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View Full Version : Do you think Ubuntu developers are inspired by OS X design



asifnaz
December 12th, 2010, 05:52 AM
In my humble opinion Ubuntu developers must had some inspiration of OS X in some corner of their mind . The look , aesthetics , feel and to some extent functions of Ubuntu are quite similar to that of OS X .
Taking inspiration is not a bad thing as they did not steal anything .

Your opinion

NightwishFan
December 12th, 2010, 06:02 AM
Probably. I do hope they can take the design ideas that work and make good use of them on Ubuntu. :)

Spr0k3t
December 12th, 2010, 06:35 AM
Some things yes... but others seems to be on the opposite foot. Do I wish Linux in general was more like OSX? no. Honestly I wish OSX and the rest of appledom would keep their design strategy to themselves and let distros continue to thrive without fitts law influence.

So, in before the move to reoccurring.

asifnaz
December 12th, 2010, 06:50 AM
Probably. I do hope they can take the design ideas that work and make good use of them on Ubuntu. :)

I hope as well . Thank God nobody flamed me saying I was a troll .

MisterGaribaldi
December 12th, 2010, 06:55 AM
If they are, I think it's because of Gnome. Gnome's UI is *very* popular, and it is very much a take-off of Classic Mac OS and bits of Mac OS X. Since that's basically what the Ubuntu developers have to work with (in a sense), I think that explains it.

I'll bet if KDE was the default DE for Ubuntu, we'd all be sitting here saying "Do you think Ubuntu developers are inspired by Windows Vista/Seven design?"

slooksterpsv
December 12th, 2010, 06:55 AM
I hope not. Why? I hope they were inspired by their own visions of how an OS should look, now mimic this or mimic that. I feel Ubuntu has a very unique feel to it that makes it feel smooth, fast, and above all else, perfect.

uRock
December 12th, 2010, 07:09 AM
I feel that the design team is trying to make Ubuntu into its own thing. People are just used to comparing with Windows or OS X. Ubuntu isn't like either one, which is what makes it so good.

asifnaz
December 12th, 2010, 07:09 AM
If they are, I think it's because of Gnome. Gnome's UI is *very* popular, and it is very much a take-off of Classic Mac OS and bits of Mac OS X. Since that's basically what the Ubuntu developers have to work with (in a sense), I think that explains it.

I'll bet if KDE was the default DE for Ubuntu, we'd all be sitting here saying "Do you think Ubuntu developers are inspired by Windows Vista/Seven design?"

Good logic but what about the theme and wallpaper .

Paqman
December 12th, 2010, 09:47 AM
I think they certainly are, but to be honest I think they implement a lot of it better. OSX is pretty flat and dull looking IMO. Rcent iterations of Ubuntu/Gnome have better font rendering and are generally crisper and lighter looking.

FWIW I think they're also inspired by Windows. It would be hard to be working in UI design and not be influenced to some degree by the two main desktop OSes, if only by way of comparison.

handy
December 12th, 2010, 09:55 AM
I don't know just how Ubuntu looks these days, but I do remember an early version of Dreamlinux which was definitely copying OS X, as best as the dev's could.

They did a pretty good job, & thankfully because it was GNU/Linux based there was so much more configuration available to the user.

I don't know what the Dreamlinux GUI looks like these days either. I should probably go & spend a little time over at Distrowatch.org I think.

[edit:] Dreamlinux is still doing the OS X, thing:

http://distrowatch.com/table.php?distribution=dreamlinux

Spice Weasel
December 12th, 2010, 10:43 AM
Definitely, but OSX has to have the most unproductive UI for beginners ever. That's probably not a good thing.

jwbrase
December 12th, 2010, 10:51 AM
Before Lucid I wouldn't have said they were trying to mimic OSX, but with the whole "put the window buttons on the left" deal, and some of the things they're planning with Unity, I have a sinking feeling that they are...

3rdalbum
December 12th, 2010, 11:27 AM
Before Lucid I wouldn't have said they were trying to mimic OSX, but with the whole "put the window buttons on the left" deal, and some of the things they're planning with Unity, I have a sinking feeling that they are...

I knew someone would mention the window buttons.

Unity is nothing like anything seen in OS X. People bring up the Unity launcher as being a rip-off of the MacOS dock, but that's silly - it's clearly influenced by the RiscOS launcher. Everything else is more like Gnome Shell than MacOS.

asifnaz
December 12th, 2010, 11:40 AM
but OSX has to have the most unproductive UI for beginners ever.

unproductive ..? how . I am an ubuntu fan but I like GUI for os X as it is easy , sleek and stylish and did I mentioned stable .

Spice Weasel
December 12th, 2010, 12:17 PM
unproductive ..? how . I am an ubuntu fan but I like GUI for os X as it is easy , sleek and stylish and did I mentioned stable .

Hm. Let's try opening a terminal (or most applications not included on the dock) on OSX.

Go to the dock.

Click on the Applications folder.

(wait for a few seconds while the folder fades in)

Scroll down

Click on the Utilities folder

Scroll down

Click on Terminal.

And the idea of including installed applications on the same menu-type-panel as open applications is just damn confusing for a novice PC user trying to multitask.

Don't get me started on including application options on a panel at the top of the screen.

swisscow
December 12th, 2010, 12:57 PM
Hm. Let's try opening a terminal (or most applications not included on the dock) on OSX.

Go to the dock.

Click on the Applications folder.

(wait for a few seconds while the folder fades in)

Scroll down

Click on the Utilities folder

Scroll down

Click on Terminal.

And the idea of including installed applications on the same menu-type-panel as open applications is just damn confusing for a novice PC user trying to multitask.

Don't get me started on including application options on a panel at the top of the screen.

Why would a beginner want to open the terminal in osx?

handy
December 12th, 2010, 01:04 PM
Since my wife has been using OS X, I no longer need to administer her machine. She does all installation, removal of software & peripherals, backups, whatever.

Anyone who says that OS X, is hard to use doesn't really know what they are talking about.

Yes, OS X, has problems, but don't we all...

Here we go with the same old us vs them thing again, how boring.

ronnielsen1
December 12th, 2010, 01:22 PM
Gnome's UI is *very* popular

After Ubuntu came out. It sure wasn't before. Kde had it beat by a long shot

I think that gOS definitely copied mac

Paqman
December 12th, 2010, 01:25 PM
Why would a beginner want to open the terminal in osx?

*Puts up hand*

One of the first things I did in OSX was open a terminal and pin it to the dock. Having a familiar environment like Bash available is handy while you're trying to figure out where everything is.

NCLI
December 12th, 2010, 01:54 PM
They're definitely inspired, but are they trying to clone OSX? Nah.

3Miro
December 12th, 2010, 02:10 PM
There are many features in OSX that are very good for novice users and those are precisely the users that Ubuntu is targeting. It makes sense that we see many features from Mac that are implemented in Unity.

swisscow
December 12th, 2010, 02:19 PM
*Puts up hand*

One of the first things I did in OSX was open a terminal and pin it to the dock. Having a familiar environment like Bash available is handy while you're trying to figure out where everything is.

That is fair enough, but not imho something a beginner would want. I found when I needed something I just type the first few letters into the search box and up comes the choices - the search box conveniently and logically marked with the magnifying glass.

However apart from the search being great other things can drive me nuts. I hope both os's take the time to learn of each other. Frankly I want the os to hide in the background so I can get on with stuff. I think that's why windows can get on my nerves so much.

KL_72_TR
December 12th, 2010, 02:23 PM
I don't think so. Windows are inspired from OS X => is inspired from Windows => is inspired from Ubuntu => is inspired form OS X....
I mean how do you arrange things in a screen?

Paqman
December 12th, 2010, 02:30 PM
That is fair enough, but not imho something a beginner would want.

Depends how you define "beginner". I'm pretty happy with Windows and Linux, but on OSX i'm a nublet.

There aren't many people left in the western world these days who are new to any kind of OS. Kids are using computers as soon as they can hold a mouse these days.

handy
December 12th, 2010, 02:37 PM
I don't think so. Windows are inspired from OS X => is inspired from Windows => is inspired from Ubuntu => is inspired form OS X....
I mean how do you arrange things in a screen?

Initially Steve Jobs, was inspired by what he saw a Xerox PARC, where he was gob-smacked by the mouse driven Smalltalk GUI (Dr. Alan Kay's baby).

Jobs knew that this is what everyone will be using & so made the Mac OS, happen (with Alan Kay's help of course).

After which Bill Gates & co' were forever playing catch-up chasing Apple's innovations. As so many companies do these days. That's not to say that other companies don't improve on some of Apple's creations.

Historically, Apple had the creative inspiration, Gates & co', had the primary drive for financial dominance of the market. It is interesting how the two companies have evolved over the decades.

swisscow
December 12th, 2010, 03:02 PM
Depends how you define "beginner". I'm pretty happy with Windows and Linux, but on OSX i'm a nublet.

There aren't many people left in the western world these days who are new to any kind of OS. Kids are using computers as soon as they can hold a mouse these days.

Point and click I suppose is as good as a definition as any. Kids (I know, I teach them) tend to be much happier when clicking makes things happen rather than when typing to make things happen.

Point and click skills are perhaps more transferable between os's than using the terminal. I wonder how happy I would be using the terminal in any os if I hadn't grown up in the days of the zx81, commodore pet etc and then started my life with the "modern pc" using DOS. Would be interesting to stick a kid in front of dos prompt, give them a few commands and see how they get on. I know a few would do great, others would ask how do they start facebook :-)

Spice Weasel
December 12th, 2010, 04:26 PM
Why would a beginner want to open the terminal in osx?

It's the same method for other programs.

HappinessNow
December 12th, 2010, 04:29 PM
Initially Steve Jobs, was inspired by what he saw a Xerox PARC, where he was gob-smacked by the mouse driven Smalltalk GUI (Dr. Alan Kay's baby).

Jobs knew that this is what everyone will be using & so made the Mac OS, happen (with Alan Kay's help of course).

After which Bill Gates & co' were forever playing catch-up chasing Apple's innovations. As so many companies do these days. That's not to say that other companies don't improve on some of Apple's creations.

Historically, Apple had the creative inspiration, Gates & co', had the primary drive for financial dominance of the market. It is interesting how the two companies have evolved over the decades.
I thought Steve and Bill were both inspired by and tried to duplicate BeOS and then tried to kill it as quickly as possible.

I could try,
to make a Haiku
too much work though

handy
December 13th, 2010, 01:50 AM
I thought Steve and Bill were both inspired by and tried to duplicate BeOS and then tried to kill it as quickly as possible.

Your being funny, right?

unknownPoster
December 13th, 2010, 03:16 AM
It's the same method for other programs.

It's really not, quit spreading FUD. The advanced system programs are "Hidden." But again, why would a beginning user need it.

95% of all the programs can be found in an easy to find Applications "Button" in the dock.

OSX's interface is not counter-intuitive like you are saying. Just because you are unfamiliar with it doesn't mean it's a bad design. By your logic you could also say the UI of Gnome, KDE, XFCE, etc, is bad for beginners.

HappinessNow
December 13th, 2010, 04:05 AM
Your being funny, right?Yes, glad you recognized my thin veil of a sense of humor :p

steve.t
December 13th, 2010, 04:07 AM
I think you guys are taking yourselves way too seriously.

Yes, the command line is a handy tool, but if the average Windows user had to go to command line to make things happen, he (or she) would switch to Apple - and vice versa.

As for the appearance of the UI, consider the proliferation of OS X style themes out there. OS X looks good; that's why people try to imitate it. But ultimately, it comes down to personal taste. I personally find the default Ubuntu UI, particularly with the Human icons and the orange/brown colour theme quite unappealing. So I changed the way my UI looks. If anyone likes it, again, it's a matter of personal taste. You're not a bad person for liking or disliking any particular thing.

madjr
December 13th, 2010, 04:54 AM
Dont worry, because in a few years Steve could be copying things from us.

then a thread in the mac forums will be created with this title:

Do you think Mac developers are inspired by Ubuntu's design concepts?

handy
December 13th, 2010, 05:07 AM
Dont worry, because in a few years Steve could be copying things from us.
...

I wonder when he'll decide enough is enough & go & do charity work like every-bodies friend Bill?

unknownPoster
December 13th, 2010, 05:14 AM
Dont worry, because in a few years Steve could be copying things from us.

then a thread in the mac forums will be created with this title:

Do you think Mac developers are inspired by Ubuntu's design concepts?

That's highly unlikely. Linux use would have to experience several years of exponential growth for that to even become a possibility.

NightwishFan
December 13th, 2010, 05:24 AM
Hey, it could happen sooner than we think.

HappinessNow
December 13th, 2010, 05:49 AM
I wonder when he'll decide enough is enough & go & do charity work like every-bodies friend Bill?Nah I see Steve being more like Daffy Duck, madly grabbing on his pile of stuff yelling "Mine!, Mine!, Mine!...", till his death. :p

madjr
December 13th, 2010, 10:41 AM
That's highly unlikely. Linux use would have to experience several years of exponential growth for that to even become a possibility.

why not?

windows is the big player and it still managed to *cough* get inspired by KDE

handy
December 13th, 2010, 11:05 AM
Nah I see Steve being more like Daffy Duck, madly grabbing on his pile of stuff yelling "Mine!, Mine!, Mine!...", till his death. :p

I think you meant Scrooge McDuck. :)

Yes, I agree it is possible, though perhaps health issues may force him into retirement.

We get old & we wear out, no two ways to it.

julio_cortez
December 13th, 2010, 11:09 AM
Well, maybe the Ubuntu or Gnome devs aren't (apart from the "buttons-on-the-left" thing I guess) but certainly the developers of Elementary (which is a theme that I just adore, to the extent that I tried Julia just to have it "out of the box") are.

And I have to say Elementary just looks good.
I've always envied a little bit the "polishedness" (does this word even exist?) of OSX from 10.5 on so I'm glad that there's a theme for Ubuntu that recreates it at least for the part I'm looking at (I don't care having that multi-purpose taskbar for example, and I can happily live without a dock even if I usually have one).

godhika
December 13th, 2010, 11:54 AM
Dont worry, because in a few years Steve could be copying things from us.

[/I]

Well actually we can see already the beginning of this. Watch Apples OS X 10.7 presentation. You can see things that look like Unitys dash and Gnome-Shells overview. Another thing which Ubuntu developped first with Utouch is the use of gestures to navigate the os.Apple had rudimentary gestures for applications for a while, but for example triggering expose or maneuvering to what they call launchpad are things which you can already see in Canonicals Utouch demo video,

Spice Weasel
December 13th, 2010, 11:57 AM
It's really not, quit spreading FUD. The advanced system programs are "Hidden." But again, why would a beginning user need it.

95% of all the programs can be found in an easy to find Applications "Button" in the dock.

OSX's interface is not counter-intuitive like you are saying. Just because you are unfamiliar with it doesn't mean it's a bad design. By your logic you could also say the UI of Gnome, KDE, XFCE, etc, is bad for beginners.

Not spreading FUD, just saying I dislike the way the interface is laid out.

http://crenk.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/leopard-osx_1.jpg

I wouldn't exactly like all of my open programs mixed up with that list.

jwbrase
December 13th, 2010, 09:18 PM
I knew someone would mention the window buttons.

Unity is nothing like anything seen in OS X. People bring up the Unity launcher as being a rip-off of the MacOS dock, but that's silly - it's clearly influenced by the RiscOS launcher. Everything else is more like Gnome Shell than MacOS.

The launcher doesn't need to be a "rip off" of the MacOS dock for the environment to be much closer to that of OS X than to the existing Gnome defaults.

In any case, as long as I can still get Gnome 2 or customize to something that looks and functions reasonably like it, I don't much care...

conundrumx
December 13th, 2010, 09:42 PM
Of course they are. Everyone is.

Everyone is also inspired by some WIndows design aesthetics (even if the inspiration is "we have to not do that"), and to a lesser extent X window managers.

This made me think of a fun jab from Apple:
http://origin.arstechnica.com/staff/fatbits.media/redmond-photocopiers.jpg

unknownPoster
December 13th, 2010, 10:27 PM
Not spreading FUD, just saying I dislike the way the interface is laid out.

http://crenk.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/leopard-osx_1.jpg

I wouldn't exactly like all of my open programs mixed up with that list.

That's not what I'm talking about. That folder 2 icons to the left of the trash can is the applications folder.

Like this: http://i.imgur.com/avwFZ.jpg (http://imgur.com/avwFZ)

MisterGaribaldi
December 13th, 2010, 11:00 PM
After Ubuntu came out. It sure wasn't before. Kde had it beat by a long shot

I think that gOS definitely copied mac

So is that why most distros (of the modern era) prior to Ubuntu had either already picked Gnome, or at least offered it as a choice?

sudoer541
December 14th, 2010, 10:42 PM
Guys/gals

I thought "multi touch" was already patented by Apple, wasn't it?
Why is Canonical trying so hard to get sued by Apple?

PuddingKnife
December 14th, 2010, 11:00 PM
Guys/gals

I thought "multi touch" was already patented by Apple, wasn't it?
Why is Canonical trying so hard to get sued by Apple?


The Chrome OS notebook has multi touch. Will Apple take on Canonical and Google at once? That'd be interesting to watch.