, sadly, I still need windows for one thing - sound compatibility. It's a dual-boot setup, though, and Feisty sees the lion's share of uptime these days, but at night, I need the sound. (Laptop as a Walkman, I've heard stranger...) So, Win2K goes on at night.

[SunburnedCactus]

Unless I want to give up music I'm not likely to stop using Windows for Cubase and Native Instruments stuff. And games but of course. Literally everything else it seems I can do without though, which is nice.

[jbaerbock]

What's this about music? I have all my music playing in Banshee under Linux Mint. Only problems I have had is when wma DRM kicks in which would happen in windows too.

[DARKGuy]

I'd get rid of windows when all the games work on Linux and the HD lag dissapears.

On my system...
NFSMW works on Windows.... it doesn't on Linux.
Transformers works on Windows... it doesn't even start on Linux.
Legacy of Kain: Defiance works on Windows.... it shows up an error on Linux.
Tomb Raider: Legend & Anniversary work on Windows... they don't start up in Linux.

Those who have those games running "happily" is because they have an 8800 or big card like that, it's ridiculous that if my card (GF4 Ti 4200) can run those pretty nicely with most details in high settings in Windows, it can't on Linux - it's obviously WINE's or NVIDIA's fault (errors which I hope get fixed with time). But anyways...

I don't want to be playing old games (NFSU, NFSU2, Stolen, TR: AOD and Dungeon Siege II)... unless I'm able to go to a store and buy any game I want and play it (well, ok, not so new like Halo 2 for PC or Gears of War or Crysis, games which would be insane to even try to run on WINE), I don't think I'll be ditching windows.

Besides in Windows I notice a LOT of less hard disk lag, I dunno why, in Linux it doesn't matter if I have compiz or not, the HD starts doing weird things or loads a lot of stuff when it only has to open a dumb terminal window or a firefox browser... it's kinda upsetting that doing those things in windows is faster.

So yeah, I don't think I will for now until gaming and performance is improved.

[newman]

Playing DVD's and videos sucks in linux too. Windows Media Player plays everything smoothly and without corruption.

[jerrylamos]

I can get rid of Windoze when internet videos like ABC News play on Linux. For whatever reason ABC News (and others) support only Windoze.
Jerry

[jbaerbock]

Playing DVD's and videos sucks in linux too. Windows Media Player plays everything smoothly and without corruption.

Actually a lot of my DvD's and videos play better in Linux. Of course I use VLC which rocks. Just look around and you'll find a solution for any problem. Most of the time the solution only required a package install.

[kulturloseramerikaner]

Actually a lot of my DvD's and videos play better in Linux. Of course I use VLC which rocks. Just look around and you'll find a solution for any problem. Most of the time the solution only required a package install.

My multimedia experience has also been better under Linux. After a just a bit of tweaking, DVD's play perfectly and make perfect use of the 5.1 surround setup I have. It's been much less choppy too; there isn't as much crap running in the background to take resources away from the playback. Music sounds richer to me under XMMS than it ever did under Windoze Media, and that is due to Linux not downconverting the sampling rate the way XP, at least, does by default, and I was even able to hack the X11.xorg file to force the sound output through all 5 speakers, even if the source was only stereo.

[Hopworks]

To those who still have Windows, when can you get rid of it?

When I know all my hardware will work on my Linux box. Specifically, my HVR-1600, but then it just marginally works on my Windows machine. I'll be a happy camper when Hauppauge stops dragging their feet and releases a Linux driver. I can't WAIT to do PVR with Myth!!!

I haven't checked, but my game controllers will have to work on Linux. My Z-Engine Fang, n52 Nostromo, G15 Logitech keyboard. Also, my creative labs Audigy (the first one, with the break-out box). If not though, I'd probably scrap it and get something from M-Audio.

When I'm SURE that World of Warcraft will run on Linux Ubuntu Feisty

When I;
* figure out how to use the back button on my logitech G5 laser mouse in firefox
* figure out how to reverse the button options on some dialogs. For example, the buttons are backwards from what I'm use to in firefox, when I run it and had multiple tabs open. Because I'm conditioned to click the left button to restore the session, I lost that session in Gnome countless times.
* when I figure out the differences in Gnome and KDE, and figure out how to do all those wonderful things with the GUI! WOW!

Hop

[jbaerbock]

My multimedia experience has also been better under Linux. After a just a bit of tweaking, DVD's play perfectly and make perfect use of the 5.1 surround setup I have. It's been much less choppy too; there isn't as much crap running in the background to take resources away from the playback. Music sounds richer to me under XMMS than it ever did under Windoze Media, and that is due to Linux not downconverting the sampling rate the way XP, at least, does by default, and I was even able to hack the X11.xorg file to force the sound output through all 5 speakers, even if the source was only stereo.

I'm jelous. I just have laptop speakers lol.

[ryseshan]

hai

1. Windows Fonts TTF installation unique tamil fonts. I have install 2 fonts manually from Terminal Windows with the help from Forum. Finds little complicated for me like windows it should be simple.

2. Application like encyclopedia / oxford dictionary.

[rdsii64]

I will be windows free when I can play my favorite games with out having to use wine or some emulator.

there is no point using an open source operating system when I the only way I can do something is with some silly work around for a piece of proprietary software.

When I get over his hump I can fire windows for good.

[Hopworks]

I'm thinking, ok HOPING that I'll be able to mothball my windows machine to the extent that it is running only to play a select few games. Basically an expensive XBOX, but with the option to dual boot with Linux.

I just did a google search about running World of Warcraft on a Ubuntu Linux machine. it looks very hopeful. Again though, WoW isn't everything to the gaming community, and there are other games some people play, although I have no idea what you would WANT to play outside World of Warcraft. :lolflag: Just kidding.

What I haven't explored yet is Blizzard's stance on supporting Linux. I'll look that up all night because there are a LOT of us out there that Blizzard would want desperately. For whatever reasons we leave Windows, and there are many reasons, to lose a customer because Blizz doesn't support a serious movement of an OS translates into $$$. I'm sure they are thinking about it.

Hop

[wolfen69]

when can i get rid of windows? well, i just did, about 2 hours ago. anything i cant do in linux that i did on windows isnt that important to me anyway. freedom is more important. good riddance. peace.

[christopher.newell]

I'm sure I'm going to upset a lot of people by pointing out the obvious. I have yet to see a linux OS that's as easy to use as Windows. Plus, let's face it, Windows has all the support. You can justify things however you like, but in the end, those are two immutable facts.
I visited the forum for absolute beginners. I consider myself to be very computer savvy, but I realize I'm only really competent with computers, but super savvy on Windows and plain savvy on Mac. That said, there are things I had to look up further before I could understand them in the BEGINNER'S forum! Ubuntu is awesome, but it's not fully ready to use "out of the box". I had to do a lot of searching to get some drivers working, and very little of it was even close to the simplicity of the windows point and click GUI.
Along my journey into Ubuntu/linux, I saw one forum administrator who proudly proclaimes the virtues of a command line interface and went so far as to say that it would never be any other way with Linux. That's a major reason people will never switch en masse. At the same time, the administrator mentioned how much easier it is to tell someone exactly what to type instead of trying to describe what you see on the screen and where to click, etc. Unfortunately, this is out of touch with reality. It's perfectly easy to direct someone to a radio button in a particular tab. When caps and syntax is as particular as it is with command lines, any possible advantage is actually lost. On top of that, it's very difficult for beginners and intermediate users to problem solve on their own. I don't know the proper syntax for all my commands yet, even though I'm familiar with scripting in multiple languages. If I needed to do something, I wouldn't even know the options I could try, whereas with windows, once I'm in the window for a particular driver, program, etc, my options are all visible. I can actually see options I wouldn't have been able to determine were even available without the GUI.
I am in the process of trying to switch my main computer to Ubuntu, but my wife has no desire to switch. I really feel that the views of the non-computer literate are the most important when creating a computer system. Until you listen, only computer geeks like us and a few adventurous souls will bother with the switch.
On another note, since it's open source, there's no money for marketing. Without that, you can't expose people to the benefits of the OS. I could have switched a decade ago if I had been made aware of the excellent and FREE software available. If I and others had switched sooner, there would be more software available, and more support available too!
I know there are some of you who are compiling point-by-point rebuttals in your heads to show me how wrong I am. I'd like to reiterate: YOU are holding linux back. So Windows has major weaknesses in its design. So What!? It's what people know. You can justify things all you like, but if it were any other way, linux would probably be in a better position. Embrace some of those weaknesses to find out why they're there (apart from shoddy coding by MS programmers), then switch your paradigm to design for people who know nothing about your system.

[mr32123]

Preventing me from ditching windows:

Mathcad
.NET
Pro/Engineer (CAD for Mech E's)
Auto Cad

etc... I'm sure you get the point. If only they started writing GOOD CAD programs for Linux, ahhh how wonderful that would be.

[sayuki288]

I'll get rid of winedows when gaming becomes good in linux :lolflag:

[mr32123]

I'm sure I'm going to upset a lot of people by pointing out the obvious. I have yet to see a linux OS that's as easy to use as Windows. Plus, let's face it, Windows has all the support. You can justify things however you like, but in the end, those are two immutable facts.
I visited the forum for absolute beginners. I consider myself to be very computer savvy, but I realize I'm only really competent with computers, but super savvy on Windows and plain savvy on Mac. That said, there are things I had to look up further before I could understand them in the BEGINNER'S forum! Ubuntu is awesome, but it's not fully ready to use "out of the box". I had to do a lot of searching to get some drivers working, and very little of it was even close to the simplicity of the windows point and click GUI.
Along my journey into Ubuntu/linux, I saw one forum administrator who proudly proclaimes the virtues of a command line interface and went so far as to say that it would never be any other way with Linux. That's a major reason people will never switch en masse. At the same time, the administrator mentioned how much easier it is to tell someone exactly what to type instead of trying to describe what you see on the screen and where to click, etc. Unfortunately, this is out of touch with reality. It's perfectly easy to direct someone to a radio button in a particular tab. When caps and syntax is as particular as it is with command lines, any possible advantage is actually lost. On top of that, it's very difficult for beginners and intermediate users to problem solve on their own. I don't know the proper syntax for all my commands yet, even though I'm familiar with scripting in multiple languages. If I needed to do something, I wouldn't even know the options I could try, whereas with windows, once I'm in the window for a particular driver, program, etc, my options are all visible. I can actually see options I wouldn't have been able to determine were even available without the GUI.
I am in the process of trying to switch my main computer to Ubuntu, but my wife has no desire to switch. I really feel that the views of the non-computer literate are the most important when creating a computer system. Until you listen, only computer geeks like us and a few adventurous souls will bother with the switch.
On another note, since it's open source, there's no money for marketing. Without that, you can't expose people to the benefits of the OS. I could have switched a decade ago if I had been made aware of the excellent and FREE software available. If I and others had switched sooner, there would be more software available, and more support available too!
I know there are some of you who are compiling point-by-point rebuttals in your heads to show me how wrong I am. I'd like to reiterate: YOU are holding linux back. So Windows has major weaknesses in its design. So What!? It's what people know. You can justify things all you like, but if it were any other way, linux would probably be in a better position. Embrace some of those weaknesses to find out why they're there (apart from shoddy coding by MS programmers), then switch your paradigm to design for people who know nothing about your system.

I completely agree with you. However, I'm not sure if you've tried 7.10, I have yet to use the command line.

[Silent_Surface]

I have been "getting my feet wet" for some time now. My first experience with Linux was red hat. I've tried most distros at least once, from slackware to Lindows. (lol, remember that, before MS had a conniption???)

The main reasons I always went back to MS was
1. Linux forums used to be very NOOB unfriendly
2. Specific software apps were sometimes hard to find.
3. Double clicking a .exe was so much easier than compiling.

With the software options available now, there is an app to do anything that you could do under windows.... and the linux apps, in many cases, are better, AND less bloated. There are now many forums which, if not NOOB friendly, are at least much less hostile.

The last program that I was waiting for was a good home financial app.... with Moneydance, I know have no reason to go back to MS.

BUT...... it sure would be nice if a formfiller as good or better than Roboform could be ported over. I REALLY miss Roboform. Not enough to go back, however.

[James7]

One of the problems is that a forum like this attracts people who know Windows very well and so mistake the fact they don't know Linux that well as somehow meaning Linux is hard. They forget the long time they took to learn the ins and outs of Windows.

My parents now use Ubuntu (just upgraded them to Gutsy). They were light users of Windows and had almost no problem understanding what the new way of doing things was, because it really is superficially quite similar. To them, Ubuntu (they started with Feisty) is not hard at all.

Since I knew so much about Windows, having used it all my life, it was harder for me to switch. But that is also because I am used to doing a lot more detailed stuff with software. Frankly even then the adjustment time was trivial (though I would not be saying this if it weren't for easy access to answers on the internet at places like this forum and others---if I didn't have that access I don't think I'd have overcome some of the hurdles I did come across).

Now I can report a household entirely free of Windows and Microsoft software, and quite happy with it and not regretting anything. :D

That's 3 computers. One old Packard Bell desktop that came with XP and now rockets ahead with Ubuntu. One medium old Toshiba laptop (mine) that likewise came with XP and now rockets ahead with Ubuntu. And one new Dell that came with Ubuntu (Feisty) and upgraded without a hitch to Gutsy. :guitar:

[StSteven]

When open office has a better calendar and task manager, and when ubuntu upgrades stop breaking things on my machine.

[Mothinator]

Stinger30an, after upgrading to Gutsy, my Canon LiDE 20 works great. (It didn't in Feisty).

[tomcat2007]

I will get rid of Windows completely when I know how to do everything with Linux that I know how to do with Windows. As a newbie Linux admin (approx 1 week and counting) there are a multitude of things I still do not know, things I cannot do, and things that I cannot fix save for reloading the OS. There is also the complication that I'm not the only person using machines on my LAN, so it's not just a matter of putting my own knowledge based shortcomings aside and making the leap... my wife isn't going to put up with me "figuring out" how to make things work, she wants me to "know already" so that I can fix things immediately ;)

I have to say that Linux today seems to be much easier to use than it did five years ago and it is my intent to eventually have a house full of Microsoft coasters.

Presently dual booting Gutsy & XP SP2 on my laptop and today performed a fresh install of Gutsy server on my terminal server, overwriting W2K AS SP4. Probably won't load it on any more systems until I'm comfortable administering... not sure how long that will take.

Present projects:
1- Deploy the Linux equivalent of terminal services on my old terminal server. This is a multiuser box so a VNC console session isn't going to suffice.
2- Figure out how to get my laptop on my WLAN (most frustrating problem to date)
3- Learn how to adminster and repair the most common problems that occur with Linux.
4- Learn how to deploy a secure Linux based FTP server. This MUST be a secure (and competently deployed) solution. My present Windows based solution provides a file repository for friends and family scattered across several countries using multiple layers of security which contains years of fine-tuning which I must be able to duplicate in Linux.

[El Chupacabras]

Stinger30an, after upgrading to Gutsy, my Canon LiDE 20 works great. (It didn't in Feisty).

Yeah? Well it completely broke TTY1-6 for me. (https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/initramfs-tools/+bug/129910)

The only reason I still have Windows is to have a backup if I somehow mess up the Ubuntu initialization scripts (like I once did to Mandriva), because I don't want to have to use someone else's computer to download a clean install of Gutsy. (I'm not sure directly upgrading from Feisty to Gutsy will work a year from now).

The other reason is for the very few 3D games I play. I'm not sure, but there's a 95% chance that Maxis's SPORE won't work in WINE, and in my opinion SPORE outdoes glife. For all my other low-end massively-multiplayer chatroom type games, WINE is perfect. :)

[holihue]

I removed Windows because it didn't support SATA drivers.

[jbaerbock]

Gaming seems the big one, though I do love a lot of linux native games I miss other games like Civ IV which does not like to run with my 3D card. So I dual boot, windows on a small partition for gaming and linux for all else.

[kev45]

Windows sticks around because my printer is not supported under linux. I have no other reason to have windows honestly..

[Vaelor]

when my printer works, and i play too many games

[BLTicklemonster]

Um. When I can rip store bought DVDS to make my own personal archives that I can use instead of the originals, thereby letting the kids destroy the archives not the originals (which they do, thank you very much) And if Lexmark would get off their butts and start making drivers for linux so I can print and scan with my x1270.

Otherwise, I'm stuck with having to dual boot.

I was holding out because I create maps and do script in the unreal engine for Unreal Tournament, but I quit having anything to do with it anymore, and removed it entirely from windows. I still have it in ubuntu (which I can't edit maps in, but theoretically can do script mods, but it's too confusing for a simpleton like me) but haven't hit a server in about two weeks or so now.

[joe.turion64x2]

The only programs Windows have to 'offer' to me are AVG Free (antivirus), and ZoneAlarm (firewall). I still have a tiny Windows partition in my laptop, only for 'compatibility purposes', and just boot in to it to keep the previously mentioned programs 'up to date'.

Thanks.
Joe.

[fizbantx]

I am a long time windows user who is making the switch to Linux for a very interesting reason. I have a company issued laptop and in order to keep business separate from home I keep a base OS installed on the laptop and then run VMWare Workstation. I have a business Vista virtual machine and a home XP virtual machine.

Up until last weekend I was running Vista as the host OS on the laptop. I have been playing with Ubuntu in virtual machines for months now and decided to give it a whirl as my primary OS.

First a couple of things that has been better running Ubuntu as my host OS for VMWare:
1.) boot times. Ubuntu boots faster than Windows Vista, and since I have to boot the laptop, launch VMware and than boot my virtual machines the boot time is a killer. Even the virtual machines boot faster, which is probably due to improvement # 2.

2.) performance of the virtual machines has been drastically improved. Ubuntu as a host uses half the resources that Vista did, so it leaves more for my virtual machines.

Now for the reasons I am thinking about going back to Windows, and why I still run windows on all my other machines:

1.) Lack of easy dock\undock hardware detection on laptops. Windows detects when the laptop changes hardware modes and I can create hardware and driver profiles for each mode, I can change on the fly. With Ubuntu when I dock my video gets really messed up.

2.) Lack of dual screen support. The laptop I have uses an ATI video card, and the latest ATI and flgrx drivers do not support dual screen and do not support changing resolution on the fly. This is a major step backwards in my opinion as it worked fine with previous versions.

3.) Lack of drivers for Palm Treo. I have a Windows Palm Treo 700wx and can not find any drivers to sync it to my laptop now. If I just had the drivers for it, VMWare would let me pass the USB device off to the virtual machine and my business Vista vm could sync. But since Ubuntu can not recognize the phone I am unable to sync.

4.) Lack of true MS Exchange support (Outlook replacement.) Evolution is close, but no cigar.

When Linux is able to resolve those issues I will be able to completely replace my business Vista virtual machine with a Linux one.

[chrisch]

First, I am to cheap to replace my $70 Visioneer 7100 scanner that just doesn't work in any distro, and two, this sounds really corny but I am absolutely addicted to Windows XP Internet Checkers. I tried running under Wine, but no go. Stupid I know.

Everything else is Ubuntuized????

[Sweet Spot]

Interesting thread. For me, I'm pretty flexible in terms of what programs I use for certain tasks, but that's only for now. I'm in the health care field so business applications don't apply to me, and I don't really even like dealing with Palm type devices and whatnot.. think they're a bit obnoxious. That aside though,

My wife needs a new laptop, and I really need to build a new PC. I've always built my own, and that will never change. I have no intentions of EVER owning a Vista machine (have tried it and was much less than impressed) and for the amount of "work" that my wife does on a computer, Ubuntu should be just fine for her too.

However, this doesn't mean that I wouldn't like her (or I for that matter) to bask in the newest technologies or features that are now coming standard with laptops and such. For instance, yesterday we were looking at laptops in Office Depot, and a lot of them are brandished with on board web cams, as well as utilizing them for face recognition for security.

Besides the obvious "will this feature work if I install Ubuntu", I have to simply wonder if the laptop its self, will work at all with Ubuntu installed. Then there's the issue of having to buy peripherals based on what works with Ubuntu, rather than buying the best I can for the money I want to spend. For instance, I want to buy one of the newer Canon Printers, but have no idea as to whether or not it's supported or will work. It's these silly things that bring me to the conclusion that it would be better to either:

Buy a laptop for my wife online which supports XP and just leave her with that which with she is already familiar, and have a stable OS that handles the hardware we need/want to use OR.. Spend a shabooty load of money on a Mac and get less specs for more money. I really was thinking of getting her a macbook, but after seeing the price of a basic one, and comparing it to the specs of a regular laptop, it's ridiculous !

It's so funny that the Mac cats used to shout that their lesser spec'd machines still beat out PC's with higher specs according to benchmarks, like the ol' processor debate... yet how can they do that now, when they're using Intel chips ? Something tells me they were always full of hot air eh ? It's really quite the conundrum for what seems like an easy problem to solve.

I can do pretty much anything (bar the occasional DVD that won't burn with DVD Shrink via WINE) in Ubuntu, but looking at things from the perspective of buying new hardware and peripherals, Ubuntu/Linux seems like more trouble that it's worth, considering that the driver problems boil down to the manufacturers not taking action, and not so much with devs coming up with some hack.

[new2*buntu]

I only keep Windows for printing, and CS has been running for me better in OpenGL mode on Linux Mint than Windows....

[kulturloseramerikaner]

I only keep Windows for printing, and CS has been running for me better in OpenGL mode on Linux Mint than Windows....

That's a shame that you have to boot to Windoze just to print; what printer are you using?

[FilmAficionado]

I just switched over last week to Gutsy. I have used Windows my whole life and have always envied OS X. But more and more I've found myself worrying about spyware and virii, even though I considered myself a savvy "Windows" user and had protection (a decent non-windows firewall, clamAV and AVG, the usual spyware detectors, etc)...

I don't know. I had tried Ubuntu several versions ago and I had a lot of problems, but promised myself I would try again. Now I'm incredibly happy. My only problems are with my mouse wheel, my printer, and playing video a la VLC (mouse wheel won't open new tabs in firefox 100% of the time, just maybe 50% of the time, which is odd?... And for my printer, I had to use a driver from a different Canon model printer and I don't have much, if any, control over how my documents print.... And VLC won't play video correctly: no sound and "(no video)" text. Argh!)

Beyond that, I'm quite happy. The fact that I don't have to worry about firewalling (as IPtables is built in) and NO SPYWARE at all, I'm sort of feeling WITHDRAWAL symptoms. I mean I have no worries and it's like WTF?!

Sorry if this is random or odd or whatever. I'm just incredibly happy with the results, and I'm learning a lot everyday. I'm excited about the next version of Ubuntu, even.

When I'm less tired, I'll try to actively inquire about those few problems I do have, though.

Cheers guys!

[stomponthis]

Games mainly as its just hard getting things to work in wine. I dont even have time to play games let alone try to get them working in Ubuntu! -- it is an effort, well for me anyway!

Thats all, after using Ubuntu for a while now, I have gotten used to it, love all the apps, and would not go back to Windows as my main OS for many reasons
-spyware, viruses etc.
-tired of using cracked MS apps when there are so many great OSS apps
-ActiveX
-Windows Registry etc etc. blah blah!

[AussieT]

for me its my video editing programs and CS2. It's unfortunate that ubuntu doesnt have a solid video editing program on par with others like sony vegas.

But I am going to be trying to get wine to run them all so i can get rid of windows completely.

[DARKGuy]

Well I recently discovered that VirtualBox has a seamless mode, so that mixed up with a good PC (P4 3.2Ghz w/512Mb RAM) and some HD space, I can finally start making the move to leave Windows... if only they'd add D3D support :( :( :(... Windows games are the only thing holding me back now :P

[tempusfugit]

I can get rid of windows when i will find some nice mixing software, but soon i will have my cd players and mixer so then that wont matter anymore.
And when my games will work in linux. since i use my pc half gaming/ half mixing,downloading and chekking stuff.

[ROJIRU]

10 years ago, I could have lived with ubuntu or kubuntu and never have missed windows. But I have got used to programmes such as Nero, adobe photoshop and more recently dreamweaver. Above all I have started to use dvd players and experiment with home movies. and this is where I start to have problems. My belkin wireless usb device will not pick up the internet using k/ubuntu so I can not down load packages. Kaffeine and totem do not play dvd's and some other movie files. Not being very computer wise its a struggle switching to what is basically a different system. Perhaps this is where bill gates has the drop on linux, he was shrewed enough to realise that in order to get the masses to use a computer, he had to simplify the programming so that people like myself could just stick in a disk and use it.

[razgriz413]

The fact that I haven't found programs similar to AutoCAD, MathCAD, or MATLAB... and I kind of use those extensively.

[joe.turion64x2]

The fact that I haven't found programs similar to AutoCAD, MathCAD, or MATLAB... and I kind of use those extensively.
MATLAB already has a version for Linux (if you can not live with alternatives like Octave or Scilab).

[Phrawm48]

For me, the story begins with my "absolutely must have" Windows applications: Adobe FrameMaker and Adobe Acrobat.

Despite suffering neglect at the hands of Adobe (there have been no significant upgrades of the product since the mid 1980s!), professional technical writers simply can't live without FrameMaker. Too bad, then, that there's no replacement for FrameMaker in either the closed-source or open-source worlds.

Similarly, I have yet to find any better way of generating and working with PDFs that contains bookmarks than Acrobat. This is especially true for generating PDFs from FrameMaker binary files (.fm filename extension).

FrameMaker 7 does readily install and run under Wine. Alas, Wine doesn't seem to handle Postscript fonts very well, so that turned out to not be a truly workable solution to my problem.

What does work well is to use the free VMware Server (or VMware Player if one prefers that) to run Windows "under" Ubuntu. One can then run FrameMaker and Acrobat in that virtual partition. (See this forum for multiple lengthy threads about using Samba to get VMware on Ubuntu to share files with Windows and vice versa...)

So, that's what I'm doing. It works great -- solid, robust, and on my 2 gHz P4 / 1GB RAM desktop FrameMaker runs faster under Ubuntu-VMware than it does under W2K Pro.

For that reason, I've come to believe that virtualization has become one of the essential enablers for more widespread adoption of Linux. That is to say that by enabling a utility Windows instance to run under Ubuntu, VMware enables nervous users to ease gently into Linux without having to flash-cut their workflows and withdraw cold-turkey from their favorite tools.

Okay, so Ubuntu is by far my preferred operating system. And I will personally consider myself very lucky if I never have to buy or run another Microsoft product as long as I live.

But can I totally "get rid of" Windows? Nope, because as a contract technical writer many of my customer's programs run only under Windows. So, to document those programs I have to have a Windows instance somewhere.

Note, by the by, that VMware once again comes to the rescue. When running early pre-delivery versions of software, I install them under VMware regardless of which operating system is controlling the underlying computer. That enables me to quickly restore a check-pointed virtual machine if the development-level software screws something up.

So, there's my two cents...

Cheers & hope this helps,
Ric
SFO

[zyg0t3]

I'll delete my windows partition when.

1. I can play whatever game i'd like in linux.
2. I can start photoshop without having to wait 5 minutes and it not constantly crash.
3. Graphic applications that are windows dependent are ported to linux or replaced by real professional alternatives.

[daulex]

for me, and as I've read for many others, one of the main problems is adobe Photoshop, flash and dreamweaver... as soon as that is fully ported it's good bye win for me :)

thank God cedega supports cs 1.6 ;)

[vishzilla]

Yay!! Oct 31st I am officially getting rid of Windows XP, will replace it with Kubuntu

[DJiNN]

If there's ever a version of both Cubase (VST) and Reason, for Linux, then yes, that will be it.... until then, there will always be a Win partition on at least one or two of my machines.

It may not ever happen, but it's a nice thought nonetheless, and i really don't mind using Windows for just the few things that i can't do in Linux.

[cybergalvez]

Adobe need I say more

[ohmycar]

I have ubuntu 7.10 and vista ultimate 32-bit on the same hard-drive and the only time I EVER boot into vista is when I want to play a NEW game (Unreal Tournament 3 bets, Call of Duty 4 beta, Team Fortress 2, etc.) and if OpenOffice gives me a problem. Other than that, I have no other reason to boot into Vista, oh and maybe soulseek sometimes because I am still not pulled in by nicotine+.

I have a feeling that a lot of future games will become native on linux. The final version of unreal tournament 3 is supposed to be and that is one of the new games I am really excited for with the exception of Crysis. At the same time though, if mainstream games do not go native on linux, I can always just turn on an xbox360 right?

Oh and also photoshop cs3 and dreamweaver cs3.

I am still new to Ubuntu, I have had 7.10 for about a week now, and I ran 7.04 and 6.06 in the past for about 2 weeks before I gave up, but I am really really enjoying 7.10, I have encountered minimal problems and the forums really help out. Plus I feel cool when I type into the terminal, especially when I have friends over and they spazz out when they see my desktop can rotate around as a cube and my dock has physics and my terminal looks like the matrix. lol.

[stinger30au]

well now i have 7.10 and all my hardware work correctly out of the box and DVDFAB 4 beta runs in wine, windows XP has a limited time before its gone for good in my house

[kaptengu]

Remote Assistance
Adobe CS
A good bookkeeping and administration program

[stuffer007]

All i have use my whole life was windows. I could do just about anything inside of windows. i felt safe - even though windows only has a life of about 6-8 months before it needs to be reloaded.

Then when I was debating on moving from XP to Vista, a friend showed me feisty with beryl running and I only had 1 word for him...... SOLD. So i started the migration about 8 months ago. and i am almost 100% linux on my boxes, I use VMWare to run XP so i can have office 2007 and itunes, but thats it. I am glad i didn't spent the $400 on Vista.

But i have come across a great Vista emulator that works almost as good as the real thing and all you need is XP (any flavor).

step 1) take out 1/2 of your ram
step 2) cut off 1/2 of you HDD space
step 3) brake your media player
Instant Vista :lolflag:

So Microsoft is leaving my boxes by Christmas.

[inversekinetix]

[QUOTE=ohmycar;3668017] Other than that, I have no other reason to boot into Vista, oh and maybe soulseek sometimes because I am still not pulled in by nicotine+.

QUOTE]


nicotine+ destroys the garbageware 'official' soulseek client, when my shares are fully loaded 'official' client uses about 200MB of memory, N+ uses less than 30. official indexes your files everytime you start, N+ keeps a dat file of them.

way way better.

[traderpats]

For us the hold-up was Adobe products and one very proprietary software program that is a must have. I know there are similar open source programs available for the Adobe products but just don't have the time to expend learning a new interface. However with the advent of VMs this will no longer be an issue in the near future. Still all in all we would like to be a 100% open source shop.

[jharadie]

I am disabled, and therefore poor, so I can't rush right out and get this brand of printer or that brand of whatever, so that it will work in Linux. I have to save for a few months, and often can only afford second-hand stuff. I've done that for years to get stuff that runs in XP (including buying XP), but it isn't easy.

I will go 100% Ubuntu when:
1. It easily recognizes and works with *practically any* softmodem.
2. Same for Canon printers, especially the BJC series.

(I understand 7.10 addresses both of the above, I haven't upgraded yet. I'll upgrade soon, but will stay dual-boot for now.)

3. It recognizes and works with my old BTTV tuner card.
4. There is a GPL equivalent to Video Studio 10 (and please don't say Kino - note that I used the word *equivalent*).

Those are the needs. Now for the Wants:

5. Equivalent program to my 'dows Wallpaper Changer.
6. Equivalent program to TraySoft PhoneTray Free.

OK, OK, the last two aren't crucial, but what the heck. :) The first four (especially 1, 2, and 4) are crucial.

:KS

[hoges]

The new Crysis game. Everything else runs under wine or has equivalent linux apps.

[eaglesfan17]

I can get rid of my XP partition when the games I play the most are supported (Madden NFL 08, Pro Evolution Soccer 2008 ).

Some of the games I play run under wine wonderfully, like Half Life 2 and Insurgency. Also True Combat: Elite has a native linux installer, so no problems there, but I just can't give up some of my games, so therefore I have to boot into a legacy operating system every now and then.

[rexless]

Ubuntu is a big step towards a fast paced walk away from Windows. Games are a big issue. I basically only play a handful of PC games - currently GRAW 2.

I've been using Open Office for years on my XP and so moving to Linux is fine there. Exception -- anyone with the NEW M$ office that is NOT backwards compatible. That's going to be a problem for Open Office.

Internet Explorer. As much as others are almost the same, IE, is critical to my work. I'm able to do about 95% of my work without it, but there are some things that just don't go smoothly without IE.

Skype -- well skype 1.4 seems to work alright so far... hopefully that will continue. It's a little slow but whatever.

Windows Networking -- When accessing a local file server using SMB I've noticed a lot of Linux apps can't handle opening files directly off the fileserver (password protected). Open Office works most of the time but others just bonk.

More people using Ubuntu... yeah we all need to push our parents, wives, kids, pets and bosses into using this.

For now I'm happy to use Ubuntu for most things and have XP for the rest. I may even setup Xen on my fileserver to run my XP... so I don't need it on any PC's.

[val67]

When Linux Will Give A Program To Record Video/audio From My Webcam !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[kulturloseramerikaner]

Internet Explorer. As much as others are almost the same, IE, is critical to my work. I'm able to do about 95% of my work without it, but there are some things that just don't go smoothly without IE.



Hey REX, there's a guy who ported IE6 to 'nix. It's a real handy thing if you're into website development and need to make sure you're stuff plays nice w/ Internet Exploder:
http://www.tatanka.com.br/ies4linux/page/Main_Page.
One less reason to boot to Win, anyway. I have it running on my sys because a lot of the MS programs I need look to IE when running the installer and won't go without it. It works perfectly, though of course I don't use it to browse the web...

[xlr8ed]

Never.

The main reason I say that is "Why would I limit myself?"

I dual boot Ubuntu on my laptop with XP and I have a Ubuntu file server sitting next to my XP box at home. The machines that I run are not built to run Ubuntu or XP, they are run to use apps that the OS's support. I don't own a Mac anymore because it simply doesn't have a purpose for me.

For XP
I do a bit of web development on the side and love Dreamweaver, I have not found anything even close to it on on Linux, Photoshop and Lightroom falls in the same category. Outlook and MS Money manages a big portion of my life and I can't find anything that works nearly that good on any OS. Zune software is another big one, while I don't feel the Zune is the perfect product, I got my 30 GB Zune or $104 shipped and since the software also sets up the file sharing with my X-Box 360, and interfaces with it via USB cable, it's fills the gap perfectly.

For Ubuntu
It's my file server and web server (Apache2, PHP, MySql) for the house. I have two 750 GB drives plugged into my little Shuttle box and it serves my purposes perfectly. I have rsync running between the two drives on a cron and I am running Samba to share my MP3's, photo's, and file storage.

The first OS that could do the job of the other with the same amount of resources and time wins for me, but at this time, neither OS does that (and more then likely never will). The only thing that I am missing is a feature that MS built into their new Home Server product. The ability to have server side based backups of the client machines. That feature is EXACTLY what I am looking for, but they don't have Apache built in so I'll stick with Ubuntu and using client side backup tools (BackupPC is not an option as I feel it's a disaster of an application).

In short, Apache, cron, Dreamweaver, Money, MySql, Outlook, Photoshop, PHP, Lightroom, rsync, Samba, and Zune is what I need and use, and neither OS does both.

"No one uses an OS, they use the apps that run on it" - Linus Torvalds

[jeepee]

I'll get rid of my windows partition when I find good drivers for the video input of my 6600 GT gfx card.

[joe.turion64x2]

Never.

The main reason I say that is "Why would I limit myself?"

I dual boot Ubuntu on my laptop with XP and I have a Ubuntu file server sitting next to my XP box at home. The machines that I run are not built to run Ubuntu or XP, they are run to use apps that the OS's support. I don't own a Mac anymore because it simply doesn't have a purpose for me.

For XP
I do a bit of web development on the side and love Dreamweaver, I have not found anything even close to it on on Linux, Photoshop and Lightroom falls in the same category. Outlook and MS Money manages a big portion of my life and I can't find anything that works nearly that good on any OS. Zune software is another big one, while I don't feel the Zune is the perfect product, I got my 30 GB Zune or $104 shipped and since the software also sets up the file sharing with my X-Box 360, and interfaces with it via USB cable, it's fills the gap perfectly.

For Ubuntu
It's my file server and web server (Apache2, PHP, MySql) for the house. I have two 750 GB drives plugged into my little Shuttle box and it serves my purposes perfectly. I have rsync running between the two drives on a cron and I am running Samba to share my MP3's, photo's, and file storage.

The first OS that could do the job of the other with the same amount of resources and time wins for me, but at this time, neither OS does that (and more then likely never will). The only thing that I am missing is a feature that MS built into their new Home Server product. The ability to have server side based backups of the client machines. That feature is EXACTLY what I am looking for, but they don't have Apache built in so I'll stick with Ubuntu and using client side backup tools (BackupPC is not an option as I feel it's a disaster of an application).

In short, Apache, cron, Dreamweaver, Money, MySql, Outlook, Photoshop, PHP, Lightroom, rsync, Samba, and Zune is what I need and use, and neither OS does both.

"No one uses an OS, they use the apps that run on it" - Linus Torvalds
That's right, if possible it is always a good thing to learn as much as one can. Not saying that Windows is a great science but, it is always useful to know how to troubleshoot it.

I can say I "have gotten rid" of Windows since I left it "imprisoned" in a tiny partition of my laptop, without music and documents, just with its 'exclusive' programs (or must-haves for me like OpenOffice.org, so it is a little productive); doomed to be alone most of the time while I am happy with Linux.

Thanks.
Joe.

[dlai]

Hey Jeepee, I'm not sure if "Cheese" has audio recording capabilities, but I'm pretty sure it is close to getting videorecording, you can get it at getdeb.net, http://packages.ubuntu.com/gutsy/gnome/cheese or http://www.gnome.org/projects/cheese/download.html

[MSchenker]

Hi Everyone,
I've been running a dual-boot system (Winows XP and Kubuntu). But I'm ready to drop Windows altogether now.

Can someone please offer a set of simple instructions for deleting Windows and letting Kubuntu take over the whole hard drive? Is it easier to just reinstall Kubuntu from scratch?

Thanks,
Matt

[martal]

Unfortunately I have to keep a Windows partition for:

Microsoft Money: the QIF import function for the Linux money managers (GNUCash, KMyMoney) does not import full transaction information (Categories). My accounts would be ruined.

Dreamweaver: but Quanta Plus is very close.

Photoshop/Fireworks: The Gimp is way behind. Maybe Xara.

Page layout apps like Serif or MS Publisher They come with nice templates and artwork. Good for something quick to put up on a notice board. Scribus is on it's way though.

And, of course, none of my Windows antivirus, antispyware and firewalls runs on Linux. :)

[joe.turion64x2]

Hi Everyone,
I've been running a dual-boot system (Winows XP and Kubuntu). But I'm ready to drop Windows altogether now.

Can someone please offer a set of simple instructions for deleting Windows and letting Kubuntu take over the whole hard drive? Is it easier to just reinstall Kubuntu from scratch?

Thanks,
Matt
Do you have Gparted installed? (You can get it through Synaptic if you don't). That program will allow you to delete whatever partition in your HD you want to get rid of.

Steps:
1.- Delete the partition with Gparted.
2.- Edit /boot/grub/menu.lst to remove the Windows entry.
3.- With Gparted create a new Linux partition (ext3 or reiser) in the recovered space.
4.- Edit /etc/fstab to set mount options for the new partition.
5.- Enjoy.

Good luck.
Joe.

[wlc3069]

The only reason i have a windows xp computer is, because as an automotive mechanic i need the program ALLDATA which i can't get to work under wine. Until a viable solution I will be stuck using windows (part time)

[DARKGuy]

Phew! :popcorn:

After almost one year now since I've been using Ubuntu I guess I'm ready to ditch Windows, but there is still stuff that holds me from removing Windows completely from my home system:

* Need for Speed Most Wanted has bad textures (WINE's fault) :(
* Lack of a good MSN Live client. And by good I mean support for every feature that the current Windows client has.
* Lack of drivers for x64 (Encore Wireless USB stick doesn't work, neither my Advantek one, whereas in Windows they do, at work. And my D-Link webcam, which works in x86 but not in x64)
* Transformers complains about my video card not supporting Pixel Shaders 1.1, whereas it does and it works on Windows fine and dandy (again, WINE's fault...)
* Legacy of Kain: Defiance doesn't even start up :(

So yeah, main reason is gaming & drivers. My work computer is 100% Ubuntu though :guitar:

[dips_xe]

i'll probably always keep windows, or at least two os's, because if something goes wrong with one i always have the other! :)

[joe.turion64x2]

i'll probably always keep windows, or at least two os's, because if something goes wrong with one i always have the other! :)
I use to dual boot two Linux systems to take care of this.

Joe.

[fenixphire07]

Hi, well i am now truely off Windows (per se), but the fact of the matter is that I need windows to run .net applications and stuff, coz although mono is available, its too complicated and i cant figure it out. So wat i did was get VMWare Server. I have dedicated 30 GB on my filesystem on ubuntu for windows and am glad to say it works jus fine. And both the os's communicate successfully, internet is slowed down coz its shared, but hey those are manageable problems.

So right now, I'm an Ubuntian wit a windows application :)

[staticvoid]

I can get rid of windows when in ubuntu I can use my tascam correctly, and can unstuff sit files. I don't have a dual boot no more anyhoo.

sv

[merlynx]

So what about Adobe CS, Premier, Audition, Macromedia Flash (authoring tools)? Am I doomed to experiment with WINE and various sketchy configs? For me it's simply these graphic apps - and the thought of having to purchase them again in a different flavor (if they ever support Linux) or installing them all on VMware workstation...

I've used Xara a bit - not bad, but learning a whole new interface does not seem that plausible.

When I can fo' shizzle run my graphics/media authoring apps on linux, I'm done with windo$.

I do just about everything else with Open Source software...the only solution I see right now is a dual boot or vmware...and neither I like that much...

[AgentZ86]

I"m finally off the Windows.

I had several computer running Linux distros, and one running windows only for my trading / charting package.

I now use MG financial java dealstation which works great in linux and now I'm finally off the windows.

Anyhow just adding my 2 cents to this thread.

:guitar:

[doppis]

It's nice to just be able to pick another option at Grub and be able to test out whatever crazy .exe someone gives me. For example, if someone says, "Hey, have you tried out Google Earth?" I'd rather be able to download it and try it than say, "Well, let me see if I can run that in Wine." Turns out Google Earth isn't really for me, and Ubuntu suits all my computing needs, but I don't see any reason to delete my Windows partition. I almost never use it, but it doesn't bar me from using Linux 98% of the time.

http://earth.google.com/download-earth.html

That link should work , I have it installed on 7.04...it is a tad buggy graphically but it works.

[sh1v]

i will only get rid of windows OS if microsoft goes bankrupt!

[MoToR]

i will only get rid of windows OS if microsoft goes bankrupt!

Couldn't say better. You can't get rid of Nitrogen in the air even if all you basically need is Oxygen.

[cancertoast]

Complete compatibility with games. This is and will be the only reason I still use windows... Oh yea I should say Ventrilo too.

[Kementari]

Complete compatibility with games. This is and will be the only reason I still use windows... Oh yea I should say Ventrilo too.
Agreed. Vent was somewhat sketchy in wine last I tried to use it (I wasn't able to resize it iirc).

When the majority of games run reliably and smoothly in linux, I'll nuke windows. As it is now, I'm playing with a linux server, while my main desktop boots to xp.

[cmat]

I got rid of my final windows partition. So I guess after I got office working on it, that was it for windows.

[inanutshellus]

I have a few Excel documents that I sometimes need to maintain and OpenOffice doesn't seem to recognize any of the cell calculations in said document. It displays the calculations, rather than executing them. Theyre not even tough calculations. They're like "=C4+C5". Weird.

That's the only reason I ever boot into Windows.

[levi_fowler]

I recently bought a new laptop. It came with Windows Vista...that obviously had to go.. so i dual booted with xppro and gutsy gibbon. Id used ubuntu in the past but it was with v4.xx. I use recording software and at the time was a gamer so Ubuntu didn't do a lot for me.

but i decided id give it another shot with my new PC by putting v7.10 on. Ive had it for about a week and i really like it. a lot of users might be daunted by the foot work and messing with Bash shell to get things working right and how i want them. but i like having that kind of control.

im older now , the ripe old age of 24 and i dont really game that much anymore other than console gaming with my friends. my main focus is making music so music software is more important for me to have on a PC.

But where Ubuntu 4 failed 7 seems to have worked the bugs out that kept me from it before, with all the apps available in Ubuntu studio. So i'm now wondering what i have windows for....but oh well,i may need it in the future.

[Desolator]

TBH, since I've found Ubuntu I saw it was the best distro for me. I've moved to it for pretty much everything, except one thing: games. Alnost all games are written for Windows, and I don't want to pay for Cedega (their history suggests they don't care to pay tribute to Wine which made it possible), but I might consider CrossOver. But still, games don't run nice in Wine or any other layer, because they use many advanced features not yet implemented. So that's what's preventing me from yanking the NTFS partition.

[zuzuzzzip]

for all the people wanting windows because of IE, here the most easiest howto!

http://www.howtoforge.com/ubuntu_internet_explorer

you have to run the executable a couple of times, it crashes on python-GTK stuff but everytime the installation gets further. It's realy great

[YoDaddeh]

Whats preventing me would have to be my video card. I have an old Radeon X1300 XGE and it just doesn't pull through that well with wine or cedga when I try to game.
I suppose the instant messengers do it too. I can't view anyone's webcam on msn or yahoo with pidgin and the alternatives aren't that great right now. I could live without the instant messengers though.

Really when I build a new computer, I am going to make sure I can stick with just Ubuntu and I don't have to install windows. I'll also look into making it a pure 64 bit system too. :)

[boandmichele]

Really when I build a new computer, I am going to make sure I can stick with just Ubuntu and I don't have to install windows. I'll also look into making it a pure 64 bit system too. :)

thats exactly what ive done. well, i didnt build it this time, i got a good deal on one from dell. core2duo 6550, running 7.10 amd64.

it came with vista ultimate. ultimate, for a 'power user' is pretty annoying and unusable. removed vista, tried to dual boot with xp, but there are no hardware drivers for xp for this proprietary dell computer. so....my wife said "hey, why dont we boycott all things microsoft".

i said okay, deleted the ntfs 20 gig partition, and im done. ubuntu only for me, and the only hang up so far is games, which i dont have time for anyway. just miss the occasional unreal tournament matches.

(also, the 64 bit OS is so useful for rendering and editing video from the tivo, and thus far, i have seen no issues with having amd64 over i386, aside from firefox graying out now and again)

[zuzuzzzip]

i said okay, deleted the ntfs 20 gig partition, and im done. ubuntu only for me, and the only hang up so far is games, which i dont have time for anyway. just miss the occasional unreal tournament matches.have a look around on the net, you can run UT on linux.

And firefox hangs because of flash, but it used to be worse so we're getting there :)

[YoDaddeh]

have a look around on the net, you can run UT on linux.

And firefox hangs because of flash, but it used to be worse so we're getting there :)

Yeah, even I on the regular i386 get that problem occasionally.

[Lucifiel]

How about never? ^^;; I just love my games too much. :)

True: Cedenga covers quite a few games but I also have ton of other indie games which well... will never see the light of the day in Linux. And don't give me that look: mention "games" and lots of people will assume anything that falls under Quake, UT and anything that's still really or relatively popular.

Bottom line: For every few games with Linux(Wine, Cedenga, etc.) support, there're still tons with none.

Kudos to Wine and Cedenga, though: it's hard work getting things to run on a radically different environment!

[bhuthogg]

I still have a drive with XP on it for a few things that are just not happening for me in ubuntu.

1). The Zune santa brought me. its a shame there isn't a way to get this luvly up and running fully in Ubuntu.

2) maximus arcade :D http://www.maximusarcade.com/ to my knowledge there is not allot as clean or neat as this.

3) N64 emulator. i have tried the Linux (Mupen i think it was called) one and it didn't perform anywhere near like pj64 which is a total shame

Other than those 3 im pretty much on Ubuntu 70% of the time

[eragon100]

I'm a gamer, and i never had a dual-boot. I immediatley remove my morows xp, after vista failed to install, and xp was a wreck.

The're more than enough free (BEER) games uot there, like savage, and i downloaded (direct download, just one rapidshare file, free-to-registet and use website with only forums to post links, no popups, no spam, i couldn;t believe it either when i came upon it) both crossover linux 6.2 professional and cedega 6.03 for free. I need windows for nothing, and believe me, I use my computer very much and for lots of different things. (stellarium to nexuiz to battle for wesnoth to DVD's, you name it, i use it) I can't code however -- not a single line. Also i know absolutely konthing about klinux or unix, and i wan't to keep it that way. Would have used gentoo otherwise.

oh and if you need msn-compatiblity, use Amsn. It works fine for me.

:lolflag:

[MaxVK]

I am in the process of moving my main OS to Ubuntu after being with Microsoft OS's since the dark days of DOS. (Before that I was coding ASM commercially on the Amiga, if you can credit that! I'm an old man!)

Anyway, Iv nothing particularly bad to say about Windows or MS in general, but I am sick and tired of having my system slowed down by the firewalls, virus checkers and anti-malware checkers that need to be run as a matter of course.

I don't code commercially anymore, spending my time on the PC writing books, teaching my son software and web development and playing the odd game here and there, although I do still need a functioning calendar application.

When can I get rid of Windows? I cant, not in the foreseeable future at least. My son uses nothing but Windows at school, so I need to be using it for his benefit, but personally I have already made the move to Ubuntu, since authoring requires nothing but a decent word processor.

As for games, well, I have another PC with Windows XP on it, just for that purpose, so I don't need to worry in that department.

Cheers

Max

[Lord DarkPat]

Photoshop CS3, Adobe Audition and Office 2007.
Can't leave them.:(

[LordKael]

Photoshop CS3, Adobe Audition and Office 2007.
Can't leave them.:(

Can't you use Photoshop CS2? I used CS3 in windows and had no problem switching back to CS2 for linux :P

Dunno about Adobe Audition, but both Photoshop CS3 and Office 2007 run very smoothly in a VirtualBox machine... I know it isn't *really* letting windows go, but it's a nice way to use those apps without actually leaving the linux environment. ;)

[DM was on fire!]

Switched-On Schoolhouse 2007 Edition, PSP, PS, and a bunch of other crap.
But it's offline and will have no chance of getting online (my onboard ethernet card apparently fails with Windows 2k), so I don't have to worry about viruses and such.

[Lord DarkPat]

I can't install CS2 even in crossover and my system is incapable of virtualization.
Run Audition and Office 07? gimme a break!!

[joe.turion64x2]

Switched-On Schoolhouse 2007 Edition, PSP, PS, and a bunch of other crap.
But it's offline and will have no chance of getting online (my onboard ethernet card apparently fails with Windows 2k), so I don't have to worry about viruses and such.
It doesn't need to have internet access to get infected. An infected USB stick would do.

[draeath]

Primarily, when developers stop eating Microsoft's DirectCrack, and ditch .NET.


Also, something approaching ASIO (thats easy to set up - i'm looking at YOU jack) and Propellerheads Reason, and FL Studio.

[JamPS]

Macromedia Freehand MX doesn't work.
I don't know about Photoshop CS3.

I have tried nearly every other freeware vector soft, they suck.

[Condoulo]

Lack of good web design software. Ventrilo. And my webcam's Mic is not working in Ubuntu.

[jnoreiko]

All I need for webdesign is a good text editor.

But I need a text editor that lets me select and move blocks of text easily. This bug in GTK prevents that: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=323886

[spoons]

I'll get rid of Windows when ReactOS reaches about 0.6.0, then I'll switch to that. A community-controlled, less buggy rplacement to Windows. And no DRM crap.

:guitar:

[syst3m7]

Right now I'm trying to get Call of Duty 4 and the Mapping/Modding tools to work in linux. That and gonna get ventrilo working. As soon as that happens, I'll be fully linux! :) Ofcourse I'll have a windows machine somewhere.. :( Just can't shake that feeling.

[LittleLORDevil]

Basically the norm, Steam and some other games are not running full speed like they do on windows. Other than that everything I need is on Ubuntu.

[SirShaggy]

Honestly, I dumped it on everything but the laptop. I hope to eventually dump it too. I just like having the ability to use windows if something goes terribly wrong with my Ubuntu and I just can't throw out the $1000.00 of software I purchased for Windows!:(
I last used XP in June, until last night. I booted XP just to update all my anti-virus/malware/spyware/adware software. It took me 2 hours to do! Was that worth while???? I am not sure yet.:-k
I did burn a CD while I was on there with Nero's newest 7 Ultra update I got. I sure do love that! I guess only Nero and Musicmatch Jukebox I will miss. The rest can go fly a kite!
SirShaggy

UPDATE-
August 26th 2008 - Windows is gone. I no longer have Windows installed on any of my computers. I had a hard time getting my radio tuner to work and that kept me using Windows for nearly a year. I found replacements for MusicMatch/Yahoo Jukebx and Nero in Linux that I like even better. I have learned to check out compatibility with Linux of all hardware I buy and find myself using brands that seem to support Linux, even if just a little. I feel that Linux is the "Complete PC Experience" for me.

SirShaggy

[DARKGuy]

I'm glad for you :D

I've kinda moved to linux, not using Ubuntu now but Arch... thing is, Linux still sucks for gaming. UT3 doesn't install because .NET is a pain to install, and all of the games are slow overall, even with my new 8600GT XXX factory-overclocked, at least, when comparing them to Windows framerates.

I use Linux to do stuff, Windows XP SP3 for playing games. What's holding me back? games :P.

[Firehalk]

I can't simply go away from Windows.

I'm enjoying many things under Linux, but still (just 1 week testing) much needs to be done for me to go fully Linux.

I'm webdesigner, so I'm too dependent on softwares like Adobe Flash CS3, Photoshop CS2, CorelDraw... I tried to use GIMP instead, InkScape... But I don't feel it can replace those softwares. Wine is too much crap still for those (already tried) so for sure I can't get rid of dual-boot for long time...

Programing seems to be an option to use just Linux for it, but still, I don't feel fully comfortable under it. I miss some tools I use windows, and till I find replacements for those (good replacements) I'm unable to switch.

Some programs I prefer the ones Ubuntu has as default. Such as RhythmBox and that Totem video player. I love those two. Too simple and efficient.

Too bad design area still holds me to Windows :(

[kool_kat_os]

For some odd reason... I cant switch from Windows to Ubuntu...but I easily switched last week from Windows to OS X....i guess its just what makes you feel all fuzzy inside :-)

[L815]

I can't get away from Windows. The software field is too rich in jobs with Visual Studio and the WinAPI. Plus, I can't do my classwork without Windows products :/

[doas777]

unfourtunatly, probably never. it's what they pay me to do. and besides, wine jsut won't run every game.

[karellen]

why we should get rid of Windows in the first place? dual-booting seems more convenient and it offers the user a wider range of options, the best of the 2 worlds

[cmat]

I do all my software development on linux. A better option for me than anything Microsoft spits out. Unfortunately the apps I make are used exclusively on Windows. So I need to dual boot to test to see if they work there. Not to mention my other job requires me to use design software only available on Windows. So until the software is available on all platforms I'm stuck with Windows.

But don't get me wrong, I use Ubuntu for e-mail, internet browsing, ripping CDs, and watching DVDs.

[jawinterton]

I am almost windows free. The only things keeping me from switching over completely are...

1- I can't do the gaming I want to in Linux.
2- M$ Office 2007 doesn't run.
3- Sometimes I need to help my parents with Windows issues.
4- Yahoo Radio doesn't run in Linux.
5- Major tinkering to get new software to work --I don't have that kind of time.

[fredknex]

lightscribe support in 64bit

and thats it



*fixed it. got it working. just wish 4L was better.

[ercferret18]

the only thing keeping me from switching completely is the fact that most games are windows only, and plus even then, windows costs money, and you have it on your hard drive free, why not keep it there?

[Bachstelze]

AviSynth.

Yeah, I know AviSynth 3 will support Linux, but all the plugins will need to be rewritten as well, which might take a while...

[HousieMousie2]

Why not?

1. 500 dollar Wacom pen tablet
2. Games
3. The occasional brush with proprietary software

If there was a nice GUI for the Wacom's settings...

If Wine worked faster...

Then I would likely say go to h*ll to the occasional brush with proprietary software. :D

I am a 99.99% Kubuntu user.

[bsell]

The OP implies those who have Windows installed need to get rid of it at some point. I don't see any reason to do this. I can run a boatload of FOSS apps on Windows and have Ubuntu set up as file server with Samba.

The more operating systems, the better.

[fiddledd]

The OP implies those who have Windows installed need to get rid of it at some point. I don't see any reason to do this. I can run a boatload of FOSS apps on Windows and have Ubuntu set up as file server with Samba.

The more operating systems, the better.

But that's common sense, you can't post that. You have to say you hate using Windows, it's evil.:)

[bsell]

But that's common sense, you can't post that. You have to say you hate using Windows, it's evil.:)

As a student, I had to take the CompTIA Linux+ certification exam to pass an Intro to Linux class. To get the points I needed to pass the class, I had to do the Lab sims, which only ran on Windows and take the exam, which also only ran on Windows.

I would never have become a Linux Certified Professional without Windows.

[Bucky Ball]

I use one program in Windoze on my laptop - Sibelius, a music notation editor. Unfortunately, there is nothing close in Linux and it doesn't run well under Wine (Sib 5 not at all). ProTools and Cubase (and some other high end audio apps) are also in that same basket for the desktop DAW. No fault of the Linux community though, down to those who would stifle the progress of software and hardware development (we would be a decade ahead at least if money wasn't an issue). :)

[Bachstelze]

The OP implies those who have Windows installed need to get rid of it at some point. I don't see any reason to do this.

Because paying for something when something else can do the same job for free is a bit stupid, isn't it?

[OutOfReach]

I'll remove Windows when Propellerhead ports Reason to Linux. :/

[DARKGuy]

Because paying for something when something else can do the same job for free is a bit stupid, isn't it?

Which occurs 30% of the time. IMHO, it's better to pay for something that gets the job done, has more compatibility with almost any kind of hardware/software and it's enough to play the latest games, it makes the money worth it.

As things are now, I wouldn't pay for Linux.

[Swenghk]

the only thing keeping me from switching completely is the fact that most games are windows only, and plus even then, windows costs money, and you have it on your hard drive free, why not keep it there?


Why not keep it there? Give me your I.P. Address and I'll show you!!

[Swenghk]

I'll remove Windows when Propellerhead ports Reason to Linux. :/

I sympathize for you! Not having Reason makes my life suck...I had to let go of Fruity Loops! I'm not very fond of loop-based music creation anymore. What kind did you make? I did some Tribal Drum & Bass

[Bachstelze]

Which occurs 30% of the time. IMHO, it's better to pay for something that gets the job done, has more compatibility with almost any kind of hardware/software and it's enough to play the latest games, it makes the money worth it.

As things are now, I wouldn't pay for Linux.

You obviously don't understand what this thread is all about...

[bsell]

Because paying for something when something else can do the same job for free is a bit stupid, isn't it?

You know, I can't believe the Ubuntu Forum Staff would say something this lame. The cost of Windows adds maybe $50 to the cost of the common OEM desktop and will be supported for 13 years on the desktop. '01 -'14. Let's see, that amortizes to less than $4 a year.

No, Linux can't do the same job for free. It takes far more time to configure and setup than Windows and can't run many popular applications and games. $4 a year is small price to pay and you can still run popular FOSS apps. Read what Mozilla developer Vladimir Vukićević has to say about working with Linux on the desktop (http://blog.vlad1.com/2008/01/22/i-lost-another-hour-to-linux-today/):

working with Linux on the desktop is a pain in the ***My IP address, for anyone who is interested is 198.162.1.2

[Bachstelze]

No, Linux can't do the same job for free. It takes far more time to configure and setup than Windows and can't run many popular applications and games.

Okay, you didn't understand either. This thread is about "when can you get rid of Windows", it is not about "here and now". Or is your mind so deeply intoxicated with Microsoft stuff that you can't even imagine being able, someday, to live without it?

And I'm not interested about anything a Mozilla developer has to say about developing, given the quality of the product.

My IP address, for anyone who is interested is 198.162.1.2

I sincerely hope this is a joke. Otherwise, it would tell a lot about you.

[cmat]

I can't see linux being a successful desktop OS in the next 3-5 years at the rate it's going. But the two biggest issues with it aren't usability (look at Ubuntu, amazing work done there) but rather driver support and software availability. People seriously don't give too much of a damn about the philosophy behind it. They want a PC that will give them their moneys worth out of that new $1200 PC they got. Lots of home users don't just do word processing and e-mails. Worst of all, it's not even the developers fault (actually a lot of them are hard-headed and make it really hard for hardware vendors to create drivers, look at the recent X.org and nVidia scrap). When hardware developers start producing drivers that truly make the OS "just work" then there will be hope for it. But this isn't happening, we should be asking, why is this? How can a completely free and secure OS not even make a dent in the desktop market? Why do the very companies that sponsor it not create drivers for it to work properly on all their system? Until we get these problem solved it's just an enthusiast platform to most of the world.

* Also keep in mind that I use Ubuntu 95% of the time I'm on my PC. I'm just speaking from the other side of the fence for once. Also I think that the internet will replace the need for the desktop OS in the future.

[Bucky Ball]

To the Reason lovers who posted earlier ...

I sympathize for you! Not having Reason makes my life suck...I had to let go of Fruity Loops! I'm not very fond of loop-based music creation anymore. What kind did you make? I did some Tribal Drum & Bass

And I sympathise for all three of us! But ... have you guys tried Rosegarden? That is pretty good and you can do a lot of good stuff with it once you get it running with your hardware. This is my major project over the christmas break. You can download from Synaptics package manager.

There is Ubuntu Studio, of course, but there are another couple of dedicated audio OS out there you could be interested in ... pure.dyne and the little brother to that which is slightly different and has real potential in concept. Do a search for ´dyne´ to find as I am on other computer and can´t think of the name of it off the top.

Have tried Muse Score, which is a Linux notation editor, but as I mentioned in my post earlier, Sibelius is untouchable for this job and doesn´t run acceptably well under wine. :)

[karellen]

And I'm not interested about anything a Mozilla developer has to say about developing, given the quality of the product.

aren't you too harsh? Firefox and Thunderbird are good products, Firefox being my browser of choice in both Windows and Linux

[Bachstelze]

aren't you too harsh? Firefox and Thunderbird are good products, Firefox being my browser of choice in both Windows and Linux

I don't consider Firefox good (and I don't know about Thunderbird since I never use it). For one thing, it is awfully bloated (and, as a result, eats RAM like I eat pizza), and it is also quite unstable.

And yes, I do use it, all the time. If you're wondering why, it's simply because the other browsers are even worse ;)

[Bucky Ball]

One word: Dillo. No frills, lightweight. I don´t like it myself but give it a try if firefox is not to your liking. There are others that are really lightweight also.

[karellen]

I don't consider Firefox good (and I don't know about Thunderbird since I never use it). For one thing, it is awfully bloated (and, as a result, eats RAM like I eat pizza), and it is also quite unstable.

And yes, I do use it, all the time. If you're wondering why, it's simply because the other browsers are even worse ;)

:D you sure do have high expectations. I find Firefox pretty stable and snappy, especially the Windows version (the Linux one still crashes from time to time due to Flash, but that's not the developers' fault)

[DARKGuy]

I prefer features over bloatness. FF is as now the best browser out there. Yes, it can be a bit unstable sometimes, but so does IE and Safari. FF has plugins which make it perfect for everything I want/need to do, and I get the best of both worlds when being either in windows @ work, windows @ home: gaming or linux @ home, since all my extensions work the same way across all platforms. Beat that, IE.

I consider the whole lightweight/RAM issue pointless nowadays. It's understandable for those who have 256Mb or less (in my country, there's ,lots of people who do)... but for those who have 1Gb+... what's the issue in getting those extra 32Mb you're "wasting" in a better program? do those 32Mb give you more FPS when playing? 32 out of 1024+ MBs?... hell, think a little.

To be back on topic, for now, yes, I imagine I can live without Windows at all, in fact, I have had to sometimes, but it ain't easy. Linux isn't ready for the desktop user yet, at least not for me, so there's no way in this near future for me to move to fully Linux, no.

Not until I get binaries/equivalents (same features or better/more, and same GUI look (or better, but still true to the windows versions)) of: Unreal Tournament 3 (that includes Shaders 3.0, DX10-like effects, same features I have on my windows install), Gears of War, Call of Duty 4, World of Warcraft (WINE is a pain sometimes), Bioshock, BF2142, GunBound, Need for Speed Underground/U2/MW/Carbon, Photoshop CS3, Flash CS3, Remote Administrator, WinRAR/7-Zip, Dreamweaver CS3, Notepad++, WinAmp, Minilyrics, Serious Samurize, HeidiSQL, RazorSQL, VitualDub, Nero Burning ROM, Windows Live Messenger, Messenger Plus! Live, and some more programs/games I forget.

Linux, for now, unless attempting to emulate them through WINE (which is 70% a failed attempt with newest stuff) or trying to get an equivalent program (which most of the time has less features than the original program, or is even worse), isn't ready for me to move fully to it yet.

And for those who are going to answer, no, I'm not going to use Pidgin, bitlbee, irssi, elinks, brasero/k3b/bashburn, Nexuiz/Warsow/etc, tightvnc, XArchiver, gedit/vi/vim/nano/emacs, mplayer/mencoder/ffmpeg, audacious/banshee/mpd/etc because they simply don't cut it when comparing them to the programs I've mentioned here.

Of course, some of them have great features perfectly suited for the Linux desktop and I admit that I sometimes miss them when I'm using Windows, but, they aren't the same thing I'm used to. I've adapted throughought all this time... but, do those programs "feel like the real thing"? no. And that, my friends, is an important factor for me to move fully to Linux.

[linux5uper]

I play guitar and I like to do it through my pc via a usb interface that has no linux drivers. It also came with a bunch of sound effects that are windows only. When I find an interface that works perfectly in linux, i'll wipe the windows clean :guitar:

Otherwise, for most people, apart from hardware & software compatability, the most important thing is being able to do completely without the CLI. The CLI should be for hobbyist tinkerers, not for my grandma. So create simple and nice interfaces, create official instruction videos online for the common folk to learn the essential things, and they'll do it. Why this is so hard to do, and hasn't been done in all these years? Beats the sh*t out of me!

[rockface]

You know, I can't believe the Ubuntu Forum Staff would say something this lame. The cost of Windows adds maybe $50 to the cost of the common OEM desktop and will be supported for 13 years on the desktop. '01 -'14. Let's see, that amortizes to less than $4 a year.

No, Linux can't do the same job for free. It takes far more time to configure and setup than Windows and can't run many popular applications and games. $4 a year is small price to pay and you can still run popular FOSS apps. Read what Mozilla developer Vladimir Vukićević has to say about working with Linux on the desktop (http://blog.vlad1.com/2008/01/22/i-lost-another-hour-to-linux-today/):

My IP address, for anyone who is interested is 198.162.1.2

I think the fact that you have a URL link to 'Linux Hater's Blog' as part of your sig says more about you than it does about the quality of Linux and FOSS software.

Windows users want Linux to be a better Windows than Windows is in the first place, and free into the bargain. If you want Windows so damn much, why not just pay up and stay on the Microsoft side of the fence and be done with it.

Ubuntu seems to attract refugees from the Microsoft mindset, this part of the forum is full of them. 'Windows Discussions' just provides an arena for those with a dislike for anything that is not produced in Redmond to bitch about.

Much to my surprise I recently found a use for Vista, it is a tool that serves a purpose. It is a means to an end. But don't complain about Linux on Linux forums because your favorite games and applications don't work with Linux, have a go at the publishers of your chosen software.

Mark Shuttleworth wanted Ubuntu to appeal to the Windows user, this is a commercial venture after all. But I don't think he ever intended for the excess baggage that Windows users bring with them to poison the well.

The fact that Linux and the *BSDs provide free software (under many licenses) that you can download and install on any number of machines is an enigma to most Windows users.

LINUX IS NOT WINDOWS, AND NEVER WILL BE. GET OVER IT ALREADY!!

I hate hangovers...:(

[karellen]

The fact that Linux and the *BSDs provide free software (under many licenses) that you can download and install on any number of machines is an enigma to most Windows users.

this is not necesarilly a feature of Linux/BSD. there are tons of free (as in beer or/and as in speech) and great programs for Windows. from the open source world, take only Firefox, Openoffice or Pidgin. they are available for Windows too. plus the average user doesn't care to make the difference between freeware and open source

[rockface]

this is not necesarilly a feature of Linux/BSD. there are tons of free (as in beer or/and as in speech) and great programs for Windows. from the open source world, take only Firefox, Openoffice or Pidgin. they are available for Windows too. plus the average user doesn't care to make the difference between freeware and open source

Many Open Source applications and games are multi-platform (you gave some good examples). But the underlying operating system (Windows) is most certainly not free.

'plus the average user doesn't care to make the difference between freeware and open source', many don't distinguish between pirate or any other type of software either.

[karellen]

many don't distinguish between pirate or any other type of software either.
:lolflag: that's very true. you should see how are things going here in Romania regarding the whole pirating issue

[Bucky Ball]

take only Firefox, Openoffice or Pidgin

May I add to that The Gimp. I, for one, know of several professional graphic artists and their successful businesses that have either made the swap or integrate that into their day to day work. And why the hell wouldn´t you?
:)

[fiddledd]

I hate hangovers...:(

Then stop drinking so much then.:)

Hello fellow Vista user, welcome to the dark side, well, almost.:) I think there are two types of Linux user, those that use it because it's free, and those that believe in the FOSS philosophy. If I'm honest, I fit somewhere between the two. Windows and Linux both work for me, for different reasons. I guess if Linux had the Hardware compatibility of Windows, and the software I use in Windows was available on Linux, I would probably only use Linux. But the thing is I quite like Vista. I know Vista is a closed source OS, but I couldn't possibly understand all the code in the Linux kernel. So I don't actually know what is going on in the background with either OS. I trust Linux more than Microsoft, but after disabling and tweaking services/settings in Windows, and running programs to monitor what's happening in the background, I feel pretty safe with Windows.

[karellen]

May I add to that The Gimp. I, for one, know of several professional graphic artists and their successful businesses that have either made the swap or integrate that into their day to day work. And why the hell wouldn´t you?
:)

I forgot it. I'm not much of a graphic designer, when I want to modify a picture I usually use Paint.NET

[rockface]

Then stop drinking so much then.:)

Hello fellow Vista user, welcome to the dark side, well, almost.:) I think there are two types of Linux user, those that use it because it's free, and those that believe in the FOSS philosophy. If I'm honest, I fit somewhere between the two. Windows and Linux both work for me, for different reasons. I guess if Linux had the Hardware compatibility of Windows, and the software I use in Windows was available on Linux, I would probably only use Linux. But the thing is I quite like Vista. I know Vista is a closed source OS, but I couldn't possibly understand all the code in the Linux kernel. So I don't actually know what is going on in the background with either OS. I trust Linux more than Microsoft, but after disabling and tweaking services/settings in Windows, and running programs to monitor what's happening in the background, I feel pretty safe with Windows.

'Hello fellow Vista user', that statement hurts more than my hangover...I think I'm going to be sick...:-&

[fiddledd]

'hello fellow vista user', that statement hurts more than my hangover...i think i'm going to be sick...:-&

lol

[luckyuser]

i'm pure linux at the moment, but i really need a way to use flash cs3 and dreamweaver - or something as a replacement...

so the real question is why am i not using vista....and to start to answer that would bore everyone here with all the crap they already know, so basically the vista experience was getting worse and worse at an accelerating rate and i was about to through a perfectly good computer against the wall.

[bsell]

Okay, you didn't understand either. This thread is about "when can you get rid of Windows", it is not about "here and now". You need to follow the thread a little more closely before jumping to conclusions about what I understand or don't understand. I previously posted I didn't think it was necessary to "get rid of Windows." (http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=5705828&postcount=1167) Some zealots (http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=5708346&postcount=1171) took offense to the post and I defended my reasons. Or is your mind so deeply intoxicated with Microsoft stuff that you can't even imagine being able, someday, to live without it? WTF? What kind of comment is that?! And you're an Ubuntu Forum Staff member?! No, I'm not drinkin' the MS Kool-Aid, or the Ubuntu Kool-Aid for that matter, even though I use Visual Studio and have 2 GB worth of MSDN stuff :KS

There is no compelling reason for me to ditch any operating system.

What don't you understand about that statement?

And I'm not interested about anything a Mozilla developer has to say about developing, given the quality of the product. Jeebus HymnToLife, get a grip. Why don't you help make the product better? It's open source, you can add the improvements you would like to see. The SDK is on the Moz dev site.

I really can't continue our little flame-fest, I've got a bunch of RAW photos to touch up in Photoshop. Should take 5 minutes. Best done on Windows since Linux color management is quirky to say the least.

[rockface]

bsell, you still here?

'I really can't continue our little flame-fest, I've got a bunch of RAW photos to touch up in Photoshop. Should take 5 minutes. Best done on Windows since Linux color management is quirky to say the least.'

In just those two sentences a 'little flame-fest' is precisely what you desire. You sound not unlike a muppet by the name of Kadaitcha Man from comp.os.linux.advocacy on usenet (Google it if the frame of reference eludes your grasp).

If Linux and FOSS software is so bad, why are you even on this forum?

Revealing that the usual suspects 'Say Thank You to bsell For This Useful Post'. :rolleyes:

And just to show I do have a sense of humour, I'm typing this response from *cue Darth Vader's theme tune* Windows Vista Ultimate (although the 'Ultimate' aspect is a little wide of the mark).

[fiddledd]

bsell, you still here?

'I really can't continue our little flame-fest, I've got a bunch of RAW photos to touch up in Photoshop. Should take 5 minutes. Best done on Windows since Linux color management is quirky to say the least.'

In just those two sentences a 'little flame-fest' is precisely what you desire. You sound not unlike a muppet by the name of Kadaitcha Man from comp.os.linux.advocacy on usenet (Google it if the frame of reference eludes your grasp).

If Linux and FOSS software is so bad, why are you even on this forum?

Revealing that the usual suspects 'Say Thank You to bsell For This Useful Post'. :rolleyes:

And just to show I do have a sense of humour, I'm typing this response from *cue Darth Vader's theme tune* Windows Vista Ultimate (although the 'Ultimate' aspect is a little wide of the mark).

Actually I wasn't thanking the whole post, just part of it, but there's no option to do that.:) I tend to thank posts that either provide useful information, or that state a more balanced view. To try and balance the Anti Windows, or Anti Linux posts.

EDIT: In fact seeing as you are a Vista user, and a Linux user, that's fairly balanced, so I'll thank you too.:)

[Ugluk]

When Ubuntu finally gets:

1. Working drivers
2. Working drivers
3. Fast GUI and readable screen fonts.
4. Applications which _not_ look like my semester works ;)
5. Applications which was not built from heap of sloppy components which choke when working on real-life documents.
6. Adequate RAM and hard drive space requirements.

[rockface]

Actually I wasn't thanking the whole post, just part of it, but there's no option to do that.:) I tend to thank posts that either provide useful information, or that state a more balanced view. To try and balance the Anti Windows, or Anti Linux posts.

EDIT: In fact seeing as you are a Vista user, and a Linux user, that's fairly balanced, so I'll thank you too.:)

'In fact seeing as you are a Vista user...' Not by choice mate, not by choice. Trapped by a chain of consequence and circumstance into Vista usage is just not Cricket, old boy (being as you are based in London, England).

'...so I'll thank you too.:)' You are most welcome. Maybe one day I will reciprocate the sentiment.

Now I must go and download all that wonderful anti-virus, anti-spyware and anti-everything-but-the-kitchen-sink to make Vista a safe place to be. [-o< Chances are once installed this computer will be DOA, and no further correspondence will be possible from this particular machine.

And to Ugluk, did you set up an acccount just to troll. Or is that bsell in disguise?

[ronnielsen1]

I haven't had windows in a long time but apparently the new google browser would be on this list

[fiddledd]

'In fact seeing as you are a Vista user...' Not by choice mate, not by choice. Trapped by a chain of consequence and circumstance into Vista usage is just not Cricket, old boy (being as you are based in London, England).

'...so I'll thank you too.:)' You are most welcome. Maybe one day I will reciprocate the sentiment.

Now I must go and download all that wonderful anti-virus, anti-spyware and anti-everything-but-the-kitchen-sink to make Vista a safe place to be. [-o< Chances are once installed this computer will be DOA, and no further correspondence will be possible from this particular machine.

And to Ugluk, did you set up an acccount just to troll. Or is that bsell in disguise?

If it helps you, I've been using the following on Vista, without problems:

Avast Free
Zonealarm Free
Windows Defender (ships with OS, much better than some people say it is)

I also do a scan with F-Secure Backlight (also free) every week.

[Ugluk]

And to Ugluk, did you set up an acccount just to troll. Or is that bsell in disguise?

If you debate my post, please proceed with counter-arguments.

[rockface]

If you debate my post, please proceed with counter-arguments.

Why bother with any debate, counter-arguments or whatever Ugluk, you have made your position evidently clear. I in turn have made mine.

You favour Microsoft and their solutions, I prefer Linux and FOSS based solutions. How more succinct can it be?

Nothing would be gained from a discourse between us. You will not change my viewpoint because you simply don't have it in you, and I have no desire to change yours.

You could almost guarantee a bitch fight would ensue and you wouldn't want that...would you?

[rockface]

If it helps you, I've been using the following on Vista, without problems:

Avast Free
Zonealarm Free
Windows Defender (ships with OS, much better than some people say it is)

I also do a scan with F-Secure Backlight (also free) every week.

Thanks fiddledd, but I wonder if I've bitten of more than I can chew putting Vista on this old 1400. Even with Black Viper's service guide and other tweaks found over the internet the cracks are beginning to show.

512mb ram was never going to be enough and, let's face it, upgrading with another 512mb may not save the day. I doubt it would be worth the financial outlay to do anything more.

I have used vlite in the past with limited success. It is an option fraught with potential hurdles and pitfalls.

My initial enthusiasm got the better of me in the fact everything just seem to come together. Nothing is ever easy. :(

[fiddledd]

Thanks fiddledd, but I wonder if I've bitten of more than I can chew putting Vista on this old 1400. Even with Black Viper's service guide and other tweaks found over the internet the cracks are beginning to show.

512mb ram was never going to be enough and, let's face it, upgrading with another 512mb may not save the day. I doubt it would be worth the financial outlay to do anything more.

I have used vlite in the past with limited success. It is an option fraught with potential hurdles and pitfalls.

My initial enthusiasm got the better of me in the fact everything just seem to come together. Nothing is ever easy. :(

If you remember I said Vista seemed fine on the Desktop in my sig, which is 1mb of ram. But it's got a C2D, and I didn't do anything intensive with Vista to test it out. Is it possible that Open Solaris or BSD might recognise your hardware? Or did you already try those.

[socngill]

I am currently dual booting with Kubuntu and XP (on my personal machine) for the following reasons:

1 - Graphical support. I am running a Radeon 1650 which works brilliantly in XP but fails to install in Kubuntu (on the odd occasion I do get it running, the next re-boot gets me the black screen of death) as a result If i want to watch the I-Player in full screen I need to fire up XP (same for streaming TV via the network etc)

2 - Games. Don't work properly in Kubuntu (partly due to the above graphic issues) and flash games don't run smoothly either.

3 - P2P TV streaming. Not much support in Linux for this so need to do all my online P2P viewing in XP (can use wine but the crap graphics make it pointless).

All of those issues could be improved with better graphical support.

Those are the reasons why I still dual boot, but I also dislike the look and feel of Firefox in Linux. Also the ability to import media from a networked machine in Amarok would be a huge plus as all our music, video, pictures etc are located on a networked XP machine.

I don't think our house would ever be Windows free as my wife has Vista on her new laptop and she was getting very frustrated when having to use my linux set-up when her old laptop broke - she just couldn't get on with it. Plus our Media Centre machine has a TV card in it that isn't supported by linux and I have yet to find a linux based media centre software that just works (like NeroHome for example). all the linux versions I have seen are just far to complicated to set up. I don't understand Linux's aversion to simplicity - but that's for another thread.

[rockface]

If you remember I said Vista seemed fine on the Desktop in my sig, which is 1mb of ram. But it's got a C2D, and I didn't do anything intensive with Vista to test it out. Is it possible that Open Solaris or BSD might recognise your hardware? Or did you already try those.

'If you remember I said Vista seemed fine on the Desktop in my sig, which is 1mb of ram...' 1mb of ram :shock:,ok I'm being pedantic I know you mean 1gb of ram.

Since I got my Netgear Wi-Fi boondongle I must have tried every popular Linux distribution. NetBSD, FreeBSD, Solaris and Windows 98/2000/XP/2003 have also fallen by the wayside in trying to get the Via PCI USB 2 card to play nice with the Netgear.

I still for the life in me can't workout why Vista works at all. It is using the same driver CD that game with the Netgear package, Windows 98 through 2003 display an aversion to the provided software. A little twist of irony is that the driver CD does not have a specific Vista driver, when it asks for an install location I just point it towards the CD.

My dilemma remains. I have a machine with Wi-Fi that functions perfectly, but an operating system with a performance that degrades as you watch.

What should I try next, MS-DOS?

[rockface]

I am currently dual booting with Kubuntu and XP (on my personal machine) for the following reasons:

1 - Graphical support. I am running a Radeon 1650 which works brilliantly in XP but fails to install in Kubuntu (on the odd occasion I do get it running, the next re-boot gets me the black screen of death) as a result If i want to watch the I-Player in full screen I need to fire up XP (same for streaming TV via the network etc)

2 - Games. Don't work properly in Kubuntu (partly due to the above graphic issues) and flash games don't run smoothly either.

3 - P2P TV streaming. Not much support in Linux for this so need to do all my online P2P viewing in XP (can use wine but the crap graphics make it pointless).

All of those issues could be improved with better graphical support.

Those are the reasons why I still dual boot, but I also dislike the look and feel of Firefox in Linux. Also the ability to import media from a networked machine in Amarok would be a huge plus as all our music, video, pictures etc are located on a networked XP machine.

I don't think our house would ever be Windows free as my wife has Vista on her new laptop and she was getting very frustrated when having to use my linux set-up when her old laptop broke - she just couldn't get on with it. Plus our Media Centre machine has a TV card in it that isn't supported by linux and I have yet to find a linux based media centre software that just works (like NeroHome for example). all the linux versions I have seen are just far to complicated to set up. I don't understand Linux's aversion to simplicity - but that's for another thread.

Sometimes it is best to bite the bullet and go with the solution that solves your problem, in this case Windows. Most of your hardware was designed with Windows in mind thus has the correct drivers to begin with.

Linux supports hardware combinations both ancient and modern that Vista and even XP could never do. The printer that still has value with XP but has no drivers for Vista is a scenario repeated after each major Windows release.

If you build a machine from scratch with parts known to work well with Linux (the internet is replete with hardware compatibility lists and guides for Linux) you stand a fighting chance. Don't blame Linux if your device fails to function as it does under Windows, point that accusing finger at the hardware vendor or OEM.

Linux does not have an aversion to simplicity (but it could be better in many cases), but it does have an aversion to people that expect Linux to be Windows.

[fiddledd]

'If you remember I said Vista seemed fine on the Desktop in my sig, which is 1mb of ram...' 1mb of ram :shock:,ok I'm being pedantic I know you mean 1gb of ram.

Since I got my Netgear Wi-Fi boondongle I must have tried every popular Linux distribution. NetBSD, FreeBSD, Solaris and Windows 98/2000/XP/2003 have also fallen by the wayside in trying to get the Via PCI USB 2 card to play nice with the Netgear.

I still for the life in me can't workout why Vista works at all. It is using the same driver CD that game with the Netgear package, Windows 98 through 2003 display an aversion to the provided software. A little twist of irony is that the driver CD does not have a specific Vista driver, when it asks for an install location I just point it towards the CD.

My dilemma remains. I have a machine with Wi-Fi that functions perfectly, but an operating system with a performance that degrades as you watch.

What should I try next, MS-DOS?

I'll leave the "mb" in my post, see if anyone else notices it.:)

I suppose you could Haiku or ReactOS, but I doubt they'll recognise your Wifi either. The only other option I know of is converting Windows Server 2008 to a workstation, but that would mean buying another OS, a bit drastic seeing as a new card would be cheaper.:)

[rockface]

I'll leave the "mb" in my post, see if anyone else notices it.:)

I suppose you could Haiku or ReactOS, but I doubt they'll recognise your Wifi either. The only other option I know of is converting Windows Server 2008 to a workstation, but that would mean buying another OS, a bit drastic seeing as a new card would be cheaper.:)

I know in principle that if my Wi-Fi contraption of almost Heath Robinson proportions works with Vista, 2008 should not be such a big stretch.

Microsoft provides a time-limited trial version of Windows Server 2008 to try out. Or I could just blow all my savings and purchase it at Aria with a price of *searches Aria's website* ouch, that hurts!

Best I can do is live with the knowledge that the Netgear is worth more than the computer in which it is plugged...now that concept has washed over my brain I feel somewhat strange.

[MegaJim]

When decent proprietary games start being realeased on Linux, until then I need to keep windows for battlefield or whatever new pixelated goodness has been released.

[Ugluk]

I prefer ... FOSS based solutions.
Fights are for fools and kids :) FOSS spirit has nothing to do with capitalistic commonplaces like 'You've got what you paid for'. The fact that I do something for free in my spare-time doesn't mitigate my responsibility for quality and my good name. Free doesn't stand for lacking usability and ergonomics.

[rockface]

Fights are for fools and kids :) FOSS spirit has nothing to do with capitalistic commonplaces like 'You've got what you paid for'. The fact that I do something for free in my spare-time doesn't mitigate my responsibility for quality and my good name. Free doesn't stand for lacking usability and ergonomics.

'Location: Ivory Tower' How apt...that conveys more than anyone could say in mere words. I also see you attended the 'Steve Ballmer Charm School'. Old Monkey Boy would be proud.

Hey it's Friday and even Microsoft drones like to party. ;-)

[NightCrawler03X]

To those who still have Windows, when can you get rid of it?
I really don't understand the logic of this statement. You're implying that if you have Ubuntu or other distro, then Windows is worthless. Windows has it's place, and in many ways I cosnider Windows to be better; better video support, better sound API; seriously, directsound pwns ALSA. Though, OSS4 is just as awesome awesome (it's what I use instead of ALSA).

I am a programmer, and part of being a programmer is catering to as wide an audience as possible. That means, catering to the operating systems that the majority use (Windows and Mac OSX), purely for the sake of porting software. I have Windows XP on my machine, in fact it's what I'm using to post this very message. But I also have OpenBSD, ArchLinux, and on another machine, Mac OSX (yes, you can run Mac OSX on a PC). It's nonsense to just blithenly bash Windows as if it is nothing.

The fact of the matter is, Windows XP is actually a very good operating system (Vista is not, though). By default (when you do a clean install), it is set to implode, but with some tweaking, it can be pretty darn secure. Obviously, configure a software firewall, anti-virus, anti-spyware (I recommend, respectively, Zonealarm, Clamwin/AVG, and Spybot/Adaware). Encrypt all files on the disc (AES-256 RIPEMD-160; you can use a program called truecrypt for this; also hide the OS and create a dummy that crackers will believe it is the real one before (if they ever manage) finding out that the real one is elsewhere). Get CCleaner and set it to automatically clean out junk files (and every once in a while use it to clean out the registry). Configure an auto-defragger to automatically defrag any FAT/NTFS file systems you have (also configure a program that defrags your pagefile, and system files upon startup; you can't do this when the OS is running).
In Windows itself, there are services that pose a security risk; disable them (also disable other useless services for speed gains). Set software restriction policies to block any program from running (except from ones that you specify). Access the internet through a proxy. And finally, make sure you create a Windows XP user account with limited privileges, and use that most of the time (most viruses run on Windows because most people run as admin). Also, go on control-panel > folder options and disable "simple file sharing", and block read/write access to important system directories and files, only giving access for legitimate use.

And, make sure you BACKUP YOUR FILES regularly. This applies to any operating system.

I understand that some unreasonable zealots will flame me for this; seriously, look into a good damn mirror and take a good look at yourselves. Windows, Linux, Mac OSX, OpenBSD, etc, etc. They are all perfectly acceptable.

[jnw222]

gaming like fsx and maplestory (lol)

[vheisssu]

Get my iPod working.

To another poster: Yes, Windows XP is good. No, Windows Vista is not (yet, though the bloat will always be there). They both cost money though, and I think that that is what will stop me. I am thinking of getting a Asus Eee Box for my next computer and I am just tickled pink that I can get it boxed with Linux. Hopefully that becomes more commonplace, so users have the choice to use a free product that is very comparable to Windows in terms of usability!

[gardengxc]

I'm a little bit of a gamer and wine and ceadaga just don't cut the mustard yet. other than that some driver issues.

[gardengxc]

I really don't understand the logic of this statement.

he (sorry if I got gender wrong) was asking what where the sticky issue that kept you from going to a free secure easy to understand and upgrade system.
btw if your having problems with media players try vlc or kaffeine.

they both have there downsides. and you can patch up the software end on both. the difference is xp you invest hundreds of dollars on software to fix the holes in it. Ubuntu you spend 2-3 hours on synaptic and the forum.

ps if your a programmer that wants to have a large market share, why not wright in a language that universal.

[ratmandall]

When I get this low graphics mode fixed Ill pretty much be done with windows

[NightCrawler03X]

ps if your a programmer that wants to have a large market share, why not wright in a language that universal.
I usually code in either C or C++. Sometimes Java.
btw if your having problems with media players try vlc or kaffeine.
I use mplayer.

[Canis familiaris]

When all my favourite games run in Linux.

[rockface]

I really don't understand the logic of this statement. You're implying that if you have Ubuntu or other distro, then Windows is worthless. Windows has it's place, and in many ways I cosnider Windows to be better; better video support, better sound API; seriously, directsound pwns ALSA. Though, OSS4 is just as awesome awesome (it's what I use instead of ALSA).

I am a programmer, and part of being a programmer is catering to as wide an audience as possible. That means, catering to the operating systems that the majority use (Windows and Mac OSX), purely for the sake of porting software. I have Windows XP on my machine, in fact it's what I'm using to post this very message. But I also have OpenBSD, ArchLinux, and on another machine, Mac OSX (yes, you can run Mac OSX on a PC). It's nonsense to just blithenly bash Windows as if it is nothing.

The fact of the matter is, Windows XP is actually a very good operating system (Vista is not, though). By default (when you do a clean install), it is set to implode, but with some tweaking, it can be pretty darn secure. Obviously, configure a software firewall, anti-virus, anti-spyware (I recommend, respectively, Zonealarm, Clamwin/AVG, and Spybot/Adaware). Encrypt all files on the disc (AES-256 RIPEMD-160; you can use a program called truecrypt for this; also hide the OS and create a dummy that crackers will believe it is the real one before (if they ever manage) finding out that the real one is elsewhere). Get CCleaner and set it to automatically clean out junk files (and every once in a while use it to clean out the registry). Configure an auto-defragger to automatically defrag any FAT/NTFS file systems you have (also configure a program that defrags your pagefile, and system files upon startup; you can't do this when the OS is running).
In Windows itself, there are services that pose a security risk; disable them (also disable other useless services for speed gains). Set software restriction policies to block any program from running (except from ones that you specify). Access the internet through a proxy. And finally, make sure you create a Windows XP user account with limited privileges, and use that most of the time (most viruses run on Windows because most people run as admin). Also, go on control-panel > folder options and disable "simple file sharing", and block read/write access to important system directories and files, only giving access for legitimate use.

And, make sure you BACKUP YOUR FILES regularly. This applies to any operating system.

I understand that some unreasonable zealots will flame me for this; seriously, look into a good damn mirror and take a good look at yourselves. Windows, Linux, Mac OSX, OpenBSD, etc, etc. They are all perfectly acceptable.

'The fact of the matter is, Windows XP is actually a very good operating system (Vista is not, though).' You state you are a programmer (I give respect), do you have access to XP's code to arrive at this conclusion?

Vista seems to be universally reviled, even among Windows aficionados. I suppose something overlooked by the Microsoft posse is that Vista probably contains over half of the same code base as it's predecessor.

'By default (when you do a clean install), it is set to implode, but with some tweaking, it can be pretty darn secure. Obviously, configure a software firewall, anti-virus, anti-spyware (I recommend, respectively, Zonealarm, Clamwin/AVG, and Spybot/Adaware). Encrypt all files on the disc (AES-256 RIPEMD-160; you can use a program called truecrypt for this; also hide the OS and create a dummy that crackers will believe it is the real one before (if they ever manage) finding out that the real one is elsewhere). Get CCleaner and set it to automatically clean out junk files (and every once in a while use it to clean out the registry). Configure an auto-defragger to automatically defrag any FAT/NTFS file systems you have (also configure a program that defrags your pagefile, and system files upon startup; you can't do this when the OS is running).'

And the fact that you dedicate and entire paragraph about applying band-aids to Windows does not strike a chord with you?

Linux has so many flaws I would not know where to start. But at least most users of this operating system acknowledge there actually is a 'start'.

Some of what you say is true of any OS, but most is specific to Windows.
Microsoft's failing has spawned an industry of snake-oil salesman wishing to sell you their latest miracle cure.

Linux sucks, but Windows is a vacuum. Make of that what you will.

[fiddledd]

I bet you think I'm now going to defend Windows. :)

There's a system in place where Malware companies depend on Microsoft. There's also a system where Hardware Manufacturers depend on Microsoft, and Game Producers depend on a new DirectX version. If Microsoft released (and I'm sure they could) a Windows version that was secure and didn't need the latest hardware, a lot of the aforementioned companies would go out of business. Linux, however, isn't part of this system. In fact it's totally the opposite, that's why there will always be problems with Games, and with Hardware. I've no idea how this might be changed.

[rockface]

I bet you think I'm now going to defend Windows. :)

There's a system in place where Malware companies depend on Microsoft. There's also a system where Hardware Manufacturers depend on Microsoft, and Game Producers depend on a new DirectX version. If Microsoft released (and I'm sure they could) a Windows version that was secure and didn't need the latest hardware, a lot of the aforementioned companies would go out of business. Linux, however, isn't part of this system. In fact it's totally the opposite, that's why there will always be problems with Games, and with Hardware. I've no idea how this might be changed.

'I bet you think I'm now going to defend Windows. :)'

Honestly...it never crossed my mind. :wink:

[fiddledd]

'I bet you think I'm now going to defend Windows. :)'

Honestly...it never crossed my mind. :wink:

Lucky your name isn't Pinocchio. :)

[rockface]

Lucky your name isn't Pinocchio. :)

:---)

[NightCrawler03X]

'The fact of the matter is, Windows XP is actually a very good operating system (Vista is not, though).' You state you are a programmer (I give respect), do you have access to XP's code to arrive at this conclusion?
Obviously I don't have access to the source, but I do know that for 4 years I've had the same Windows XP installation on my machine, and despite a few problems, that by looking after it, it's generally worked like a charm.


'By default (when you do a clean install), it is set to implode, but with some tweaking, it can be pretty darn secure. Obviously, configure a software firewall, anti-virus, anti-spyware (I recommend, respectively, Zonealarm, Clamwin/AVG, and Spybot/Adaware). Encrypt all files on the disc (AES-256 RIPEMD-160; you can use a program called truecrypt for this; also hide the OS and create a dummy that crackers will believe it is the real one before (if they ever manage) finding out that the real one is elsewhere). Get CCleaner and set it to automatically clean out junk files (and every once in a while use it to clean out the registry). Configure an auto-defragger to automatically defrag any FAT/NTFS file systems you have (also configure a program that defrags your pagefile, and system files upon startup; you can't do this when the OS is running).'

And the fact that you dedicate and entire paragraph about applying band-aids to Windows does not strike a chord with you?
Well, I'm certainly not saying that Windows XP is good on it's own. Of course not. Linux doesn't need a bunch of extra programs tacked on to keep it in good stability and security, but Windows does. Think of Windows like the prison with all the doors open (and the doors can't be shut); you need to hire hundreds of guards to keep the prisoners inside, and in order (and to prevent intruders). The Linux prison just keeps all the doors locked; no need for lots of guards, and has specific routines for individual prisoners inside the prison, to keep the prison working efficiently on the inside too. All I'm saying is that Windows is still perfectly acceptable providing you do some work yourself, to keep it in good condition; if that means installing a bunch of extra programs to do the job, instead of the operating system doing it, so be it.

Of course, Windows would **** itself up after a few weeks of use, without these extra programs tacked on.

Some of what you say is true of any OS, but most is specific to Windows.
Well, the parts that are universal to any OS:
- Admin and Non-Admin, use non-admin most of the time
- Secure password
- Proxy
- Firewall
- Back up files
- Encrypt all files on disc
- To a certain extent, filesystems like Rieser, Ext2, Ext3, etc, still need to be defragged every now and then. They don't fragment nearly as much, but I've found that sometimes these file systems need defragged.

But yes, all the other solutions I mentioned are windows-specific. But, keep in mind that I was talking exclusively about Windows.

Microsoft's failing has spawned an industry of snake-oil salesman wishing to sell you their latest miracle cure.
When you say this, I think about companies like Symantec (I forget how it's spelt), Grisoft, Macaffee, etc. These companies target users that don't know any better. Programs like Norton anti-virus only cause more problems than they solve.

Linux sucks, but Windows is a vacuum. Make of that what you will.
Yes, it is. But that wasn't what I was trying to say:
Psst: <Insert OS here> sucks.
All operating systems suck in some way. The point is using what you prefer, and it just so happens that though Linux/MacOSX/OpenBSD/etc are technically superior, many people use Windows for the simple reason that they prefer it, and that they're used to it.


PS:
I may have been defending Windows, but that doesn't mean I think it's better in general. Linux is certainly much better than Windows, but still, it's not my favourite. My favourite OS is actually OpenBSD. I also use Mac OSX, and love it.

[fiddledd]

:---)

lol

[rockface]

'...many people use Windows for the simple reason that they prefer it, and that they're used to it.'

I like how you put that last part in italics to add more emphasis to your response.

Most people don't have a choice in what operating system their shiny new PC is equipped with. Microsoft's OEM deals have all butchered any other potential options. They use it because that is what the machine came with, it is all they know.

My own mother uses Office 2003 because that is what she is used to. Plonk her down in front of Office 2007 and she would be lost.

I agree that some individuals use Microsoft products because they genuinely prefer them, fair enough. But with most people the 'they're used to it' carries weight.

This is Microsoft's modus operandi. I respect their business nous, but not their business practices.

[thebigfatgeek]

I still have my main, day to day PC (mine and my wife's) on Windows XP, and will probably stay there. OpenOffice is really just not up to scratch, especially if you do extensive graph work under Excel or tables in Word. Other than that I have a number of really useful utilities that I have become used to, and will find it difficult to switch to Linux permanently, and I do like Linux.

Printing under Linux (especially shared Windows printers) still suck, so does general interconnectivity between Linux and Windows machines. Who should take the blame is difficult, because Windows to Windows is ok, and Linux to Linux is ok, but between them it can be frustrating in the least.

Having said that, I run a 9 machine cluster under Ubuntu, and that works just fine, zero cost, other than hardware and it would have cost me tens of thousands for software alone to do the same work under Windows.

I have literally hundreds of virtual Linux machines, and use them whenever I want to do my banking (if my cluster is busy) and it is a wonderfully stable and secure system in the main (Linux) but Windows is far more intuitive and consistent at OS level and even between programs. Virtually all software have a similar basic interface, uses the same main keystrokes (Alt-F4, Ctl-Z, Ctrl-C, right click context menus etc etc) which makes the learning curve for new software easy. I know it is in Linux as well, but not as consistently and intuitively.

I also use a lot of high end Engineering systems which are solely available of Windows and will therefore be using Windows for the foreseeable future. I do not play any games, unless Freecell counts.

On the other hand, I love my Linux system as much as a car collector loves his 1970 Ford Mustang which he has to change the oil every few weeks, and tinker with the carburettor to get peak performance and change the wheels to give it more street cred etc. That is for me Linux, a comfortable old jacket, which you will never throw away, but will never wear to your daughters wedding.

I have played with Wine, played with Virtualbox, dual booting, Wubi etc, but that is where it stays, I tinker with Linux and work on Windows, and I truly wish that can change, but Linux has a lot more to do to become freely accepted.

Dual monitors are just a nightmare if you do not have the right graphic card or even monitor (EDID issues), and I have given up to try to setup my machine with dual monitors under Linux. I have used Automatix, binary drivers, self compiled drivers, read the equivalent of Shakespeare's Works AND the Encyclopedia Britannica (that is a paper Wikipedia for the younger readers) without any joy, and everytime just as I think I have got it nailed it would fail again.

The same hardware under Windows, no problem at all. Install the driver, configure the layout and done. I have owned more than 30 PC's in my life, and have currently 11 running in my study (9 desktops and 2 laptops) and have always built and installed my own hardware and software, all the way from Dos 2.4 on GENUINE IBM PC's (10Mb Winchester HDD, try setting that up after wiping the boot sector) to Vista and Hardy on the latest dual cores, and have imported my first SUSE and Red Hat CD's from the US to South Africa in the early early 90's using Yahoo and Google almost from day one [news of new url's and sites on the internet tended to be obtained more via BBS (bulletin boards, who remembers the Kermit protocol?)] up to then, all on a 300 baud modem.

I have done my share of PC installation and tinkering, with all OS'es from both sides of the camp, and from my point of view, Linux remain a pain in the butt (less than before, I must admit) to configure for high end graphics and odd hardware. It could be the fault of hardware vendors, but that is not the reason why the configuration, user interface and setup software are so oddly laid out, and counter-intuitive. The Linux industry will benefit from investing in a user interface forum where real end-users, not supergeeks, can show to developers first hand their stumbling points with the interface.

If you compare a modern Linux such as Hardy with XP, side by side, forget about Compiz and Conky and all that, and look at the windows borders, the fine font detail on a Windows box, and you feel that there is something still missing on Linux. The window frames/borders, text and buttons look Lego-like, and not in a good way, and I know with a lot of effort and study and downloads you can get a reasonably good interface, but what is needed is an out of the box, default configuration which looks good enough for 90% of users who do not to want to tinker and improve on it.

Those are the ordinary users who finds this playing with PC's a waste of their time, they just want to use it. They are also the majority, unfortunately, and that will be the proof of the pudding, if they will accept a bog standard Linux install as good enough.

As for me, I hate Vista because it is pushing the users so far from the raw meat of the OS, that you feel like a passenger most of the time. I know the EULA states that you are merely "renting" the OS, but it is ridiculous how remote you are from the OS in Vista.

I attach a screenshot of my Linux desktop to show my pride and joy. This has had the whole "Pimp My Ride" treatment, and I am fascinated by it, and it can encode a 2h DVD in less than 30minutes, now that is AWESOME!!
I would love to see a Windows machine do that!!:lolflag:

PS: How do you like my custom DVD::RIP icon for the brown Ubuntu theme?

[BLTicklemonster]

I have only Ubuntu on my desktop, but keep XP on my laptop so that I can watch netflix movies on the 50 inch plasma upstairs. (looks freaking awesome, btw)

If netflix ever gets with the program and pulls Window's hands out of it's trousers, then I think I will be finally be able to rid the laptop of the random virus generator.

[JohnLM_the_Ghost]

Windows based Games, and 3ds Max, and Sound Driver

I have Radeon HD4850 and a Quad-Core CPU... can't let it to waste!

Blender it too damn strange, but I consider to migrate.

Sound Drivers in Linux (for Audigy 4) are still behind Creative's Windows Proprietary one.

If it's anything else... It can be done in Ubuntu
And yeah answer to main question is probably never!

[masterofthemelee]

Never.

So long as it expects me to use a the terminal even a single time I'll never use Ubuntu seriously. I'm just using it as something to do that's constructive as opposed to playing Total War for the 10,000th time or surfing 4chan once more.

[jbaerbock]

My Ipod works fine with Mint, my games work fine with wine, everything is faster than in XP or Vista. Vista is better than XP (those who say otherwise say so because of the hype not actuall experience).

And I love the hardware not working excuses because that is the user not preparing for the OS not the OS failing the user!

Oh and I haven't used the terminal since installing (though probably will since I like its funcionality) so stop whinig about the terminal already.

[karellen]

And I love the hardware not working excuses because that is the user not preparing for the OS not the OS failing the user!

you know, some may actually have hardware related problems ;)

[cmat]

... or can't choose their hardware configurations like in the case of laptops. All my hardware is Linux compatible but for some reason they don't like talking to each other unless I put out some ridiculous work around because nvidia doesn't want to put a developer or two aside for an afternoon to work on the drivers.

[swankyfb]

I boot windows Vista just in case I ABSOLUTELY NEED IT.

Ive never actually bought a windows operating system and never will. I have always had copies of windows operating systems.
I really appreciate how smoothly Ubuntu runs. I use Ubuntu for gaming mainly.

[rockface]

Never.

So long as it expects me to use a the terminal even a single time I'll never use Ubuntu seriously. I'm just using it as something to do that's constructive as opposed to playing Total War for the 10,000th time or surfing 4chan once more.

While use of the terminal is still the preserve of 'leet h4xorz', excuses will flow as effluent from the mouths of 'Microsofties'.

If Linux is to find appeal to a greater mass beyond the geek audience, these problems need to be addressed in real world solutions.

But even if Linux was compatible with every new and ancient piece of hardware on earth, ran every legacy and modern Windows applications and games superior to any Microsoft product, the 'Microsofties' I mention in my first paragraph would still complain (what no fullstops).

Linux (or any alternative non-Microsoft OS) cannot win, and never will.
The few developers that concentrate on Linux alone do not have the ear of hardware manufactures or OEMs (been down this road before). If you have a driver problem under Linux, it is Linux's fault. If you have driver problem under Windows, it is the hardware manufacture's or OEM's fault.

Linux will never prevail against a stacked deck that Microsoft has spent years and billions of dollars accumulating. And this is a flaw within Linux?

Linux as a desktop alternative to Windows is in serious need of a re-think, and maybe a modest re-design. But I doubt even this endeavor would sway a dyed-in-the-wool 'Redmondite'.

A question to the Microsoft users that congregate in this part of the Ubuntu forum. You complain about Ubuntu and Linux in general (and many of those complaints are not without foundation), just why are you here?

I still use Windows, it has excellent and essential tools. But would you call Vista the apogee or zenith of operating systems?

Interesting I find no-one to refute what I say.

[jbaerbock]

Still if someone is planning well they will research a laptop that works 100% with Ubuntu OOTB. Personaly I enjoy the challenge of randomly getting a comp to work with Linux hehe.

[Reborn]

I would switch to Ubuntu completely if there is a better alternative to Adobe Creative Suite than the softwares we have right now. And when most of website and web designers stop designing their sites for IE crap (online school system, for example, still required IE to work properly...)

[fiddledd]

While use of the terminal is still the preserve of 'leet h4xorz', excuses will flow as effluent from the mouths of 'Microsofties'.

If Linux is to find appeal to a greater mass beyond the geek audience, these problems need to be addressed in real world solutions.

But even if Linux was compatible with every new and ancient piece of hardware on earth, ran every legacy and modern Windows applications and games superior to any Microsoft product, the 'Microsofties' I mention in my first paragraph would still complain (what no fullstops).

Linux (or any alternative non-Microsoft OS) cannot win, and never will.
The few developers that concentrate on Linux alone do not have the ear of hardware manufactures or OEMs (been down this road before). If you have a driver problem under Linux, it is Linux's fault. If you have driver problem under Windows, it is the hardware manufacture's or OEM's fault.

Linux will never prevail against a stacked deck that Microsoft has spent years and billions of dollars accumulating. And this is a flaw within Linux?

Linux as a desktop alternative to Windows is in serious need of a re-think, and maybe a modest re-design. But I doubt even this endeavor would sway a dyed-in-the-wool 'Redmondite'.

A question to the Microsoft users that congregate in this part of the Ubuntu forum. You complain about Ubuntu and Linux in general (and many of those complaints are not without foundation), just why are you here?

I still use Windows, it has excellent and essential tools. But would you call Vista the apogee or zenith of operating systems?

Interesting I find no-one to refute what I say.

Yes, it's me again.:)

I tried to give an opinion last night, in another part of the forum, that sort of reflects some of what you said:

http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=5751006&postcount=479

I'm not sure if I made sense, I know what I meant, but I'm not sure if anyone else did.

To answer the "why are we here" question you posed (I assume you mean here in the forum, and not here as in alive :)). I'm here because I also use Linux, and I actually like to help people if I can.

The reason I like to help is that on the Internet I behave differently to in real life. In real life I'm a cynical old man. I've learned to trust nobody, except those I care for, and animals (animals don't lie, and they usually give you a warning before they attack you ).

I think I've explained in past posts why I use Linux, and why I want to use Linux, so I won't repeat it. But I can't use Linux exclusively yet. But I believe the day will come when I can.

BTW, if I don't make sense it's because I've started taking new painkillers, and I'm a but woozy.:)

[uberdonkey5]

Damn, MSN messenger is the WORST thing about windows. I hated the thing. Slowed my computer down, my friend got a virus through it, and I hate the number of stupid emoticons. Indeed, the man who INVENTED emoticons was on BBC Radio 4 about a year ago and said himself he hated the way emoticons were being used as a substitute for using proper language.

Skype is the best, ignore the rest. Its small, quick, simple and does everything (sends files, chat, phone other computers, webcam etc). I am suprised other things survive.

As for swapping to windows, it is only Excel that keeps me there (macro programming). But I am thinking of ditching windows on my home computer (dual boot at moment). Since this will be my 5 reinstall in 6 months, I just can't be bothered though. I live with a buggy vista which I never use.

[rockface]

Yes, it's me again.:)

I tried to give an opinion last night, in another part of the forum, that sort of reflects some of what you said:

http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=5751006&postcount=479

I'm not sure if I made sense, I know what I meant, but I'm not sure if anyone else did.

To answer the "why are we here" question you posed (I assume you mean here in the forum, and not here as in alive :)). I'm here because I also use Linux, and I actually like to help people if I can.

The reason I like to help is that on the Internet I behave differently to in real life. In real life I'm a cynical old man. I've learned to trust nobody, except those I care for, and animals (animals don't lie, and they usually give you a warning before they attack you ).

I think I've explained in past posts why I use Linux, and why I want to use Linux, so I won't repeat it. But I can't use Linux exclusively yet. But I believe the day will come when I can.

BTW, if I don't make sense it's because I've started taking new painkillers, and I'm a but woozy.:)

I don't remember much about making this comment, but this is nothing new for me. :)

Sometimes after a few beers I go back to my old haunts, Microsoft centric websites, forums and IRC channels etc. I guess something I have read or observed somewhat irritated me. Venting my spleen is indicative of my state of mind at the time.

I stand by what I said, but maybe not quite the way I said it. When you drink and post responses to forums you have to live with the consequences. I have, and continue, to make an *** of myself when the amber stuff flows. :oops:

'BTW, if I don't make sense it's because I've started taking new painkillers, and I'm a but woozy.:)'

No worries. Most people make more sense than I do, even when I'm sober.

[Circus-Killer]

well, ive been free from windows completely for the last 4 years or so. the only time i work in windows is at my work, where i have no choice in what i run.

but despite being completely happy with linux, and especially ubuntu, i am tempted to move back to windows on my laptop, and here's why:


i can not get the output port which can be used for an external display to work.
i need to keep up-to-date with technology, whether open or closed source, in order to adapt to changing work conditions.
despite being able to get wireless to work on my old laptop, i cannot get it to work on my new laptop.


those are the reasons from the top of my head. and example of keeping up with technologies would be something like ms sql. whilst i prefer mysql anyday, i dont have much say in what we use at work. sometimes i get asked my opinion, but usually i dont have any say. so yah, i would have to say that that is my main reason.

i'm still going to keep running ubuntu on my desktop, but think i should run windows on my laptop. still haven't decided. im very indecisive. :confused:

[meganox]

I had a dual boot but I never had much time to spend on Linux, then I had a massive hardware failure and ended up running a Duron box that XP would struggle on, it happened that Hardy was out that week so I finally committed. Now I hate having to use a windows box for anything. I'd still like to play the odd game, but learning Linux is more rewarding than any games I was wasting my time on.

[kleim]

I got rid of all my games recently (tired not to have a social life :lolflag:) so one less reason to keep Window$

But I still need it because of :
- Office : OOo is not a good alternative yet even if it is good. I need sometimes to do Excel macros and don't always work with OOo...
- My university provide a VPN client that I can use to retrieve scientific publications. A Linux version exists but I have never been able to have it working
- MSN support is very poor
- My built-in webcam+mic don't work as there is still no driver for it (Bisoncam NB Pro on an Asus Z92J laptop) so every time I need to use Skype/MSN audio or video I need to ask my contact to wait while I reboot my laptop :(

[Cresho]

at the moment, the only thing I have running on windows is world in conflict! THAT"S IT! and I am already getting very bored with all the newbism in the game.

Support is suppose to support and not barrage from the back!!!! Very BORING!

[ukurko]

I get occasional net glitches that don't manifest themselves on Windows - I realise that this is probably down to bad routers/network architecture and not specifically an Ubuntu issue - but sometimes I can't get on to websites or post on forums - if I boot into Windows the problem goes away.

Today I needed to use VMware player - last time I ran it it was fine, but some Ubuntu update since has rendered it inoperative. There are various scraps of clues about as to why and a load of possible solutions. Finding the answer would be rewarding (maybe) but I don't have the time today, so I had to revert to windows.

There's pretty much nothing else to make me keep Vista (although stuff like my laptop's CD eject button working would be nice) - in every other way I'm an Ubuntu convert.