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krypto_wizard
November 10th, 2006, 09:02 PM
Hi,

After using Beryl exhaustively for almost a week now, I have come to the conclusion that it is not worth it. The effects can get you dizzy after continuous usage, computer get slow because Beryl eats lot of resources and on top of that Beryl is still in beta phase. On known graphics card it can be setup easily but then for many other cards lot of tweaking is required. Overall, we still need to wait for a while when it is more stable and drivers are more readily available and it is as easy as 'sudo apt-get install beryl emerald'.

I have disabled it from startup (from both lappy and desktop) and it is for fun purpose only and to show other non linux people about 3D Desktop.


What is your opinion guys on this topic ???

aysiu
November 10th, 2006, 09:04 PM
Same opinion.

Not worth it.

Experimental/unstable. Mainly eye candy.

I work better with IceWM and a few Gnome utilities...

ThrobbingBrain66
November 10th, 2006, 09:12 PM
I guess I'd have to disagree. While I certainly won't call it 'ready for primetime' I have only had one minor issue with it. Once while using my computer things started slowing to a halt and freezing. I'm not sure what happened because I haven't had an issue since then. To each his (or her) own...

ComplexNumber
November 10th, 2006, 09:18 PM
of course its not worth it. which is why i haven't bothered to install compiz or beryl and why i'm not likely to bother. its just eye candy for eye candy's sake. pointless.

MedivhX
November 10th, 2006, 09:25 PM
Argh... Beryl has disappointed me, I expected it to be much more stable...

vayu
November 10th, 2006, 09:30 PM
For me it's a lot more than eye candy. It's what finally makes Linux on the desktop on par with XP and OS X. With proper and stable compositing it now supercedes both by far.

I don't need the wobbly windows, but I do need that the desktop displays windows smoothly as you move them around, maximize and minimize. I need that the visual environment I spend hours a day on is good looking. I don't use OS X much, but when I do work with it, it is beautiful and for me visual beauty is part of utility. With the compositing finally on Linux I have what was the major missing link.

As far as Beryl vs Compiz goes the jury is still out for me. Compiz never crashed or glitched for me at all. Beryl has a few times. It's still pretty stable. I only remember it locking up my computer twice, occasionally I have to reload it. When that happens I don't lose anything.

In the past I have played with Compngr and KDE compositing. I loved both, and longed for them to be stable enough to use, but they never were. Beryl is for me now. I might need to add that I'm using Dapper.

Now I'm bummed about the Novell thing. Does anyone know if Beryl is a self-sufficient fork and no longer dependent on or associated with Novell at all?

.t.
November 10th, 2006, 09:46 PM
It's self-suffiecient now.

I like Beryl (prefer Compiz), but recently, both feel very slow (although they report the same frame rates). Perhaps it's due to a Feisty X.org update.

Anyhoo; this just reminded me how usable Metacity really is. I don't really miss the compositions, but I like to use it to show off to friends :).

chaosgeisterchen
November 10th, 2006, 09:53 PM
It slows down my system at a rate I can not always accept...

Especially the fact that typing sometimes has now latency up to an second lets me wonder. 2D was much faster with fglrx ages ago.

barrosz
November 10th, 2006, 09:59 PM
ive found the slowness to be a problem with the refresh rate, after i unticked the detect refresh rate it was the same but i changed it manually in numeric preferences to 85 and its very snappy and doesnt feel slow at all, try it at 85 or more...

darkhatter
November 10th, 2006, 10:03 PM
:confused: I don't get in any computer shutdown's, but my computer locks up(beta Nvidia), They came out with a new version of the driver so I guess I'll try that, or wait for KDE 4.

imho its so worth it

chaosgeisterchen
November 10th, 2006, 10:04 PM
ive found the slowness to be a problem with the refresh rate, after i unticked the detect refresh rate it was the same but i changed it manually in numeric preferences to 85 and its very snappy and doesnt feel slow at all, try it at 85 or more...

How to do with a TFT ;) ?

@darkhatter:

Try out Aquamarine when it's released. It's Beryl based on kwin.

darkhatter
November 10th, 2006, 10:06 PM
How to do with a TFT ;) ?

@darkhatter:

Try out Aquamarine when it's released. It's Beryl based on kwin.

:D, I think all these compiz clones are going to hurt 3D desktops in the end

theslut
November 10th, 2006, 10:07 PM
i tone a lot of the effects down to keep things a bit simpler. I like the fading in/out effects and the buttons etc. The wobbly windows I have added more friction and less wobbly to but allow the window to move faster. Ive shortened the time of a lot of the effects and turned a bunch off that annoy me.
Overall i love it.

chaosgeisterchen
November 10th, 2006, 10:13 PM
:D, I think all these compiz clones are going to hurt 3D desktops in the end

compiz was ever based on gnome-window-decoration. Aquamarine goes another way by basing upon kwin and integrating in kcontrol.

darkhatter
November 10th, 2006, 10:15 PM
isn't that what the KDE team is doing, or is that the project from KDE

chaosgeisterchen
November 10th, 2006, 10:16 PM
I am afraid it is not, what you're talking about is afaik called k composite manager or so.

darkhatter
November 10th, 2006, 10:18 PM
wouldn't it be better if they dropped the project and worked on the kde 4 one???

chaosgeisterchen
November 10th, 2006, 10:19 PM
Well, you have to ask that question to the developers of Aquamarine. I will do some research in the Beryl forums - I am interested who is leading that project.

darkhatter
November 10th, 2006, 10:37 PM
we have so many different 3d Desktops, and none of them are stable...

chaosgeisterchen
November 10th, 2006, 10:50 PM
Look at how long we are now developing on accelerated X. No wonder we have no stable results - it's a new world to be explored and I do not think that we are capable of providing stable software within less than 2-3 years' time. The change from 2D to 3D is flowing and the GPU is used more and more.

Finally we will find ourselves surrounded by loads of great effects if we wish and otherwise surrouned with an equal super fast 2D-desktop with minimal fade-effects or so. XEGL will be the next step in this development I assume. Aquamarine will do the Job for KDE in future so I think the future of 3D desktop is already in steady development.

We do not know there it will end or if it will end - but the activity in the community shows that there is great interest for a more or less stable release of Beryl up to the release of Ubuntu 7.04 "The Feisty Fawn".

vayu
November 10th, 2006, 10:51 PM
we have so many different 3d Desktops, and none of them are stable...

I imagine it must be hardware dependent because I have no stability or speed problems. Speed and smoothness are one of the reasons I use it.

I'm also using it with non-beta nVidia drivers on a 6600 card. Maybe that's the difference.

djsroknrol
November 11th, 2006, 05:02 AM
I've had it crash once in three weeks of daily usage...I haven't experienced any slowdowns or artifacts like the ones I had in compiz...

It even facinated my wife's computer science teacher the other day to the point of putting it up on the class whiteboard to share with the class....here's the shot...

PriceChild
November 11th, 2006, 05:27 AM
I LOVE my beryl.

I just happen to have picked hardware before i started linux that worked perfectly in every way.

I couldn't live without the scale plugin, and you would regularly seem me frantically whipping the cursor into corners expecting the windows to get arranged.

Fire is just gorgeous.

The cube is totally smooth and for me, makes it a lot easier to manager my windows as a quick spin can let me see everything easily.

Pricey

loell
November 11th, 2006, 05:47 AM
after i installed fresh edgy , i never re-installed beryl again.
though i like all its mesmerizing effects, i think i am more efficient in working with regular 2D desktop.

d3v1ant_0n3
November 11th, 2006, 06:43 AM
I have trouble using Ubuntu without Beryl. I'm used to having alternate desktops just a scroll wheel away. Scale is wonderfully useful. The wobble (when set right) makes for a smooth and easy-on-the-eye dekstop experience. The animations add eyecandy.

Yes, it can be unstable (I've yet to have it terminally unstable, personally), but considering it's only just past the 0.1.2 release, what do you expect? it's not even beta software yet.

It runs on my machine (smoothly and fast) better than even the most basic transparency effects did in WinXp.

And it poops from a great height on Aero.

Love it.

loell
November 11th, 2006, 09:24 AM
oh no, beryl is tempting me again, with its new window layering plugin
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpIhoLzDOTY

boban
November 11th, 2006, 09:38 AM
oh no, beryl is tempting me again, with its new window layering plugin
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpIhoLzDOTY

Cool!

As for my experience with beryl/xgl. I had some serious issues at the beginning in gentoo + gconf. But in ubuntu - it work almost perfect for me. Only once in a while, just after login into gnome I have to reload beryl-manager.

I got so used to beryl controls (especially put, showing all windows at once and cube) that I can no longer work in pure gnome :mrgreen:

On my machine only performance issue under beryl I have with maximizing firefox window - it's just get maximized and not animated.

And when I have windows running in vmware, gnome is faster then without beryl...

Paulus
November 11th, 2006, 10:11 AM
To all those "it's slower" people.

Please stop running it on 5 year old hardware.

Check you've got beryl v-syncing properly (thats the biggest letdown, it should work correctly from the start).

Cheers


p.s sorry to offend some, but seriously some expect too much from their geforce 440 MX's .

angkor
November 11th, 2006, 12:04 PM
What is your opinion guys on this topic ???

I agree partly.

I have an nvidia card so setting it up is quite easy. Also with the right hardware specs (good graphics card + good cpu + lot of mem) is doesn't slow down my computer at all.

I turn off wobbly windows and other features I don't like / need, set cube rotation to such a high speed you can't see the cube rotate (just like normal desktop switching) so I'm not getting dizzy. :)

I just have a fast, very responsive, beautiful and partly hardware accelerated desktop with a few useful extra features (scale, zoom and transparency come to mind).

I like it, I understand that it's not for everyone and doesn't work too well on older hardware yet I must say it's been surprisingly stable for me considering alpha stage this software is in.

happy-and-lost
November 11th, 2006, 12:07 PM
Works perfectly for me on my other laptop (200 cheaper than the one Beryl doesn't run on!): Edgy, Celeron M 1.5GHz, 521MB RAM and 128MB shared integrated Intel graphics (915G?). No crashes, no slowdowns, and I haven't done anything to the driver for the graphics card which came with Edgy.

Artificial Intelligence
November 11th, 2006, 12:13 PM
No slow-downs here and it runs smoother than ever. I also have okay hardware and nvidia card (6600GT 256mb with latest beta driver 9742). There might be problems with older hardware, nv2 cards goes to legacy driver).

But I still don't think it's ready to be aknowledge as an installed by default.

MaximB
November 11th, 2006, 02:04 PM
the ONLY reason I do NOT use beryl is that some 3dgame don't run as they should under beryl and some "wine" small programs that I MUST have.
if those things will be fixed I will go back to using beryl.

der_joachim
November 11th, 2006, 02:20 PM
I like it with the following things in mind:
- It is a 0.1.X version. It is still in very early stages of development and it has come pretty far already.
- It's pretty.
- I have the right hardware for it and it is smooth and fast. Even after longer using. With an older Intel video chip, it would probably be a lot slower, but my GeForce 5600FX has very good performance.

Still, I stopped using it. Why? I just upgraded my hard drive and I never bothered reinstalling Beryl. I found the KDE integration lacking and I'll wait for the 0.2 version at least.

nalmeth
November 11th, 2006, 02:28 PM
Very stable here for me. I've had one major crash, and it took a lot to provoke it.
No system hogging either, and 3D applications work alongside it fine.

Honestly I'm getting so used to the scale feature, I'm going to keep finding myself trying it on other computers.

Beryl is far more stable than compiz was, I couldn't even play videos before, now it seems a lot of the problems were solved.