Ubuntu & Freedom: Has anyone else suffered the "elitist" problem lately

[Nightstrike2009]

Hiya everyone I am relatively new to Ubuntu and feel a distrubing trend on this forum by a select few to be all elitist with newcomers.

Most of the people on this forum have been very positive & helpful, a select few others have been a total pain in the backside. Like telling people how they should install their programs & how to use their PC's and so on. I maybe new but let me point one thing out I AM ON THE SAME SIDE AS YOU, If I was happy with the other OS's I wouldn't be here and using Ubuntu, I am here because I like Ubuntu and want to use it as my main OS one day. I am not here to be told what to do with my own PC and how to use it, I'd stick with Windows if I was happy with that attitude.

The biggest obstacle Ubuntu faces in my opinion is this elitist attitude a few users display toward newcomers. Linux is about FREEDOM of choice, FREEDOM of use, FREEDOM to do things your own way, as most of us know.

Has any others newcomers or otherwise experienced this problem lately?

[Skripka]

UF is currently in a state of community meltdown, to put it mildly....unfortunately-new folks get caught in the crossfire.

[wolfen69]

every OS has this. it's not just ubuntu/linux.

[wolfen69]

UF is currently in a state of community meltdown

as you see it. i think the community is doing just fine.

what would you do to change it?

[shadylookin]

I've been noticing it since birth it's called human nature. Sometimes people are just jerks some more often than others for any reason or none at all. You just got to learn not to let it ruin your good time.

[Nightstrike2009]

I understand that Wolfen69, but its very annoying isn't it to mention stupid attacking our own kind.

In reply to Skripka

UF is currently in a state of community meltdown, to put it mildly....unfortunately-new folks get caught in the crossfire.
How has this come about, do you know what caused it? not being funny just curious to learn more :)

Don't worry shadylookin, I am enjoying learning about Ubuntu and I am learning fast, your right there will always be haters, it's their problem not ours best thing we can do is ignore them and let them keep making theirselves look stupid & childish.

PS: I am using a test version of Ubuntu 9.04 Alpha 6 and I am enjoying using it too, but iam prepared to wipe my hard disk and start again if I must do in order to learn Ubuntu. I know its not recommended for newcomers but Iam having fun and learning a lot from using it, it suits my needs until the final is released. :) "Lead, don't follow" LOL

[Sealbhach]

UF is currently in a state of community meltdown, to put it mildly....unfortunately-new folks get caught in the crossfire.

There's been some unwelcome elements creeping in, but it's a bit dramatic to say meltdown.

To OP, maybe they're just trying to help?

.

[Skripka]

I understand that Wolfen69, but its very annoying isn't it to mention stupid attacking our own kind.

In reply to Skripka

How has this come about, do you know what caused it? not being funny just curious to learn more :)

The Forums, for better or worse have changed a great deal in the month or so....in part as a result of hardware problems.. Which, a long story shortly summarized...has alienated a great many old hands around here-many of whom used to help out in the Support areas a great deal-they're getting fed up for a variety of reasons and leaving....those that are still around are rather pissy these days and are soon to follow in leaving.

On UF-a great many folks who help new Ubuntu users are Ex-Ubuntu users...they hang around and help because they want to. In the name of community. A large portion of said community is up in arms...and when they leave it will hurt this board a great deal...especially with a new release around the bend, and lots of new users.

Who knows how this place will cope.

[Nightstrike2009]

Sorry whats OP? I have used Ubuntu since December (under different name) and learned a lot but don't know what that means yet.

In reply to Skripka, surely that then means that UF needs more newcomers to learn and fill the gaps that have been left, I too am willing to share what I know with UF including Nvidia 180 driver installation, Compiz installation and Cube settings amongst others (posted some but the 9.04 alpha ones were a mistake caused more probs than answers for me anyhow, I'll leave 9.04 answers intil final is released). If we all pitch in we should be able to help each other. I know there used too be a thanks system that now seems defunct, which was helpful in finding helpful users.

[wolfen69]

OP= original poster

[Skripka]

There's been some unwelcome elements creeping in, but it's a bit dramatic to say meltdown.

.

Well. The Community Cafe has been reduced to bashin,g and bashing people who are bashing...I'm not sure what else to call it.

[Nightstrike2009]

Thanks Wolfen69, I'd like to think so, but I think they were just showing off to be honest but I aint impressed probably going off my low post count (pity the one under my other name (100+ posts) had posted a lot more and I could see through it) LOL

In reply to Skripka, I've noticed that too my friend its stupid but its like a virus it keeps spreading (guess I've helped it now by accident too, whoops.)

Sometimes the best way seems to be to keep going at the problem and hope you break it before it breaks you, works for me anyhow :)

[wolfen69]

Well. The Community Cafe has been reduced to bashin,g and bashing people who are bashing...I'm not sure what else to call it.

i'm sorry you see it that way. sure, there is a certain amount, but overall, i think it's just fine here. the mods do a great job of keeping this place running smooth. ;)

[Skripka]

i'm sorry you see it that way. sure, there is a certain amount, but overall, i think it's just fine here. the mods do a great job of keeping this place running smooth. ;)

If by "smooth" you mean turning the Cafe into another Support forum...well, yes.

There's an increasing amount of junk, and tech support getting posted here-as it has no other home now...and the level of discourse here seems to have bottomed out.

[wolfen69]

they were just showing off to be honest but I aint impressed probably going off my low post count

when anything starts to become big, there are going to be certain things to overcome. you can either choose to become part of the solution, or part of the problem. just ask any diehard mac/windows user that likes to frequent the forums. they have been battling these things for years. the best thing to do is relax and have fun. the mods will weed out the bad seeds.

[wolfen69]

If by "smooth" you mean turning the Cafe into another Support forum...well, yes.

There's an increasing amount of junk, and tech support getting posted here-as it has no other home now...and the level of discourse here seems to have bottomed out.

this affects your life, how?

[Nightstrike2009]

Originally posted by wolfen69:
the mods will weed out the bad seeds.

You have a lot more confidence than me on this issue my friend, I wish I shared it, unfortunately I don't, though I do respect your opinions.

[Skripka]

this affects your life, how?

Well, it turns this place into a dry tech support forum-which are a dime a dozen on the internet. When people who don't need tech assistance come here for community interaction, and all there is to be found is dry tech support questions...how long will the freelance community helpers stay interested in answering the same queries about installing the Nvidia drivers every day?

What differentiated Ubuntu from any other distro was this place. And it's community full of helpers.

[wolfen69]

i've been doing forums and chat rooms for a LONG time. things always have a way of working out. just enjoy the ride.

[wolfen69]

Well, it turns this place into a dry tech support forum-which are a dime a dozen on the internet. When people who don't need tech assistance come here for community interaction, and all there is to be found is dry tech support questions...how long will the freelance community helpers stay interested in answering the same queries about installing the Nvidia drivers every day?

What differentiated Ubuntu from any other distro was this place. And it's community full of helpers.

and what do you propose as an answer? i'm all for it if someone has some truly good ideas.

[Skripka]

i've been doing forums and chat rooms for a LONG time. things always have a way of working out. just enjoy the ride.

We'll see. FOSS projects have a nasty tendency of having one straw that breaks everything.


I too have thought this is just spring cabin fever, many boards get it this time of year...but I'm getting strong doubts.

[Nightstrike2009]

I am new to Ubuntu but if I can help other users I will, the spirit of this forum is alive and well, its the patronising of all users we don't need. Less headstrong new users would just up and leave, reducing the numbers of future helpers for Ubuntu and harming the forum itself. :(

I myself was so incensed I briefly left and went to Kubuntu, but calmed down and returned. As others have said just enjoy the fun and ignore them as much as we can, hopefully then they might get bored and go pester or dictate to someone else.

[BGFG]

We'll see. FOSS projects have a nasty tendency of having one straw that breaks everything.


I too have thought this is just spring cabin fever, many boards get it this time of year...but I'm getting strong doubts.

On a totally different note, once i get an 'Other OS' prob. OpenSolaris, I'll come join you guys at the new hangout.

Hope this whole elitist/bashing topic ends soon... :)

[Nightstrike2009]

BGFG: Hope this whole elitist/bashing topic ends soon...

Hope this elitist attitude ends soon before all newcomers give up and go to another Linux OS or even worse Windows7. :(

[cardinals_fan]

My 2 cents on the issues around here lately:

I believe that these forums have been on the decline, which has hit free fall lately. However, I do not blame the mods or admins for this in the slightest. There just seem to be too few posters now who don't already have their opinions set in stone, and a shouting match back and forth just isn't that interesting. Evidence, focus, and argumentation are all key to debate or discuss something. All three just seem rarer on these forums now.

[jrusso2]

The Forums, for better or worse have changed a great deal in the month or so....in part as a result of hardware problems.. Which, a long story shortly summarized...has alienated a great many old hands around here-many of whom used to help out in the Support areas a great deal-they're getting fed up for a variety of reasons and leaving....those that are still around are rather pissy these days and are soon to follow in leaving.

On UF-a great many folks who help new Ubuntu users are Ex-Ubuntu users...they hang around and help because they want to. In the name of community. A large portion of said community is up in arms...and when they leave it will hurt this board a great deal...especially with a new release around the bend, and lots of new users.

Who knows how this place will cope.


I left about a month ago because I was here to try to help new users and got tired of being attacked every time I wrote something by the same old tired group here of about five users here that have to post on every thread.

[wolfen69]

There just seem to be too few posters now who don't already have their opinions set in stone
mine, as some of you might know, are set in titanium. but i'm open to new ideas.

[Nightstrike2009]

I personally I am in two minds to stay and learn and pass on what I learn or to up-sticks and leave Ubuntu for another Linux OS, because of getting non-constructive critism / unwanted & unhelpful advice when simply seeking advice or trying to offer help other users. I may even build on my experience leave UF and carry on using Ubuntu & learn by trial and error (Prob the best 2nd choice, I have) :(

[k2t0f12d]

I've never had a problem with elitism and free software. Of course, I can count the number of times I've resorted to coming to a public forum seeking technical support on one hand. Reading the friendly manual actually works, is quicker, less stressful, intellectually stimulating, and personally rewarding after solving your own problems.

Otherwise, go buy support from someone FFS.

[kelvin spratt]

I don't see any Elitism in this forum Just differing opinions.

[DMcA]

I think these forums (the cafe at least) are doing fine. The quality of discussion here is considerably better than your average forum out there and people tend to be really nice to each other, even when they completely disagree. None of the standard internet flame wars.

[dmizer]

We do not have the ability to watch every poster and every thread.

Eletist behavior is unwelcome here. If you see it, please (no really ... please!) use the report post feature: http://ubuntuforums.org/images/buttons/report.gif

[FLMKane]

I'd like to say that this place is nothing compared to the stuff I'm used to (any of you ever been on bullshido.net?)

You people might think the forum is in freefall, but I think this place is great, though admittedly I'm just a noob. I really think the people here are very nice.

Dont get too upset and just ride it it out. It'll improve.

[Calmatory]

What do you mean by that people tell you how to use your computer?

[pelle.k]

The biggest obstacle Ubuntu faces in my opinion is this elitist attitude a few users display toward newcomers.
It's everywhere, not just here.
Need i remind you, these are people venting, trolling and projecting the own fears and insecurities on people that are far enough away to kick them in the butt.
Don't let it get to you. Count to ten before you reply back in anger and feed the trolls. The ubuntuforums have been very good in this regard as long as i can remember. People are generally pretty mature.
As i see it, the middleground is the worst. Either you let it run off, and when it gets too far you should warn these people, and the BAM, ban them.

[Nightstrike2009]

To hell with the haters, I am staying with Ubuntu 9.04 I've made more breakthroughs with ubuntu so much so It may eventually become my main OS.

I've been gone, not because I gave up, but because I've been trying to get Nvidia Drivers, Compiz-Config-manager and ubuntu-restricted-extras (30) working with 9.04 Alpha 6 (alongside and with the help of other Ubuntu community members).
Nvidia Drivers & Compiz-Config-manager are functioning correctly now with 2 workarounds as Compiz-config-manager has a bug in the horizontal slider (resets from 4 to 2 although ok with every other setting) which I've reported. Very close to getting ubuntu-restricted-extras functioning correctly too. If thats not proof the haters are wrong I don't know what is.:)

I'll carry on learning and expanding my knowledge of Linux (with the help from the great ubuntu community) I'll leave the haters to doing what they do best hating. My actions speak louder than their hate ever will.

PS: Too all the newcomers if it works on your machine then its fine, there's "more than one way to skin an ubuntu cat" ignore the trolling and continue to enjoy your experience. Be patient it takes time to learn but you will get there if your patient and determined enough, don't let them spoil your fun. Good Luck to you all :)

Linux Ubuntu "Until all are one":)