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VTPoet
April 6th, 2012, 03:11 AM
[MS] is even going so far as to finance the development of Windows Phone versions of well-known apps — something that app makers estimate would otherwise cost them anywhere from $60,000 to $600,000This is the story (if you haven't used up your 10 free stories at NYTimes):

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/06/technology/to-fill-out-its-app-store-microsoft-wields-its-checkbook.html?_r=1&hp

The story is grimly satisfying.Talk about roll reversal. Get a load of these quotes:


But the hundreds of thousands of apps that run on Apple and Android devices will not work on phones like the Lumia 900 that use Microsoft’s Windows Phone software. And many developers are reluctant to funnel time and money into an app for what is still a small and unproved market.Or:


"Ben Huh, chief executive of the Cheezburger Network, a collection of humor and entertainment sites, said Microsoft’s market share was too small to warrant in-house development of a Windows Phone app."Or:



"Often Microsoft’s problem is not outright refusal by a developer, but more that its platform is simply not a priority."Or:



“We’re starting to get requests from firms that want a Windows Phone app,” he said. “It’s still only 5 to 10 percent of our total requests..."Karma. It's real. Don't mess with it. ;)

beanhead
April 6th, 2012, 03:45 AM
Very Nice !
Linux phones rule and tablets.
Maybe some day the desktop war will be won !

:guitar:

Copper Bezel
April 6th, 2012, 03:59 AM
Guys, seriously, this will change immediately with Windows 8's launch. All of a sudden, the Windows mobile platform will be ubiquitous. We'll find out later on whether sacrificing their desktop platform for the mobile one was a good idea, but making fun of Phone 7's problems could turn out to be bad karma for us later on. = /

Lucradia
April 6th, 2012, 04:06 AM
Guys, seriously, this will change immediately with Windows 8's launch. All of a sudden, the Windows mobile platform will be ubiquitous. We'll find out later on whether sacrificing their desktop platform for the mobile one was a good idea, but making fun of Phone 7's problems could turn out to be bad karma for us later on. = /

x86 / x64 apps won't work on ARM though. Windows 8 will have ARM compatibility (and that's what Microsoft wants Windows 8 on primarily anyway) but not most of the applications. I can't see game makers (Bethesda, Valve, etc.) at all willing to switch to ARM.

whatthefunk
April 6th, 2012, 04:13 AM
Guys, seriously, this will change immediately with Windows 8's launch. All of a sudden, the Windows mobile platform will be ubiquitous. We'll find out later on whether sacrificing their desktop platform for the mobile one was a good idea, but making fun of Phone 7's problems could turn out to be bad karma for us later on. = /

I dont think Win 8 is going to change that much. Its looking like a disaster so far and few people are going to run out and buy a new phone simply because it has Windows 8 on it.

3rdalbum
April 6th, 2012, 04:14 AM
I don't believe Cheezburger has an app for Android either. Not an official one at least. I use Bestdem to browse Cheezburger sites on my mobile.

wolfen69
April 6th, 2012, 04:58 AM
Very Nice !
Linux phones rule and tablets.
Maybe some day the desktop war will be won !

:guitar:

The desktop as we know it will be dead soon. Pretty soon, people will carry around mobile computers (think advanced smartphones) that can dock with any large screen or project onto a wall and have computing capabilities similar to our desktops of today. Believe it or not, these devices are appearing already.

So I guess in a roundabout way, the linux "desktop" could take over if android continues to dominate in the cell phone/tablet arena. I think window sealed its fate by not endearing themselves to the mobile public/market.

It took me a while to come to terms with it, but mobile/docking computing is the way of the future, and android will lead the way. MS dropped the ball.

zombifier25
April 6th, 2012, 05:02 AM
LOL in the not-so-distant future we may see people carrying their Android phones, put them in a dock and voila! a functional Ubuntu desktop :P
That's just my fantasy though.

wolfen69
April 6th, 2012, 05:04 AM
the Windows mobile platform will be ubiquitous.

I would bet my life that this will not happen. Android is entrenched as THE mobile solution for most people. Even a lot of iphone users are starting to switch to android once they get a taste of it. Staunch windows users will admit android is the way to go mobile. Go to any android forum, and 99% of the posters are windows users who will defend android to the death.

wolfen69
April 6th, 2012, 05:05 AM
LOL in the not-so-distant future we may see people carrying their Android phones, put them in a dock and voila! a functional Ubuntu desktop :P
That's just my fantasy though.

It's not fantasy. Here-----> http://www.ubuntu.com/devices/android

3rdalbum
April 6th, 2012, 05:24 AM
It's not fantasy. Here-----> http://www.ubuntu.com/devices/android

Technically, his fantasy was SEEING people do this. As this product has not shipped yet, he has not SEEN people docking their Android phones and getting an Ubuntu desktop. :-)

zombifier25
April 6th, 2012, 05:30 AM
It's not fantasy. Here-----> http://www.ubuntu.com/devices/android
Being a hardcore Ubuntu fan I knew that already :P
Like what 3rdalbum said:


Technically, his fantasy was SEEING people do this. As this product has not shipped yet, he has not SEEN people docking their Android phones and getting an Ubuntu desktop. :smile:

lancest
April 6th, 2012, 11:14 AM
Linux is Android. (to those of you from Rio Linda).

Lucradia
April 6th, 2012, 07:13 PM
Linux is Android. (to those of you from Rio Linda).

Android is a distribution of the Linux Kernel (Like Ubutnu, Fedora, Debian, etc.), so it's actually the other way.

lancest
April 7th, 2012, 01:31 AM
Android is a distribution of the Linux Kernel (Like Ubutnu, Fedora, Debian, etc.), so it's actually the other way.

It's all good- the power of free software.

VTPoet
April 18th, 2012, 12:17 AM
Just in (http://www.osnews.com/comments/25829):

"...if the Lumia with the same hardware came with Android in it and not Windows, it would be much easier to sell..."

Windows really *is* the new Linux.

MGaddict2000
April 18th, 2012, 11:27 AM
The desktop as we know it will be dead soon. Pretty soon, people will carry around mobile computers (think advanced smartphones) that can dock with any large screen or project onto a wall and have computing capabilities similar to our desktops of today. Believe it or not, these devices are appearing already.

So I guess in a roundabout way, the linux "desktop" could take over if android continues to dominate in the cell phone/tablet arena. I think window sealed its fate by not endearing themselves to the mobile public/market.

It took me a while to come to terms with it, but mobile/docking computing is the way of the future, and android will lead the way. MS dropped the ball.
What are you talking about? I'm on my android running Ubuntu 10.04 right now. What future?

In lighter news, does anybody care that Android is not Linux? It's not successful due to Open Source freedom of information. It's because it's BSD and mostly closed source. Not really a win for Linux. Unix maybe, which already held a torch over Microsoft 30 years ago. So it's simply regaining strength. The idea of Open Source, which is the whole point of Linux, doesn't exist. Not in the fashion it was dreampt.

VTPoet
April 18th, 2012, 05:10 PM
In lighter news, does anybody care that Android is not Linux?

Huh? No. It's not BSD. It's linux. The "Google" kernel will be re-merging with the linux kernel within the year. They're the same.

Copper Bezel
April 18th, 2012, 07:44 PM
I momentarily thought he meant that the non-Linux parts were released under the BSD license, but they're actually under Apache.

The kernel hardly matters - "desktop Linux" is really GNU, and Android is another operating system that uses the same kernel. But Android is definitely open source, even if the Play Store isn't.

jwbrase
April 19th, 2012, 10:01 PM
The desktop as we know it will be dead soon. Pretty soon, people will carry around mobile computers (think advanced smartphones) that can dock with any large screen or project onto a wall and have computing capabilities similar to our desktops of today. Believe it or not, these devices are appearing already.

Yes and no. Certainly the desktop *machine* will be dead soon, or relegated to certain niches like the mainframe is now. That's Moore's law for you.

But I don't think that the desktop people are talking about when they say "20xx will be the year of the Linux desktop", in other words, the GUI style we call the "desktop", is going anywhere soon.

Mobile interfaces are great when you're on the move, but when my mobile device is docked and hooked up to a mouse, keyboard, and monitor, I don't want to be interacting with it through that same interface. I want an interface as close to GNOME 2 as possible (in terms of how it interacts with the user).

Mobile devices will inherit the desktop (interface) from the desktop (machine), and as long as Android continues to dominate that market, we will eventually see the year of the Linux desktop.

The scenario is a replay of "the attack of the killer micros" that brought DOS and Windows to the forefront.



So I guess in a roundabout way, the linux "desktop" could take over if android continues to dominate in the cell phone/tablet arena.

Not just could, will.


I think window sealed its fate by not endearing themselves to the mobile public/market.

And even worse, having realized this, they've misjudged their next step.

Mistake #1: They're trying to unify the interfaces used in mobile and desktop computing, instead of making sure that mobile devices have dual interfaces suitable for both paradigms.

Mistake #2: They're trying to do this by bringing the mobile interface to the desktop machine, rather than bringing the desktop interface to mobile devices.

lancest
April 19th, 2012, 11:44 PM
In my view, key adopters have a certain resistance to Microsoft gaining a foothold in mobile. Not this time!

drdos2006
April 20th, 2012, 01:03 AM
To MGaddict2000:

I would like to ask a couple of questions regarding how you were able to install Ubuntu over Android.
What device do you have ? I have a Renesas device 7" tablet from DealExtreme.
Did you backup the ROM first ?

I tried the shell install program from ehow.com but could not get it to install. I had installed Eclipse and Android SDK on Ubuntu 10.4 and was able to install APK files on the tablet. I checked out the ehow.com forums plus XDA-Developer forums as well.


regards

tmaranets
April 20th, 2012, 01:23 AM
I have tried Windows 8. The new version will bring competition tough between the two. Windows is not the Linux. Linux is its own.

dzponce11
April 20th, 2012, 02:32 AM
I have tried Windows 8. The new version will bring competition tough between the two. Windows is not the Linux. Linux is its own.

Well said.

sola
May 16th, 2012, 01:54 PM
And even worse, having realized this, they've misjudged their next step.

Mistake #1: They're trying to unify the interfaces used in mobile and desktop computing, instead of making sure that mobile devices have dual interfaces suitable for both paradigms.

Mistake #2: They're trying to do this by bringing the mobile interface to the desktop machine, rather than bringing the desktop interface to mobile devices.

You are absolutely right. Microsoft is trying to unify the two interface types which I also think is impossible. Touch is good for a tablet, keyboard+mouse is good for the desktop and there is not much passage between them.

I also predict Win8 and WinRT a limited success at best and a big fail at worst. In fact, I wouldn't even buy an Android device with a locked bootloader (all WinRT devices will have locked bootloaders).

Ubuntu for Android (UfA) on the other hand is absolutely the right way. You have the Android touch interface when you use the device in hand and you switch to the proper desktop when you get a proper display+keyboard+mouse.

Ubuntu for Android looks like really great. I wish it was already on the market.

Canonical seems to be concentrating on phones with UfA, I hope they will consider tablet/netbook hybrids like the Transformer Prime. I would LOVE to have Ubuntu on that machine.

rg4w
May 16th, 2012, 02:37 PM
Yes and no. Certainly the desktop *machine* will be dead soon, or relegated to certain niches like the mainframe is now.
What we used to call "Mainframes" are now called "Cloud Servers", and what we used to call "Dumb Terminals" are now "Zero Clients".

Everything old is new again. :)

rai4shu2
May 16th, 2012, 08:36 PM
Calling Windows Linux is an insult to Linux. Windows has and always will be the Edsel (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edsel) of the computer world. The ONLY reason anyone uses Windows is because Bill Gates was born rich.

codingman
May 16th, 2012, 08:54 PM
The desktop as we know it will be dead soon. Pretty soon, people will carry around mobile computers (think advanced smartphones) that can dock with any large screen or project onto a wall and have computing capabilities similar to our desktops of today. Believe it or not, these devices are appearing already.

So I guess in a roundabout way, the linux "desktop" could take over if android continues to dominate in the cell phone/tablet arena. I think window sealed its fate by not endearing themselves to the mobile public/market.

It took me a while to come to terms with it, but mobile/docking computing is the way of the future, and android will lead the way. MS dropped the ball.

How are people going to actually DO stuff then? Mobile devices suck now and will never be better than a desktop, but if people keep on going on this Windows track, the desktop war WILL be over.

CharlesA
May 16th, 2012, 09:49 PM
The ONLY reason anyone uses Windows is because Bill Gates was born rich.
Citation Needed. (http://xkcd.com/285/)

You wouldn't be interested in the Pirates of Silicon Valley (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0168122/), now would you?

Jay Car
May 16th, 2012, 11:54 PM
Windows is the new Linux?

So, does that mean that Windows isn't ready for grandma yet?

:)

jwbrase
May 17th, 2012, 12:00 AM
What we used to call "Mainframes" are now called "Cloud Servers", and what we used to call "Dumb Terminals" are now "Zero Clients".

Everything old is new again. :)

No, most cloud servers are much smaller, physically, than mainframes ever were. I'm talking about mainframes as a size-class of computers. They're only used nowadays in a few niches, and even then, they've shrunk to about the size of what used to be called "minicomputers".


How are people going to actually DO stuff then? Mobile devices suck now and will never be better than a desktop,

That's pretty much what people were saying about PC's 30 years ago.

If you're talking about the lack of computing power that mobile devices have, keep in mind that todays smartphones have the computing power of the desktops of a decade ago. Yes, within any given generation of computers you can add computing power by making the computer larger by adding RAM, extra processors, etc, but you eventually hit a point of diminishing returns as far as the amount of computing power you can get my making your machine bigger, and as technology marches on, that point of diminishing returns happens at a smaller and smaller machine size. Eventually, desktops, and even laptops, won't add enough computing power per extra dollar you spend on them to be worth it, and we'll all be using smartphones and tablets.

If you're talking about interface issues with mobile devices (e.g, it's really hard to write a paper for English class on a phone's touchscreen), keep in mind that these can be solved by designing your device to be able to dock to a desktop-sized keyboard-mouse-and-monitor setup. So even though we'll all be using smartphones instead of desktops in 10 or 20 years, we'll be using them like desktops unless we're on the move.

codingman
May 17th, 2012, 02:07 AM
No, most cloud servers are much smaller, physically, than mainframes ever were. I'm talking about mainframes as a size-class of computers. They're only used nowadays in a few niches, and even then, they've shrunk to about the size of what used to be called "minicomputers".



That's pretty much what people were saying about PC's 30 years ago.

If you're talking about the lack of computing power that mobile devices have, keep in mind that todays smartphones have the computing power of the desktops of a decade ago. Yes, within any given generation of computers you can add computing power by making the computer larger by adding RAM, extra processors, etc, but you eventually hit a point of diminishing returns as far as the amount of computing power you can get my making your machine bigger, and as technology marches on, that point of diminishing returns happens at a smaller and smaller machine size. Eventually, desktops, and even laptops, won't add enough computing power per extra dollar you spend on them to be worth it, and we'll all be using smartphones and tablets.

If you're talking about interface issues with mobile devices (e.g, it's really hard to write a paper for English class on a phone's touchscreen), keep in mind that these can be solved by designing your device to be able to dock to a desktop-sized keyboard-mouse-and-monitor setup. So even though we'll all be using smartphones instead of desktops in 10 or 20 years, we'll be using them like desktops unless we're on the move.

I'm still saying it 30 years later, where's the fun in using mobile devices? Can't OC 'em, can't really work on then and realize that you could have been using a much better computer that would have the same portability. If everything goes in that direction, i'll stay with my Athlon and never upgrade. I might not even get a computer, or I'll just keep my rigs and sell 'em for a billion bucks when i'm about to die, and give the money to the next generation.

Skara Brae
May 20th, 2012, 11:57 PM
I have a Samsung Galaxy S with Android 2.2; it says Kernel version 2.6.32.9 - that's a Linux kernel, right?

What exactly _is_ Android? Someone told me that Android is "only" Java?

I, for one, will never buy a cellphone with Windows. Windows on my computers is/was already bad enough, and now on a cellphone? I'd rather buy an overpriced iPhone.

sola
May 21st, 2012, 10:38 AM
Android is a custom Linux distro.

It is built like this:
- The Linux kernel
- Some kernel customization by Google (power optimalization and such)
- A touch oriented user interface developed by Google
- A Java-like application execution environment called Dalvik (mostly by Google)
- A lot of libraries for hw access

You can write Android applications in the Java language, using a set of core/standard Java libraries. You also use Android's own libraries for hw interaction and GUI development (this is non-standard, non-Java libraries).

The Android applications are executed in Dalvik which is not a Java VM although it is a distant cousin of Java. Dalvik is much slower than modern Java VMs.

So Android OS is not really based on Java although it uses some Java libraries and the Android SDK is a Java IDE (Eclipse).