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standingwave
May 23rd, 2010, 09:16 PM
Ran into that at the poker game last night. Some guy noticed my flash drive and wanted to know what I had on it. I told him it was Linux (Mint) OS. He replied that uses Firefox. WTF?

I told him I use Firefox too and then tried to explain what an operating system was but his eyes soon developed that glazed look. There seem to be a lot of users who conflate the web browser with the OS.

And oh yeah, he cracked my pocket Queens with pocket nines so, all in all, a fairly frustrating evening at the poker table.

Legendary_Bibo
May 23rd, 2010, 09:21 PM
Yeah I posted a similar linux experience. When I was showing it to people because the beryl cube had me all excited, I had several people ask me if it was the new version of Windows and when I explained to them that it was linux, they thought it was just a version of windows. I explained that there are three types of OS's (Windows, OS X, and Linux) and that Ubuntu was Linux. I will never forget their logical fallacy. "I've never heard of Linux, I don't think it even exists o.0"

standingwave
May 23rd, 2010, 09:30 PM
Yeah, I'm not haughty or arrogant and genuinely enjoy explaining things to people but they have to want to learn and in his case, if he's happy with Windows, I'm certainly not going to press the issue. There did seem to be a slight interest so I might bring a laptop next month so he can see it in action. It did sound like he was frustrated with viruses so who knows. The problem with advocacy is that you become the IT support for the person you introduced to Linux. If you don't mind that role, then I say go for it.

Legendary_Bibo
May 23rd, 2010, 09:40 PM
That's why I only give it out to old folks who just want to browse the web, play solitaire, and use it to check their e-mail (thank bajeebus none of them use yahoo, I still can't get evolution to work with it)

standingwave
May 23rd, 2010, 09:46 PM
One of the (selfish) reasons I had for switching to Linux is so that could claim ignorance when my Windows using friends call me with a problem: "I'm sorry, I can't help you. I don't use Windows anymore." :P

lisati
May 23rd, 2010, 09:50 PM
One of the (selfish) reasons I had for switching to Linux is so that could claim ignorance when my Windows using friends call me with a problem: "I'm sorry, I can't help you. I don't use Windows anymore." :P

I did something similar recently with one of my in-laws who wanted help with some video editing/DVD authoring software I'd installed on her machine. "I'm sorry, I don't use that software for editing" Figuring it out would probably be a breeze but I'd got a bit fed up with the family expecting me to do all their video editing for them......

Old_Grey_Wolf
May 23rd, 2010, 09:50 PM
I like having fun with people when they brag about the OS they use. I play like I don't know the difference between a browser and an OS. It's funny to see how some people react when they think you are so stupid. Somehow it takes their bragging rights away.

Sporkman
May 23rd, 2010, 10:10 PM
(thank bajeebus none of them use yahoo, I still can't get evolution to work with it)

You have to get a premium ("plus") yahoo account to work for that to work.

http://help.yahoo.com/tutorials/cg/mail/cg_access4.html

Legendary_Bibo
May 23rd, 2010, 10:19 PM
You have to get a premium ("plus") yahoo account to work for that to work.

http://help.yahoo.com/tutorials/cg/mail/cg_access4.html

well that sucks. I'll just stick to having to click on firefox then going to yahoo.

meho_r
May 23rd, 2010, 10:28 PM
One of the (selfish) reasons I had for switching to Linux is so that could claim ignorance when my Windows using friends call me with a problem: "I'm sorry, I can't help you. I don't use Windows anymore." :P

Man, that feels good :D

tmette
May 23rd, 2010, 10:34 PM
Once I tried explaining why I don't use Windows anymore to a college classmate and he just kept telling me that I was ignorant because everyone out there uses it and I should too. That way I can get better support if my computer crashes. Needless to say, a few days later he called me up wanting help on how to get rid of a virus. Told him "Sorry, but I don't use Windows remember?" Although I was nice enough to let him come over and use my computer to finish his report for class, since his Windows machine wouldn't even log in.

Legendary_Bibo
May 23rd, 2010, 10:36 PM
One of the (selfish) reasons I had for switching to Linux is so that could claim ignorance when my Windows using friends call me with a problem: "I'm sorry, I can't help you. I don't use Windows anymore." :P

Same here, although I've started forgetting how to use Windows. The file directories in my head for file I usually use are being replaced with commands for the terminal, GIMP art tricks, and ideas for what to make my desktop look like next.

Kingsley
May 23rd, 2010, 10:56 PM
Once I tried explaining why I don't use Windows anymore to a college classmate and he just kept telling me that I was ignorant because everyone out there uses it and I should too. That way I can get better support if my computer crashes. Needless to say, a few days later he called me up wanting help on how to get rid of a virus. Told him "Sorry, but I don't use Windows remember?" Although I was nice enough to let him come over and use my computer to finish his report for class, since his Windows machine wouldn't even log in.
You should have fixed it for him and charged 40 bucks.

Merk42
May 23rd, 2010, 11:01 PM
A lot of people don't know what a browser is (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4MwTvtyrUQ).

I don't hold it against them in some elitist attitude though. I have a license to drive a car, but I don't know the first thing about the parts or how it works.

jflaker
May 23rd, 2010, 11:03 PM
Ran into that at the poker game last night. Some guy noticed my flash drive and wanted to know what I had on it. I told him it was Linux (Mint) OS. He replied that uses Firefox. WTF?

I told him I use Firefox too and then tried to explain what an operating system was but his eyes soon developed that glazed look. There seem to be a lot of users who conflate the web browser with the OS.

And oh yeah, he cracked my pocket Queens with pocket nines so, all in all, a fairly frustrating evening at the poker table.

We poke fun, but ask someone about their car which is above and beyond putting the key into the ignition and twisting....most people wouldn't have a clue either. Both cars and computers are just as proliferate.

On the bright side, this lack of knowledge will keep many of us in an income for quite some time and we should be glad.

standingwave
May 23rd, 2010, 11:08 PM
Needless to say, a few days later he called me up wanting help on how to get rid of a virus. Told him "Sorry, but I don't use Windows remember?" Oh man, that had to feel good.

A different topic altogether but about ten years ago my brother was in town on business and wanted to borrow my typewriter to type up a proposal. Mind you, he ran his own business but is a bit of a technophobe and had resisted getting a computer. (Clients were beginning to ask him for an email address so he got one through Kinkos/FedEx and lived that way for several years.) I told him I no longer had a typewriter but that he was welcome to use my computer, word processor and laser printer. So I set him up and the very first thing he wants to do is center some text so he starts hammering away at the space bar to move the cursor to the middle. Well, after slapping my forehead, I gave him a quick tutorial in word processing and a month later he had a computer (Mac, of course, since the graphic designers he worked with all used Macs). I still tease him about that to this day.

Old_Grey_Wolf
May 23rd, 2010, 11:10 PM
on the bright side, this lack of knowledge will keep many of us in an income for quite some time and we should be glad.

+1

Legendary_Bibo
May 23rd, 2010, 11:11 PM
A lot of people don't know what a browser is (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4MwTvtyrUQ).

I don't hold it against them in some elitist attitude though. I have a license to drive a car, but I don't know the first thing about the parts or how it works.

haha this is a terrible sign considering computers aren't just for geeks anymore, its a big part of the workplace, and people don't know simple things like this?

I just keep telling myself we're in a transitional age where the old people who don't understand computers will die off then the young people will be able to progress without having show Grams how to get to Solitaire every day. Alas, this is not the case as I've seen people my age basically only know how to get to facebook, and solitaire.

standingwave
May 23rd, 2010, 11:15 PM
We poke fun, but ask someone about their car which is above and beyond putting the key into the ignition and twisting....most people wouldn't have a clue either. Both cars and computers are just as proliferate.Reminds me this old piece of computer humor:

Helpline: "General Motors Helpline, how can I help you?"
Customer: "My car ran fine for a week, and now it won't go anywhere!"
Helpline: "Is the gas tank empty?"
Customer: "Huh? How do I know?"
Helpline: "There's a little gauge on the front panel, with a needle, and markings from 'E' to 'F'. Where is the needle pointing?"
Customer: "I see an 'E' but no 'F'."
Helpline: "You see the 'E' and just to the right is the 'F'."
Customer: "No, just to the right of the first 'E' is a 'V'."
Helpline: "A 'V'?!?"
Customer: "Yeah, there's a 'C', an 'H', the first 'E', then a 'V', followed by 'R', 'O', 'L' ..."
Helpline: "No, no, no sir! That's the front of the car. When you sit behind the steering wheel, that's the panel I'm talking about."
Customer: "That steering wheel thingy -- Is that the round thing that honks the horn?"
Helpline: "Yes, among other things."
Customer: "The needle's pointing to 'E'. What does that mean?"
Helpline: "It means that you have to visit a gasoline vendor and purchase some more gasoline. You can install it yourself, or pay the vendor to install it for you."
Customer: "What? I paid $12,000 for this car! Now you tell me that I have to keep buying more components? I want a car that comes with everything built in!"

Helpline: "General Motors Helpline, how can I help you?"
Customer: "I got in my car and closed the door, and nothing happened!"
Helpline: "Did you put the key in the ignition and turn it?"
Customer: "What's an ignition?"
Helpline: "It's a starter motor that draws current from your battery and turns over the engine."
Customer: "Ignition? Motor? Battery? Engine? How come I have to know all of these technical terms just to use my car?"

Phrea
May 23rd, 2010, 11:18 PM
I use Opera instead of Linux.

I think Opera is a much better browser than Linux. It's very good and pretty, and it has all the great standards too.

lisati
May 23rd, 2010, 11:22 PM
Reminds me this old piece of computer humor:

I like! I've seen threads like this here at the forums from time to time..... :)

Old Marcus
May 23rd, 2010, 11:39 PM
Reminds me this old piece of computer humor:

Helpline: "General Motors Helpline, how can I help you?"
Customer: "My car ran fine for a week, and now it won't go anywhere!"
Helpline: "Is the gas tank empty?"
Customer: "Huh? How do I know?"
Helpline: "There's a little gauge on the front panel, with a needle, and markings from 'E' to 'F'. Where is the needle pointing?"
Customer: "I see an 'E' but no 'F'."
Helpline: "You see the 'E' and just to the right is the 'F'."
Customer: "No, just to the right of the first 'E' is a 'V'."
Helpline: "A 'V'?!?"
Customer: "Yeah, there's a 'C', an 'H', the first 'E', then a 'V', followed by 'R', 'O', 'L' ..."
Helpline: "No, no, no sir! That's the front of the car. When you sit behind the steering wheel, that's the panel I'm talking about."
Customer: "That steering wheel thingy -- Is that the round thing that honks the horn?"
Helpline: "Yes, among other things."
Customer: "The needle's pointing to 'E'. What does that mean?"
Helpline: "It means that you have to visit a gasoline vendor and purchase some more gasoline. You can install it yourself, or pay the vendor to install it for you."
Customer: "What? I paid $12,000 for this car! Now you tell me that I have to keep buying more components? I want a car that comes with everything built in!"

Helpline: "General Motors Helpline, how can I help you?"
Customer: "I got in my car and closed the door, and nothing happened!"
Helpline: "Did you put the key in the ignition and turn it?"
Customer: "What's an ignition?"
Helpline: "It's a starter motor that draws current from your battery and turns over the engine."
Customer: "Ignition? Motor? Battery? Engine? How come I have to know all of these technical terms just to use my car?"
Funny, but utterly implausible. :P

Old_Grey_Wolf
May 23rd, 2010, 11:54 PM
I just keep telling myself we're in a transitional age where the old people who don't understand computers will die off then the young people will be able to progress without having show Grams how to get to Solitaire every day.

I assume you have your own servers set up for DNS, LDAP, E-mail, SAMBA, etc. I assume you have type 1 hypervisors running on your cluster machines with resource pools set up. I assume you have VM templates set up with policies so that you can deploy VMs in your Eucalyptus, VMware vShere, etc., cloud in a consistent and secure manner.

standingwave
May 23rd, 2010, 11:59 PM
Funny, but utterly implausible. :PWell, I never fully groked the starting sequence for our family Caterpillar D6. With the pony (starter) motor it was surprisingly complicated.

Legendary_Bibo
May 23rd, 2010, 11:59 PM
I assume you have your own servers set up for DNS, LDAP, E-mail, SAMBA, etc. I assume you have type 1 hypervisors running on your cluster machines with resource pools set up. I assume you have VM templates set up with policies so that you can deploy VMs in your Eucalyptus, VMware vCenter, etc., cloud in a consistent and secure manner.

Nope.

I'm talking about everyday home users. They've all kind of dumb downed. I could set that up if I needed it, but I have no reason too. I'm literally referring to people who can't get past the first part of a drop down menu.

meho_r
May 24th, 2010, 12:07 AM
A lot of people don't know what a browser is (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4MwTvtyrUQ).

I don't hold it against them in some elitist attitude though. I have a license to drive a car, but I don't know the first thing about the parts or how it works.

But at least you know what a car is :P

Legendary_Bibo
May 24th, 2010, 12:11 AM
But at least you know what a car is :P
Is it that thing that goes Vroom! Vroom! beep beep honk honk!?

speedwell68
May 24th, 2010, 12:13 AM
I met some people that kept on changing ISPs. In the end I asked them why they kept on changing? They said they wanted to find out which internet had the best stuff on it.

lostinxlation
May 24th, 2010, 12:16 AM
There're a plenty of people who cannot correctly point to their countries on the world map. I don't see a big deal that someone misunderstand the OS and browser.

Old_Grey_Wolf
May 24th, 2010, 12:17 AM
Nope.

I'm talking about everyday home users. They've all kind of dumb downed. I could set that up if I needed it, but I have no reason too. I'm literally referring to people who can't get past the first part of a drop down menu.

Sorry.

I just didn't like the comment about Grams. I'm Gramps, 62 years old, and I have all that stuff set up on my home network. Despite want some people think, we don't sit in recliners drolling on ourselves.

Irihapeti
May 24th, 2010, 12:24 AM
Sorry.

I just didn't like the comment about Grams. I'm Gramps, 62 years old, and I have all that stuff set up on my home network. Despite want some people think, we don't sit in recliners drolling on ourselves.

Yes, I'm getting tired of it, too - particularly the notion that an older woman has got to be too stupid to work anything out for herself.

del_diablo
May 24th, 2010, 12:25 AM
There're a plenty of people who cannot correctly point to their countries on the world map. I don't see a big deal that someone misunderstand the OS and browser.

Point me at somebody who do not understand a car, who has used it for over a month.
Ugh

refunlike
May 24th, 2010, 01:25 AM
A lot of people don't know what a browser is (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4MwTvtyrUQ).

I don't hold it against them in some elitist attitude though. I have a license to drive a car, but I don't know the first thing about the parts or how it works.

That video actually made me feel sick.

Legendary_Bibo
May 24th, 2010, 01:36 AM
Yes, I'm getting tired of it, too - particularly the notion that an older woman has got to be too stupid to work anything out for herself.

I meant no offense to you guys. It was your generation that laid the foundation to computers, but you guys aren't the average grandparents. You're L33t

kilosan
May 24th, 2010, 01:55 AM
my old man also says, he uses firefox and not windows.
looks like google is going in the right direction with its chromium os.

Frogs Hair
May 24th, 2010, 02:18 AM
I'm browser when I go to the library and look for movies . No, I'm a Ubuntu and I use Firefox and no, it wasn't my idea.

WinterRain
May 24th, 2010, 04:01 AM
I met some people that kept on changing ISPs. In the end I asked them why they kept on changing? They said they wanted to find out which internet had the best stuff on it.

WOW! That's a first for me.

meho_r
May 24th, 2010, 08:02 AM
Is it that thing that goes Vroom! Vroom! beep beep honk honk!?

It depends. If you've found out how to get into the "shiny box", find the ignition, figure out where to put your leg and what does that wheely thingy do ;)

MC_Sketch
May 24th, 2010, 08:06 AM
AHAHAHAHAHAHA! wow sometimes people are straight up idiots, huh? XD

chessnerd
May 24th, 2010, 08:08 AM
Point me at somebody who do not understand a car, who has used it for over a month.
Ugh

I don't understand cars, and I've been around them my whole life. I've been driving for several years now. I don't know the differences between one engine vs. another or what makes a BMW better/worse than a Ford. I just drive it and barely even notice it unless something is screwy.

Most people just use their computer and don't think about it unless something goes wrong.

The question of whether or not these things are good or bad is another thing entirely...

meho_r
May 24th, 2010, 11:39 AM
But you still do have to pass certain tests before you get your driver licence. Same goes for computers: knowing how to work with them is integral part of general literacy these days. You don't have to know (almost) anything about hardware and/or how computers work (you know, kernel and stuff), but you really should learn at least basics about how to use them.

fatality_uk
May 24th, 2010, 01:27 PM
The thing is, most people would understand applications in the same way most people would undrestand car wheels. The fact that I have totally different caster, toe-in angles when I drive a racing car to a road car makes no difference to most people. They don't really want to go under the hood, they just enjoy being scared sensless doing 130mph going through Chruch then Brooklands!

julio_cortez
May 24th, 2010, 01:56 PM
I did something similar recently with one of my in-laws who wanted help with some video editing/DVD authoring software I'd installed on her machine. "I'm sorry, I don't use that software for editing" Figuring it out would probably be a breeze but I'd got a bit fed up with the family expecting me to do all their video editing for them......
You're lucky, my friend.
The default scene of mine is this: a relative calls me and says me "well, my PC isn't working anymore".
I ask him/her "so what's wrong? What happened?" and all I can have as an answer is often "I don't know, it's you the one that works with PC's. It's you that has to tell me what has happened to my PC. Can't you tell me?"

Sure, by phone, without even seeing it. I just wonder where I left my crystal ball last time I used it, if I found it I'd solve your problem in a split second.

donkyhotay
May 24th, 2010, 02:24 PM
But you still do have to pass certain tests before you get your driver licence. Same goes for computers: knowing how to work with them is integral part of general literacy these days. You don't have to know (almost) anything about hardware and/or how computers work (you know, kernel and stuff), but you really should learn at least basics about how to use them.

I've done computer tech support for many years, most people of course don't know anything about kernels and the internal components but thats ok since they're paying me to know that. However it's when they don't know the bare minimal basics like the difference between the screensaver and the desktop or even how to use a mouse (whats a double-click?) that I get frustrated. Sure most people may not know a whole lot about cars but we have to know a minimal amount to get a license so we at least know the difference between the brakes and the accelerator. With computers there isn't anything like that so you often get people with no clue whatsoever.

Tristam Green
May 24th, 2010, 02:43 PM
A lot of people don't know what a browser is (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4MwTvtyrUQ).

I don't hold it against them in some elitist attitude though. I have a license to drive a car, but I don't know the first thing about the parts or how it works.

I say this in the utmost respect and sincerity: thank God for people like you.


haha this is a terrible sign considering computers aren't just for geeks anymore, its a big part of the workplace, and people don't know simple things like this?

I just keep telling myself we're in a transitional age where the old people who don't understand computers will die off then the young people will be able to progress without having show Grams how to get to Solitaire every day. Alas, this is not the case as I've seen people my age basically only know how to get to facebook, and solitaire.

ugh, be quiet. People who think as you do, I can do without.

julio_cortez
May 24th, 2010, 02:55 PM
With computers there isn't anything like that so you often get people with no clue whatsoever.
I saw people turning off and then back on the screen and believing they rebooted the PC instead.

I was giving phone support to a customer of ours that couldn't properly install a software (which, blame it on the developers, required UAC to be turned off temporarily to be installed) and I guided her through the process of entering the CP and turning UAC off.

Then I asked her to reboot the PC.
After something like 10 seconds she told me "done" (and my first thought was "cool, a SSD drive, I wish I had one!!") then we proceeded with installing the software but the setup failed.

Then something became clear in my mind and I asked her how did her reboot the PC and she answered "Don't you know how to reboot a PC? I pressed the power button to turn it off, and pressed it again to turn it back on!!"
Me: "Where exactly is the power button?"
Her: "On the monitor!!"

meho_r
May 24th, 2010, 07:13 PM
I saw people turning off and then back on the screen and believing they rebooted the PC instead.

I was giving phone support to a customer of ours that couldn't properly install a software (which, blame it on the developers, required UAC to be turned off temporarily to be installed) and I guided her through the process of entering the CP and turning UAC off.

Then I asked her to reboot the PC.
After something like 10 seconds she told me "done" (and my first thought was "cool, a SSD drive, I wish I had one!!") then we proceeded with installing the software but the setup failed.

Then something became clear in my mind and I asked her how did her reboot the PC and she answered "Don't you know how to reboot a PC? I pressed the power button to turn it off, and pressed it again to turn it back on!!"
Me: "Where exactly is the power button?"
Her: "On the monitor!!"

LOL. I remember the story of a guy who had waited in the line in post-office while couple of ladies working there tried to figure out why computer stopped working. Then one of them told another: "Try turning monitor off and then on." :D Seems it's the same thing everywhere ;)

@donkyhotay: all this points out that our education systems do not work properly. The video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4MwTvtyrUQ) posted by Merk42 shows not only older people who didn't have a chance to learn these things in school, but young people too, the very people who will have to use computers almost certainly every single day for doing their work. That's unfortunate.

Legendary_Bibo
May 24th, 2010, 08:49 PM
I say this in the utmost respect and sincerity: thank God for people like you.



ugh, be quiet. People who think as you do, I can do without.

why? I understand why a lot (not all, sorry old gray wolf) of old people can't use a computer, but I die a little when people My own age!! Yes read that carefully, people around my age who can't use a computer when they are users. I'm talking about the basic stuff. Let me bring it back to the driving thing. You know how to drive so you know how to use a car, but you also at least know the basics. You know what wheels are, the brakes, the axel, the doors,...etc. All the basic things that when there's a problem you can identify where the issue is occurring. Let me refer to my own experience now, I was put in some computer informatics systems class for god knows what reason probably because they assumed I was like my youth aged counterparts and had to learn how to use a computer, some people told me it was a requirement which I really hope it was just for people who needed it. To me, the class was a joke, to the rest of the class they failed to understand basic ideas such as...


input, processing, storage, output
word processing
database management (I'll admit this part sucked and was a little more difficult)
Powerpoints...which I thought everyone learned to do when they were in elementary school
Excel
bytes, bit, and binary code
What the different parts of your system are(i.e. Difference between monitor and tower)
The parts to a computer (RAM, Hard Drive, processor, etc...)
Installing a freaking program on Windows, where there are three buttons!! (Save, Run, Cancel) They had to be walked every little teeny tiny step.

So before you tell me to be quiet, I've witnessed first hand the failure of my generation that awaits, and my generation is going to be the one using computers on a daily basis. I honestly didn't understand why this class existed until I saw the failure of education these people got.

Tristam Green
May 24th, 2010, 09:05 PM
So before you tell me to be quiet, I've witnessed first hand the failure of my generation that awaits, and my generation is going to be the one using computers on a daily basis. I honestly didn't understand why this class existed until I saw the failure of education these people got.

You and every generation before you have witnessed, rued, and survived the woe of what the future holds.


Signed,

A man whose grandmother doesn't know how to use a computer, and has never driven a car in her life.

Irihapeti
May 24th, 2010, 09:25 PM
You and every generation before you have witnessed, rued, and survived the woe of what the future holds.


+10

Every generation thinks that it is the last bastion of reason, sense and common decency, and that ahead lies only the black abyss of utter ruination.

No doubt some form of that is engraved on a cave wall somewhere...

bondo101
May 24th, 2010, 09:42 PM
My wife Thinks Linux is just used by a bunch of college kids in someone's basement. I have tried to explain it to her with noavail on the subject. She thinks everyone uses windows. i loaded firefox on her windows machine , she doesn't get tabbed browsing. It's on Ie 8" go figure.:KS

Hman242
May 24th, 2010, 09:43 PM
This thread remind me of another thread in this forum where a guy was in Best Buy and a women said that a computer was running Linux. He went over to see and it just had Chrome on it.

Sealbhach
May 24th, 2010, 11:15 PM
well that sucks. I'll just stick to having to click on firefox then going to yahoo.

Thunderbird + Yahoo Mail works.

.

nah40
May 24th, 2010, 11:41 PM
I'm just one of those dumbed down home users.
I'm 70 and have been using computers since the Trash 80 and Linux (Ubuntu) for three years.
I also now avoid working on Windows for friends and family.

Chame_Wizard
May 24th, 2010, 11:58 PM
Nope.

I'm talking about everyday home users. They've all kind of dumb downed. I could set that up if I needed it, but I have no reason too. I'm literally referring to people who can't get past the first part of a drop down menu.
Too much Windows mindset:)

magmon
May 24th, 2010, 11:59 PM
...The problem with advocacy is that you become the IT support for the person you introduced to Linux. If you don't mind that role, then I say go for it.

I'd have to disagree with that statement from my experience. My friends learned the OS quickly, and while they aren't as good as you or I, they are sufficient. The vast majority of them, however, went back to windows.

Back on topic, I had quite the opposite experience at school recently. A rather cute girl who sits behind me in spanish noticed the Ubuntu sticker I have placed proudly on my binder and asked if I use linux. She is, as I found out, a user in the transition process whose father is setting up a company that sells branded T shirts to raise funds for non profit linux distos. Needless to say, I was thrilled.

Phrea
May 25th, 2010, 12:04 AM
My wife Thinks Linux is just used by a bunch of college kids in someone's basement.

Correct me if I'm wrong sir, but does this mean that your wife basically thinks of you like you are some kid in her basement? :lolflag:

McRat
May 25th, 2010, 12:15 AM
Point me at somebody who do not understand a car, who has used it for over a month.
Ugh

Let me guess. You've never been a mechanic or a driving/race instructor. :D

Most people do not know how their car works or how to drive it correctly. They know just enough to get the job done.

Most people do not know how their computer works or how to configure it correctly. They know just enough to get the job done.

The really weird phase was about 1990. Half the people hadn't been exposed to computers yet, but were interested in them. This is where you REALLY married everyone you helped with their first computer. Very few books, classes, no internet, etc. And they were pretty hard to set up and use. Software was often primitive, and hardware was often incompatible.

Merk42
May 25th, 2010, 12:21 AM
Too much Winblows mindset:)

Much better to be of the Linux mindset that calls competitors by childish names. :rolleyes:

beast2k
May 25th, 2010, 01:14 AM
Yea I think I'm gonna start using OSX instead of thunderbird. ROFL:P

Danny Dubya
May 25th, 2010, 03:12 AM
Hey, want to hear something really sad?

One time in a high school course, a computer monitor lost its video signal. The teacher comes over and says it must be some sort of problem with the motherboard, and then repeatedly PUNCHES my monitor, to no avail. After this he gives up and walks away, I just reboot the computer, and the problem never reoccurs for the entire semester.

His subject matter? Intro-level C++. Young guy too.

Legendary_Bibo
May 25th, 2010, 03:40 AM
You guys wanna see my C++ professor? I can show a youtube link from his channel. He's a smart guy who knows a lot about computers, he's just a little...erm off.

Chronon
May 25th, 2010, 07:41 AM
The problem with advocacy is that you become the IT support for the person you introduced to Linux. If you don't mind that role, then I say go for it.

If you install it for them then I agree you are implicitly accepting an IT role. However, if you simply tell someone about something and they take it upon themselves to investigate it and install it on their hardware then I don't feel any responsibility to act as tech support for them.

meho_r
May 25th, 2010, 08:29 AM
If you install it for them then I agree you are implicitly accepting an IT role. However, if you simply tell someone about something and they take it upon themselves to investigate it and install it on their hardware then I don't feel any responsibility to act as tech support for them.

What you feel is one thing, when they call you is another. And they will :D

Chronon
May 25th, 2010, 08:59 AM
What you feel is one thing, when they call you is another. And they will :D

I have no problem reminding them that they chose to do everything for themselves. I am not responsible for other choices they make, why would I be responsible for this one? I will happily point them to Canonical if they wish to pay for support.

v1ad
May 25th, 2010, 09:00 AM
anyone that wan't to learn something can learn something.

age 13 repaired cars
age 14 installed my first cd player and amp into a car without any help or training.
15-20 changed transmissions, clutches, engines.
20-22 unux and still going on. linux requires a lot more knowledge them most of the above.

if there is a will there is a way. just most people refuse to learn they do not want to step out of their comfort zone and put dedication and effort. it is a lot easier for someone else to do it for them.

lostinxlation
May 25th, 2010, 09:55 AM
Point me at somebody who do not understand a car, who has used it for over a month.
Ugh
Well, people drive their cars for a month and they would be familiar with how to drive it, but that doesn't mean they understand the cars.
They know how to use steering wheel, change the gear, apply the brake, and stop, but they maynot know how many cylinders and what displacement the engine has, FR/FF or where the air clearner/water pump/fuel line, etc. are.
In the same way, people know how to use mouse, keyboard, printer, or browser on the computers, but they maynot know or care about system software or hardware.. The computer is a tool and as long as it produces the result they need, they wouldn't give a damn thing to what's inside.. Everybody has something they're not remotely interested in, and it just happens to be a computer to many people.

julio_cortez
May 25th, 2010, 11:26 AM
Well, people drive their cars for a month and they would be familiar with how to drive it, but that doesn't mean they understand the cars.
In the same way, people know how to use mouse, keyboard, printer, or browser on the computers, but they maynot know or care about system software or hardware.
The difference is that to use a car you should pass an exam. It's as easy as drinking a glass of water, but it's still something you HAVE to get past.
To use a computer you don't need it: you walk in the store and buy one, and you're done.
I know that (in an extreme hypotesis) you can also go and buy a car without having a valid driving license, but difference is that you won't be jailed if you use a computer without knowing how to..


Everybody has something they're not remotely interested in, and it just happens to be a computer to many people.
On a different note: there are people that even pay an extra (many of my friends do it) to have the car refueled by an operator of the gas station..
Have you ever seen someone telling you "I will pay for you to plug my laptop to the power source?" :P

I for one refuel my car by myself (if you go to the automatic there's also a discount usually) and I managed to change front lights when they went out, change my windscreen wipers when they were worn, change wheels (though I wouldn't be able to change tyres for example) but if you told me "there is a radiator duct that needs fixing" I wouldn't know what to do..

northwestuntu
May 25th, 2010, 12:37 PM
A lot of people don't know what a browser is (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4MwTvtyrUQ).

I don't hold it against them in some elitist attitude though. I have a license to drive a car, but I don't know the first thing about the parts or how it works.

same here :)

pwnst*r
May 25th, 2010, 01:01 PM
Ran into that at the poker game last night. Some guy noticed my flash drive and wanted to know what I had on it. I told him it was Linux (Mint) OS. He replied that uses Firefox. WTF?

I told him I use Firefox too and then tried to explain what an operating system was but his eyes soon developed that glazed look. There seem to be a lot of users who conflate the web browser with the OS.

And oh yeah, he cracked my pocket Queens with pocket nines so, all in all, a fairly frustrating evening at the poker table.

So you ran across someone who wasn't computer savvy. This is news?

RiceMonster
May 25th, 2010, 01:15 PM
So you ran across someone who wasn't computer savvy. This is news?

You mean there are people who aren't interested in computers? I don't believe you.

Tristam Green
May 25th, 2010, 01:20 PM
Let me guess. You've never been a mechanic or a driving/race instructor. :D

Most people do not know how their car works or how to drive it correctly. They know just enough to get the job done.

Most people do not know how their computer works or how to configure it correctly. They know just enough to get the job done.

I may often not agree with you, but this is dead on the money. Clearly there's this misguided paradigm among IT-predisposed folk that states "it's no longer acceptable to just have Office (software) proficiency or file management abilities, the average user must be expected to know how their processor, memory, bus, and hdd work together to move information, and have the troubleshooting ability to tell a HelpDesk professional(oxymoron) where exactly the problem lies at any given time."

Evidently those same IT-predisposed folk are trying to put themselves out of a job...

Merk42
May 25th, 2010, 01:30 PM
The difference is that to use a car you should pass an exam. It's as easy as drinking a glass of water, but it's still something you HAVE to get past.
To use a computer you don't need it: you walk in the store and buy one, and you're done.

But the exam doesn't cover the aforementioned "how many cylinders and what displacement the engine has, FR/FF or where the air clearner/water pump/fuel line, etc". So the point still stands.

julio_cortez
May 25th, 2010, 01:44 PM
But the exam doesn't cover the aforementioned "how many cylinders and what displacement the engine has, FR/FF or where the air clearner/water pump/fuel line, etc". So the point still stands.
Well, I remember that the driving license exam also consisted in a theory part (that also covered understanding the basic mechanics of the engine and so on)..

I think that the driving license can be fairly compared to ECDL (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Computer_Driving_Licence) when it comes to IT.
Both are stupid-simple, the difference is that the driving license is REQUIRED when you drive a car, and the ECDL is NOT when you use a PC.

The difference is that when you drive a car you put your life (and lives of other people) at risk if you don't know what to do, while you don't expose yourself/other people to such a risk when you use a PC.
Nevertheless, ECDL should be mandatory (in my opinion) at least for people that are supposed to work with a computer.

RiceMonster
May 25th, 2010, 01:49 PM
Nevertheless, ECDL should be mandatory (in my opinion) at least for people that are supposed to work with a computer.

You still haven't explained why. In fact, as far as I'm concerned you've refuted your own argument when you mentioned that driving a car has the potential to cause harm to both the driver and others, while a computer does not.

meho_r
May 25th, 2010, 01:50 PM
I have no problem reminding them that they chose to do everything for themselves. I am not responsible for other choices they make, why would I be responsible for this one? I will happily point them to Canonical if they wish to pay for support.

Man, you are cruel :D

corney91
May 25th, 2010, 01:52 PM
Let me guess. You've never been a mechanic or a driving/race instructor. :D

Most people do not know how their car works or how to drive it correctly. They know just enough to get the job done.

Most people do not know how their computer works or how to configure it correctly. They know just enough to get the job done.


Couldn't agree more :)
And, for people arguing you need to take a test to drive, that's for safety - it's very unlikely that you crash your computer with the potential to kill yourself and/or others :P

Also, as another analogy, most people who speak English don't actually understand how it's constructed - the vast majority of people on here, I imagine, speak English as as first language and yet there are a large number of grammatical errors. People don't care about understanding the things they use, only the things they're interested in :)

julio_cortez
May 25th, 2010, 02:10 PM
@RiceMonster: First of all, forgive me if I misuse some terms but I'm getting into an explanation that goes beyond what I usually do with English, which is not my native language.
Sorry but replies have been posted while I was writing mine.

People improperly using a car (not giving way, speeding, and so on) can easily harm themselves and other people. I think it's clear enough to be considered "true" without further explanation.
It's indeed true that you can cause "financial" or "reputational" damage using a PC (by accident you can delete some files that are needed for example, causing a "financial" loss, or maybe you can do something on someone's behalf but do it wrong, causing a "reputational" loss) but I never heard of people killing by improperly using a PC.
Well, unless I get mad and smash my laptop on your head until I kill you, of course. But this is madness, it's not anymore a fault in using the PC. I can do the exact same with a ham, if I'm provided one. And that is the reason I'm not considering actions made on purpose to hurt or to cause damage (with both cars and PCs).

So, above is the reason why people are required a driving license to drive a car, but no ECDL to use a PC.

Now, what I pointed out, is that a wrong usage of a PC by a "professional" (someone that is SUPPOSED to work with the PC everyday and to KNOW what to do with it) can cause huge damage to the company this person is employed to, including data loss, revenue loss, and image damage.
I don't want them to know perfectly how a CPU works, registries, paging and such things because I probably forgot the most of them aswell (I used to know them some years ago) but at least to know that if you close a program without saving a document, you can't blame the IT staff because you have lost it, and when someone will ask you why it took you 2 hours to write that document that barely required 20 minutes to the last person who made it, you can't say "it's the PC's fault"..

If I cause damage to my home PC I don't give a toss about it, I format and everything is fine again.
But if I do the same to the PC I'm using at work, I cause a loss to my employee due to me being unable to do my duty until my PC is back in working order.

That's the reason why I think that something like ECDL (or some sort of training) should be required if not mandatory for people doing professional things with a PC. It doesn't matter if you are a secretary (only using Word and Outlook) or a graphic designer.
Chances are that if you don't have a clue of what you're doing sooner or later you'll cause damage.

Grenage
May 25th, 2010, 02:13 PM
It's indeed true that you can cause "financial" or "reputational" damage using a PC (by accident you can delete some files that are needed for example, causing a "financial" loss, or maybe you can do something on someone's behalf but do it wrong, causing a "reputational" loss) but I never heard of people killing by improperly using a PC.

That's what interviews, and in-house training are for. Computers really don't matter that much, they're just tools that can be used in many ways.

Tristam Green
May 25th, 2010, 02:21 PM
That's what interviews, and in-house training are for. Computers really don't matter that much, they're just tools that can be used in many ways.

building on this; in cases of accidentally deleting files that can supposedly cause "financial loss", that's what backups by a trained IT staff are for.

if you're locally storing files that are business critical, you're doing it all kinds of wrong.

RiceMonster
May 25th, 2010, 02:25 PM
It's indeed true that you can cause "financial" or "reputational" damage using a PC (by accident you can delete some files that are needed for example, causing a "financial" loss, or maybe you can do something on someone's behalf but do it wrong, causing a "reputational" loss) but I never heard of people killing by improperly using a PC.

I won't repeate what Trsistam and Grenage said, as I agree with them. However, based on this logic, I'm going to assume you think people should require a license to use money? To open a bank account?

pwnst*r
May 25th, 2010, 02:27 PM
You mean there are people who aren't interested in computers? I don't believe you.

You actually have to leave your house and talk to people in real life situations, but I swear on my 16GB of Crucial RAM it's the truth!

julio_cortez
May 25th, 2010, 02:31 PM
if you're locally storing files that are business critical, you're doing it all kinds of wrong.
And this can be easily avoided if people working with PCs are trained (and tested before starting working) or have some worldwide recognized "license" (well, I'd still have them performing a test anyway).
Maybe I'm wrong keeping on stressing on this thing, but I'm afraid that in-house courses not always produce the desired result.


if you're locally storing files that are business critical, you're doing it all kinds of wrong.
In addition, usually backup is planned to run over night. If I lose a "critical" file over which I've been working on for 2 or 3 hours during the day because I forget to save it (or just don't save it properly), how is a backup from the day before supposed to recover it?

It may be me, but I've been trained to think at the "worst case" before everything else.


I won't repeate what Trsistam and Grenage said, as I agree with them. However, based on this logic, I'm going to assume you think people should require a license to use money? To open a bank account?
What I do with MY money is MY business.
But when I work with someone else's money, yes, I'm supposed either to have a license that shows what I'm capable of, or at least (preferrable) to have passed an on-field test.

On a different note, RiceMonster:
Would you trust a bank employee who doesn't even know how to make a wire transfer?
Well, that's why I don't trust people working with PCs but not knowing what they're doing.

RiceMonster
May 25th, 2010, 02:39 PM
On a different note, RiceMonster:
Would you trust a bank employee who doesn't even know how to make a wire transfer?
Well, that's why I don't trust people working with PCs but not knowing what they're doing.

Assuming their role in the bank envolves that, of course I wouldn't. However, it's up to the bank to either hire people who know how, or to train their employees to do so.

renkinjutsu
May 25th, 2010, 02:39 PM
I use Firefox instead of Linux
and soon, people will say "I use ChromeOS instead of Firefox"

What? ... wait. .. Okay, i'll give you that one.

julio_cortez
May 25th, 2010, 02:47 PM
Assuming their role in the bank envolves that, of course I wouldn't. However, it's up to the bank to either hire people who know how, or to train their employees to do so.
So, assuming that the role of a secretary is write letters and maybe keep an agenda/to do list for her manager, would you hire yourself a secretary which uses the CD tray as a cup holder?

Maybe it's just me who ran out of patience (I need a holiday, yes I need it) but when you deal with people that is supposed to do wire transfers with a PC and doesn't know how to, after you explain them how to do it and after that they still get it wrong, you wonder why they still are allowed to get near a PC.

But maybe also Grenage is right:

Computers really don't matter that much, they're just tools that can be used in many ways.
It's not that some people don't know how to use a PC, but it looks like they don't know WHAT they are supposed to do and will eventually do it wrong even using paper and pen..

Tristam Green
May 25th, 2010, 02:51 PM
And this can be easily avoided if people working with PCs are trained (and tested before starting working) or have some worldwide recognized "license" (well, I'd still have them performing a test anyway).
Maybe I'm wrong keeping on stressing on this thing, but I'm afraid that in-house courses not always produce the desired result.

This is nothing more than OJT can handle. Let's increase the amount of ridiculous bureaucracy in the world by licensing people to work on a consumer-level device. This is a desktop computer, not a forklift. They're not facing any occupational hazard from potential misuse.

Jeez, while we're at it let's license people to operate copiers, postage machines, and shredders too, am I right?


In addition, usually backup is planned to run over night. If I lose a "critical" file over which I've been working on for 2 or 3 hours during the day because I forget to save it (or just don't save it properly), how is a backup from the day before supposed to recover it?

Sounds like 99% of the other issues users have, being chalked up under "user error; don't mess it up again". No license is going to fix stupidity.


It may be me, but I've been trained to think at the "worst case" before everything else.

It's more than slightly irritating that you think you're the only one of us who has, and that you feel it necessary to indicate that you are trained as such.

RiceMonster
May 25th, 2010, 02:55 PM
So, assuming that the role of a secretary is write letters and maybe keep an agenda/to do list for her manager, would you hire yourself a secretary which uses the CD tray as a cup holder?

I would post in the job requirements that they have to be framiliar with Office, and if I found the person was that clumsy, I would not hire them. This, however, is a completely different issue than requiring a license to use a computer. If someone buys their own computer and they want to foolishly use the CD tray as a cup holder, so be it.

julio_cortez
May 25th, 2010, 03:05 PM
If someone buys their own computer and they want to foolishly use the CD tray as a cup holder, so be it.
That's why I told before that if I screw up my own PC there's no problem.
Anyway, I don't know, but I seem like the only one that goes out of patience with people that are supposed to know what they're doing while they're not..
Maybe ECDL is not the way to go but there MUST be a way to limit damage made out of lack of knowledge about the jobe one's doing.


Sounds like 99% of the other issues users have, being chalked up under "user error; don't mess it up again". No license is going to fix stupidity.
I don't understand this part, but I saw a lot of issues caused by users who then tried to blame them on the IT staff afterwards.
And I'm sure that a little knowledge can prevent many of these.
No licence is going to fix stupidity, this is right, but lack of knowledge can be fixed by a course or something similar. And, well, after the course people are supposed to show what they can do, hence the "license" idea.


It's more than slightly irritating that you think you're the only one of us who has, and that you feel it necessary to indicate that you are trained as such.
Well, if I'm here is because I'm a total noob at Ubuntu and I'm willing to learn. Nothing wrong with admitting it.
I know I'm slightly better at using Windows, and I also assume that most of the people here are probably more skilled than me (I've started working just in 2007), my intention of course wasn't to annoy anyone. Apologies if I sounded "arrogant" somehow, it wasn't my intention.

DrMelon
May 25th, 2010, 03:07 PM
I fear that Chrome OS will only deepen this issue.

pwnst*r
May 25th, 2010, 03:28 PM
It's an issue?

del_diablo
May 25th, 2010, 03:52 PM
I don't understand cars, and I've been around them my whole life. I've been driving for several years now. I don't know the differences between one engine vs. another or what makes a BMW better/worse than a Ford. I just drive it and barely even notice it unless something is screwy.

Most people just use their computer and don't think about it unless something goes wrong.

The question of whether or not these things are good or bad is another thing entirely...

But there is a key difference: When you got a flat tire on a car you DO know that something is wrong and likely will be able to point it out, and get it fixed.
RAM goes on computer, manually destroying USB ports, etc?
The thing is: People treat their cars properly they spot errors, they know how to drive.....
You see where this is going, and the point. People are a bunch of blind clods around computers, while they are not around cars.
Maybe in 10 years the situation will have changed. But be darned, the current situation is not bearable.

Tristam Green
May 25th, 2010, 03:57 PM
But there is a key difference: When you got a flat tire on a car you DO know that something is wrong and likely will be able to point it out, and get it fixed.
RAM goes on computer, manually destroying USB ports, etc?
The thing is: People treat their cars properly they spot errors, they know how to drive.....
You see where this is going, and the point. People are a bunch of blind clods around computers, while they are not around cars.
Maybe in 10 years the situation will have changed. But be darned, the current situation is not bearable.

I love how you people are drawing completely unfair analogies.

Destroyed RAM or USB ports are equal to flat tires? Give me a break.

A flat tire would be analogous to a CD drive not opening.

Fried RAM would be more analogous to a toasted alternator or something less obvious.

A chewed-up USB port would be like a failed ODB-II port or something.

pwnst*r
May 25th, 2010, 04:26 PM
I love how you people are drawing completely unfair analogies.

Destroyed RAM or USB ports are equal to flat tires? Give me a break.

A flat tire would be analogous to a CD drive not opening.

Fried RAM would be more analogous to a toasted alternator or something less obvious.

A chewed-up USB port would be like a failed ODB-II port or something.

/thread.

DrMelon
May 25th, 2010, 05:25 PM
/thread.

Not really, considering the thread is about OS and Browser confusion, not about car analogies...

pwnst*r
May 25th, 2010, 07:07 PM
Not really, considering the thread is about OS and Browser confusion, not about car analogies...

I don't see anybody even discussing OS and browser confusion any more. It's a non-issue.

nexoncore
May 25th, 2010, 07:22 PM
I dont use mint, I use chewing gum!

NCLI
May 25th, 2010, 07:37 PM
Couldn't agree more :)
And, for people arguing you need to take a test to drive, that's for safety - it's very unlikely that you crash your computer with the potential to kill yourself and/or others :P

Also, as another analogy, most people who speak English don't actually understand how it's constructed - the vast majority of people on here, I imagine, speak English as as first language and yet there are a large number of grammatical errors. People don't care about understanding the things they use, only the things they're interested in :)
You'd be surprised (http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/ubuntuforums.org#). Only ~30% of our visitors are native English speakers. Not at all a "vast majority" ;)

anoknusa
May 25th, 2010, 07:46 PM
We poke fun, but ask someone about their car which is above and beyond putting the key into the ignition and twisting....most people wouldn't have a clue either. Both cars and computers are just as proliferate.

A good point, but we don't hand the keys to the trucker or pizza delivery driver who can't tell the difference between the gas pedal and the brake. People depend on computers every day, yet are clueless about how they work. Just wave the mouse like a magic wand and click in the right spots, and the magic box will hopefully do what you want it to; if it doesn't, then count to ten and go bitch to someone else about it, who then (at least half the time) solves the problem in a matter of minutes.

I know I'm sure as hell no computer expert: I'm just getting used this command line business in linux. But if you depend on a computer to get through your day, expect to use it to it's full potential and--of course--threw money at it, learn how to use it. My buddy just bought a MacBook a few months back for a cool $1100 and just learned how to burn a cd. This isn't the way to build a stable, modern society: "Just throw away money and the magic box will fix all your problems for you."

To end this long and (no doubt for you folks) tiring rant: if you can't at least pump your own gas, find the right pedals, find the blinkers and park, don't get behind the wheel. Now, apply that over-extended metaphor to computers, please.

mkendall
May 25th, 2010, 08:05 PM
To end this long and (no doubt for you folks) tiring rant: if you can't at least pump your own gas, find the right pedals, find the blinkers and park, don't get behind the wheel. Now, apply that over-extended metaphor to computers, please.

Finally someone gets the OS/browser to automobile analogy correct.

lisati
May 25th, 2010, 08:09 PM
Finally someone gets the OS/browser to automobile analogy correct.
+1.

I'm wondering if I should build a sign to hold up when someone asks for tech support, "Press F1 for help".

Wait: that might be too much like "Read the 'Fine' Manual". :)

Tristam Green
May 25th, 2010, 08:21 PM
To end this long and (no doubt for you folks) tiring rant: if you can't at least pump your own gas, find the right pedals, find the blinkers and park, don't get behind the wheel. Now, apply that over-extended metaphor to computers, please.

If you cannot press the power button, use a mouse, make legible words with the keyboard, and click on "X" to close a program?

Gee, sounds like some forum users lose since they cannot do the third thing in that list themselves...

julio_cortez
May 26th, 2010, 09:39 AM
I'm wondering if I should build a sign to hold up when someone asks for tech support, "Press F1 for help".
"Press ANY KEY for help" would do better.
If they come up with a key of their choice, they're good to go. If they ask you where to find the "Any" key, you'll at least know immediately that it'll be a LOOOOONG day :P


Gee, sounds like some forum users lose since they cannot do the third thing in that list themselves...
This is where I agree with you.
There's a kind of SMS-style writing that is annoying to read (the one that goes "u dunno wot ure talkin bout cuz ure 2 stupid 2 run a linux distro") , especially for people that don't have English as native language and also find understanding "normal" English difficult from time to time.

ssj6akshat
May 26th, 2010, 11:18 AM
O HAI!
WTF Bowser,OS?
I can haz firefox cuz microsoft n google are teh ebil.
KTHXBYE

julio_cortez
May 26th, 2010, 11:50 AM
I can haz firefox cuz microsoft n google are teh ebil.
Sure!!
http://www.mozilla-europe.org/en/firefox/ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_grammar)

:P :P :P

ssj6akshat
May 26th, 2010, 12:50 PM
Sure!!
http://www.mozilla-europe.org/en/firefox/ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_grammar)

:P :P :P

No this is my new language.It is called LOLCODE++

bigseb
May 26th, 2010, 12:51 PM
ran into that at the poker game last night. Some guy noticed my flash drive and wanted to know what i had on it. I told him it was linux (mint) os. He replied that uses firefox. Wtf?

I told him i use firefox too and then tried to explain what an operating system was but his eyes soon developed that glazed look. There seem to be a lot of users who conflate the web browser with the os.

And oh yeah, he cracked my pocket queens with pocket nines so, all in all, a fairly frustrating evening at the poker table.
rofl

MooPi
May 26th, 2010, 01:25 PM
That's why I only give it out to old folks who just want to browse the web, play solitaire, and use it to check their e-mail (thank bajeebus none of them use yahoo, I still can't get evolution to work with it)
I think you pay extra for pop mail service with Yahoo.

julio_cortez
May 26th, 2010, 01:48 PM
No this is my new language.It is called LOLCODE++
Well indeed it makes me LOL :P

anoknusa
May 26th, 2010, 07:52 PM
If you cannot press the power button, use a mouse, make legible words with the keyboard, and click on "X" to close a program?]

What, you mean like

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Originally Posted by <strong>anoknusa</strong>
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<div style="font-style:italic">To end this long and (no doubt for you folks) tiring rant: if you can't at least pump your own gas, find the right pedals, find the blinkers and park, don't get behind the wheel. Now, apply that over-extended metaphor to computers, please.</div>

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</div>If you cannot press the power button, use a mouse, make legible words with the keyboard, and click on &quot;X&quot; to close a program?<br />
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Gee, sounds like some forum users lose since they cannot do the third thing in that list themselves...</div>
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Oh, how we kid and caper... \\:D/

We have intelligence officials and executives for international electronics companies who can't tell us the first thing about the computers they use every day, just as we have computer programmers who couldn't write a coherent essay to keep their mothers from being shot. In each case, it's hard to take them seriously. As for the general public, if they wanna throw their money away on unnecessary tech service, that's their business. It doesn't mean this bitter codger needs to respect them for it, as they're probably intelligent enough to learn these things if they would only make the effort.