PDA

View Full Version : Who is waiting for the ARM laptops?



PhoenixMaster00
April 14th, 2009, 02:20 AM
With ARM about to make a foray into the netbook/nettop market who else is holding off buying a netbook a little longer to see if they are worth the wait.

I have been tempted to get a dell mini 9 lately but with Ubuntu working on ARM and it offering superior battery life to current netbooks it seems that it could be worth the wait.

What is everyone elses opinion on the next wave of netbook? Anyone else holding out a little longer? When are the first ones popping up in shops (more specifically the UK).

The battery life is a big thing for me and im hoping its powerful to run the average amount of programs normal for a netbook.

Im looking forward to reading other peoples views on the subject and hopefully others know more about the subject than me :P

SunnyRabbiera
April 14th, 2009, 02:21 AM
It does seem like a good chip, but I am worried about software compatibility, especially flash.
Though I do know that adobe had plans for it, but seeing how long it took to make flash 64bit it doesnt look good.

Chemical Imbalance
April 14th, 2009, 02:24 AM
It makes me wish I'd waited, I bought an Atom one half a year ago....too bad for me :frown:

Mokoma
April 14th, 2009, 02:25 AM
whats is arm?

Chemical Imbalance
April 14th, 2009, 02:26 AM
whats is arm?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARM_architecture

Its a low-power, mobile processor

Mokoma
April 14th, 2009, 02:27 AM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARM_architecture

Its a low-power, mobile processor

oh its risc based fair enough, makes more sense now xD

SunnyRabbiera
April 14th, 2009, 02:27 AM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARM_architecture

Its a low-power, mobile processor

Yes though I heard they are quite good for that kind of processor.

Mokoma
April 14th, 2009, 02:29 AM
a low power risc processor would be good

Chemical Imbalance
April 14th, 2009, 02:29 AM
Yes though I heard they are quite good for that kind of processor.

It would be great for a netbook, especially battery life (my stupid, measly 2.5 hours currently)

SunnyRabbiera
April 14th, 2009, 02:31 AM
It would be great for a netbook, especially battery life (my stupid, measly 2.5 hours currently)

Yeh I know its battery power that makes them popular on these kind of machines.

Chemical Imbalance
April 14th, 2009, 02:34 AM
Yeh I know its battery power that makes them popular on these kind of machines.

Not to mention they are cheap :)

Mokoma
April 14th, 2009, 02:38 AM
i would buy a netbook it it was about /$99. was linux based(preferably ubuntu or opensuse) and had a nvidia graphics chip. pretty easy huh?

I-75
April 14th, 2009, 02:38 AM
With ARM about to make a foray into the netbook/nettop market who else is holding off buying a netbook a little longer to see if they are worth the wait.

I have been tempted to get a dell mini 9 lately but with Ubuntu working on ARM and it offering superior battery life to current netbooks it seems that it could be worth the wait.

What is everyone elses opinion on the next wave of netbook? Anyone else holding out a little longer? When are the first ones popping up in shops (more specifically the UK).

The battery life is a big thing for me and im hoping its powerful to run the average amount of programs normal for a netbook.

Im looking forward to reading other peoples views on the subject and hopefully others know more about the subject than me :P

My advice...if you can get a good netbook right now for around $200...go for it...otherwise wait for the ARM.

Chemical Imbalance
April 14th, 2009, 02:45 AM
i would buy a netbook it it was about /$99. was linux based(preferably ubuntu or opensuse) and had a nvidia graphics chip. pretty easy huh?

♫ ♬ Soommmmeeewwhheeeerrrrrre ooooverrr the rainbow ♬ ♫

Mokoma
April 14th, 2009, 02:47 AM
♫ ♬ Soommmmeeewwhheeeerrrrrre over the rainbow ♬ ♫

LOL@ THAT SARCASM!! but seriously netbooks over /$100 arent really worth it as there straying into laptop territory

Mehall
April 14th, 2009, 02:47 AM
♫ ♬ Soommmmeeewwhheeeerrrrrre ooooverrr the rainbow ♬ ♫

xDDDD


unfortunately, that's the kind I'm waiting on =[

I hereby promise that if there is one of those on the UK market by Christmas, it is my job to pester my parents for that for Christmas.

Mokoma
April 14th, 2009, 02:50 AM
xDDDD


unfortunately, that's the kind I'm waiting on =[

I hereby promise that if there is one of those on the UK market by Christmas, it is my job to pester my parents for that for Christmas.

lol good luck (y)

Chemical Imbalance
April 14th, 2009, 02:54 AM
Check this out: http://www.mini-notebook-laptop.com/en/asus-bringt-2009-200-dollar-eee-pc/



and

http://news.idealo.co.uk/news/3633/asus-plans-an-eee-pc-for-under-200-us-dollars.html

TheIdiotThatIsMe
April 14th, 2009, 03:16 AM
Is there any place to keep up on news about the ARM netbooks. I keep running across news bits randomly, and usually a few months old. For example, the prototype demo's done by Pegatron that I found from another thread on here, posted. Turned out to be like 2 months old, and that they were shipping in June - August.

Just wanna keep track so I can get one on launch day :guitar:

Mokoma
April 14th, 2009, 03:19 AM
Check this out: http://www.mini-notebook-laptop.com/en/asus-bringt-2009-200-dollar-eee-pc/



and

http://news.idealo.co.uk/news/3633/asus-plans-an-eee-pc-for-under-200-us-dollars.html

if they use nvidia graphics chips i might actually buy one, but if its intel graphics "accelerator", ill pass

Chemical Imbalance
April 14th, 2009, 03:23 AM
if they use nvidia graphics chips i might actually buy one, but if its intel graphics "accelerator", ill pass

It will be Intel most likely because they usually sell notebooks with their "chipset" (intel processor + intel graphics chip)

Mokoma
April 14th, 2009, 03:29 AM
It will be Intel most likely because they usually sell notebooks with their "chipset" (intel processor + intel graphics chip)

oh well my old desktop it is then :S

Mehall
April 14th, 2009, 03:32 AM
It will be Intel most likely because they usually sell notebooks with their "chipset" (intel processor + intel graphics chip)

Intel don't make ARMs, so they can use any graphics they want.

Chemical Imbalance
April 14th, 2009, 03:36 AM
Intel don't make ARMs, so they can use any graphics they want.

No, we are referring to the link I posted about the under $200 asus (in reference to an earlier post):



Originally Posted by Chemical Imbalance View Post
Check this out: http://www.mini-notebook-laptop.com/...dollar-eee-pc/



and

http://news.idealo.co.uk/news/3633/a...s-dollars.html

Mehall
April 14th, 2009, 03:44 AM
No, we are referring to the link I posted about the under $200 asus (in reference to an earlier post):

woops, my bad.

Chemical Imbalance
April 14th, 2009, 03:46 AM
woops, my bad.

No problem, :)

TheSlipstream
April 14th, 2009, 05:07 AM
I'd buy one in a second if it was no more then $200AU. I'm really not picky. Unfortunately, they cost about $320AU, and this is the 701. All I really want to do is read books on it...I don't need a hard-drive at all, a 4GiB SSD would do, 256Mib RAM would also be enough (although I have 512 laptop RAM lying around somewhere). Why do people want such powerful netbooks? I'd take lower prices in a second.

Edit: I'll add that I have a powerful self built desktop, with a C2D E7300 and 22" screen. I'm not lacking any power, I just don't think netbooks need it.

gn2
April 14th, 2009, 07:25 AM
http://www.arm.com/news/23761.html

It'll be a long wait, just get an Acer Aspire One.....

SKLP
April 14th, 2009, 11:58 AM
Waiting for the ARM netbooks, patiently ;-)

mips
April 14th, 2009, 12:30 PM
It does seem like a good chip, but I am worried about software compatibility, especially flash.
Though I do know that adobe had plans for it, but seeing how long it took to make flash 64bit it doesnt look good.


I would not worry to much about it. Adobe is very busy porting flash to ARM. They are under a lot of pressure from mobile communication device makers that use the ARM chip and there are plenty of them. This market is WAY bigger than the 64bit linux desktop market.

I will try and find some links I saw previously on this.
http://www.adobe.com/aboutadobe/pressroom/pressreleases/200811/111708ARMAdobeFlash.html
http://www.openscreenproject.org/partners/current_partners.html

Software is supposed to be released 2nd half of 2009 which is around the corner.

xir_
April 14th, 2009, 01:42 PM
when my eee 701 goes to the big server farm in the sky i will replace it with an arm netbook. I want something with a 10 inch screen, nice and thin and a significant battery life.

My biggest problem though is that i probably will have to make Intel compiler specific software and doing it on arm seems to be a big backward.

PhoenixMaster00
April 14th, 2009, 01:43 PM
Waiting for the ARM netbooks, patiently ;-)

+1. I mean Dell are selling dell mini 9s with Ubuntu on then for 199 (289 if i upgrade the 4gb ssd to 32gd ssd) but it only has a 3 hour battery life and since i would do a lot of Uni coursework on it i wont always be near a plug if im in the library or the social rooms doing brainstorming work with others. The 10 hours (supposedly?) of an ARM notebook would be perfect for on the go Uni work.

Then again the Dell does look quite sweet an seems to be ideal really in many ways...

Damn you choice!

SKLP
April 14th, 2009, 01:47 PM
+1. I mean Dell are selling dell mini 9s with Ubuntu on then for 199 (289 if i upgrade the 4gb ssd to 32gd ssd) but it only has a 3 hour battery life and since i would do a lot of Uni coursework on it i wont always be near a plug if im in the library or the social rooms doing brainstorming work with others. The 10 hours (supposedly?) of an ARM notebook would be perfect for on the go Uni work.

Then again the Dell does look quite sweet an seems to be ideal really in many ways...

Damn you choice!
Hopefully there will be ARM netbooks with 6 cell batteries available soon ;-) Then I'll probably buy one ASAP
12-16 hour battery life just seems awesome

gn2
April 14th, 2009, 01:50 PM
Just get an AA1 refurb (http://www.acerdirect.co.uk/box_opened_laptops/prod.asp) and a big capacity spare battery (http://tinyurl.com/d4pesh).....?

gnomeuser
April 14th, 2009, 02:23 PM
I crave one, I have decided that I will buy one the second I can get my hands on one with a danish keyboard (or if I can't then I shall use stickers). I saw the demo models and the lightness and no moving parts appeals to me, it would be the perfect machine to take to a coffee shop or to a friends house, no need to drag along a heavy power brick.

PhoenixMaster00
April 14th, 2009, 02:41 PM
Just get an AA1 refurb (http://www.acerdirect.co.uk/box_opened_laptops/prod.asp) and a big capacity spare battery (http://tinyurl.com/d4pesh).....?

Had an AA1. Not the best experience an ill just leave it at that ;)


Hopefully there will be ARM netbooks with 6 cell batteries available soon ;-) Then I'll probably buy one ASAP
12-16 hour battery life just seems awesome

That is pretty wicked :p and add in no need for a fan, super lightweight, can run Ubuntu and powerful enough to get any standard tasks done and it is pretty much the netbook people have been hoping for. Only thing up in the air for me is storage and quality of build.

gnomeuser what did you think to the quality of the actual build itself? Did it look durable and solid? And did they say what kind of Storage was in them size wise?

zekopeko
April 14th, 2009, 04:24 PM
i'm guessing that they will have 8+ GB of flash in them since they can only put OS with ARM support (like Ubuntu) since Ubuntu need only 2GB to install fully. or even Nokia's OS2008 or whatever it's called.

bashveank
April 14th, 2009, 04:26 PM
Not exactly with baited breath, but it'd be nice to get a cheap laptop with a long battery life to use on the couch while my big laptop renders out RAWs.

TwiceOver
April 14th, 2009, 04:59 PM
i'm guessing that they will have 8+ GB of flash in them since they can only put OS with ARM support (like Ubuntu) since Ubuntu need only 2GB to install fully. or even Nokia's OS2008 or whatever it's called.

Ohh god no. Maebo is such a horrible OS. Hopefully they'll go with something like Ubuntu... Something full featured.

3rdalbum
April 14th, 2009, 05:18 PM
I have my doubts that ARM will deliver massive battery life.

I measured CPU wakeups-per-second with Powertop on Intrepid and Jaunty on my Aspire One. Jaunty wakes up the CPU half as much as Intrepid did, yet the battery life is still exactly the same. Two hours, five minutes.

My view is that these netbook CPUs already use so little power, that further reducing their power use will not provide much of a return. The 1.6Ghz Atom and its controller use a mere 5 watts - it will take millions of dollars of R&D investment to reduce that to 4 watts, and provide users with an extra 15 seconds of run-time per charge.

The chipset uses 5.5 watts and this is partly accomplished by reducing the speed of the integrated graphics. So, basically, no big energy users there.

A netbook's backlight uses as much power than its CPU, controller and chipset put together. That's an obvious place to look at saving power; how about using a screen like the XO-1 that can be used in black-and-white without a backlight? The cost and benefit is MUCH more pleasant than fiddling around and trying to make an efficient CPU use a couple of milliwatts less power.

What I'm saying is, while the ARM-based netbooks may deliver lower power use and longer battery life, it's not inherent to the ARM platform, and there's about a 50/50 chance that you'll get realistically the same battery life on the ARM netbooks as you do on the Atom netbooks.

mips
April 14th, 2009, 05:49 PM
What I'm saying is, while the ARM-based netbooks may deliver lower power use and longer battery life, it's not inherent to the ARM platform, and there's about a 50/50 chance that you'll get realistically the same battery life on the ARM netbooks as you do on the Atom netbooks.

I would like to disagree. Just the supporting Intel chipset for the Atom consumes a lot of power in comparison to the Atom cpu. As it is now you can clock a ARM processor at 2GHz and it will consume 2W, granted clock speed is irrelevant between different architectures. When it comes to power efficiency the ARM beats the Atom by a big margin.

emshains
April 14th, 2009, 05:51 PM
Only if its cheap. I mean REALLY cheap. It must have expandable memory, or at least memory card slots. Then, it must be durable, both battery wise and structurally. Then it would rock.

SKLP
April 14th, 2009, 06:02 PM
I have my doubts that ARM will deliver massive battery life.

I measured CPU wakeups-per-second with Powertop on Intrepid and Jaunty on my Aspire One. Jaunty wakes up the CPU half as much as Intrepid did, yet the battery life is still exactly the same. Two hours, five minutes.

My view is that these netbook CPUs already use so little power, that further reducing their power use will not provide much of a return. The 1.6Ghz Atom and its controller use a mere 5 watts - it will take millions of dollars of R&D investment to reduce that to 4 watts, and provide users with an extra 15 seconds of run-time per charge.

The chipset uses 5.5 watts and this is partly accomplished by reducing the speed of the integrated graphics. So, basically, no big energy users there.

A netbook's backlight uses as much power than its CPU, controller and chipset put together. That's an obvious place to look at saving power; how about using a screen like the XO-1 that can be used in black-and-white without a backlight? The cost and benefit is MUCH more pleasant than fiddling around and trying to make an efficient CPU use a couple of milliwatts less power.

What I'm saying is, while the ARM-based netbooks may deliver lower power use and longer battery life, it's not inherent to the ARM platform, and there's about a 50/50 chance that you'll get realistically the same battery life on the ARM netbooks as you do on the Atom netbooks.The Arm netbooks use a Freescale MX515 System-on-a-chip (cpu, gpu, chipset in one chip) that according to http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/09/pegatron-and-freescale-team-for-low-power-ultra-cheap-netbooks/ only uses 0.5W while playing HD video. Dunno if that really is correct, but it just seems promising ;-)

Methuselah
April 14th, 2009, 06:04 PM
I'm curious about them. I was intereted in the pandora too but it doesn't seem like it'll ever be finished.

LowSky
April 14th, 2009, 06:14 PM
Can ARM run Windows XP/Vista/7

If no these laptops will probably fail.

Just look at the netbook market, its dominated by Windows in only 6 months afte rthe first releas eof a Win based netbook

Also we cant run Ubuntu on an ARM based machine because Ubuntu doesn't release a version based on the arcitecture, but Debian is available so maybe a netbook release based on that wouldn't be too bad.

markp1989
April 14th, 2009, 06:15 PM
arm does look promicing, 1 of the reason i want an openpandora, but i dnt know when it will be released

markp1989
April 14th, 2009, 06:20 PM
Edit: I'll add that I have a powerful self built desktop, with a C2D E7300 and 22" screen. I'm not lacking any power, I just don't think netbooks need it.

i completly agree, i dont know why alot of people keep putting down netbooks because of there power, people seem to expect that a 200 laptop, that is half the size of most laptops will be as powerfull as there desktop pc, and in reality its not going to happen.

SKLP
April 14th, 2009, 06:26 PM
Also we cant run Ubuntu on an ARM based machine because Ubuntu doesn't release a version based on the arcitecture, but Debian is available so maybe a netbook release based on that wouldn't be too bad.FYI, http://www.ubuntu.com/news/arm-linux

Chemical Imbalance
April 15th, 2009, 12:27 AM
FYI, http://www.ubuntu.com/news/arm-linux

There's also a download of ARM version now on the Jaunty download page:

http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/netboot/9.04/beta/ (Ubuntu ARM)