9.04 : Missing shutdown menu

[dlublink]

Hey,

I am running Ubunty Jaunty installed from Alpha 5 and upgraded. The shutdown menu is missing from the system menu, but it is still in the little-green-man menu. The little-green-man menu works perfectly.

Is this a change to the interface or is there a problem? What kind of information should I collect on this problem before I open a ticket?

Thanks,

David

[forumache]

Don't worry, it is a change of interface. I was there when it happened :)

If you want to open a ticket, open one saying: no icons for the Shutdown, Hibernate, Logout, Restart, Lock screen in FUSA (Fast User Switch Applet).

It looks kind of ugly like it is now, but it works as designed ;)

[TrueTom]

This is on purpose because it was way to easy for most people to shutdown their computers and it duplicates functionality in two different places. Duplication is only OK when it's in the same place like the FUSA status and Pidgin or the volume notification.

You have basically three options: 1) Use the other menu applet 2) Get rid of the FUSA applet or 3) Use a distro which has developers that take their medication regularly...

[ubu-for]

Don't worry, it is a change of interface.
I like the new interface!

[evolutionx]

This is on purpose because it was way to easy for most people to shutdown their computers and it duplicates functionality in two different places. Duplication is only OK when it's in the same place like the FUSA status and Pidgin or the volume notification.

You have basically three options: 1) Use the other menu applet 2) Get rid of the FUSA applet or 3) Use a distro which has developers that take their medication regularly...

I disagree... You could have left the shutdown items in the System menu and just included the 60 second delay conformation dialog just like the FUSA applet. That would solve accidental shutdowns right there.

Some of my computers are hooked up to low res screens like projectors so eliminating un-necessary applets is the first thing I do...now I am stuck with it.

Please give us choice!

[forumache]

Some of my computers are hooked up to low res screens like projectors so eliminating un-necessary applets is the first thing I do...now I am stuck with it.

Please give us choice!

Why don't you add the shutdown command to the System Menu yourself? If you remove an applet, you should add a menu command.

[Nullack]

I like the new interface!

Me too :)

Too much choice is a useability hassle. If you really like choice, try gentoo :)

[nyarnon]

Why don't you add the shutdown command to the System Menu yourself? If you remove an applet, you should add a menu command.

Doesn't it do that automagically?

[makro]

Doesn't it do that automagically?

YES it does!!

[Mr. Picklesworth]

There is already a bug report:
https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fast-user-switch-applet/+bug/343219

Personally, I see where they are coming from but I think this causes a regression (go to GDM without logging out or switching user) and, while it removes redundancy, results in things jumping around unexpectedly. In any account without FUSA the shutdown option is arbitrarily in a different place - a place that is empty when FUSA is in use. It's completely daft. Besides that, System -> Shutdown actually makes sense as a sentence, which is a type of design Gnome tries to apply.
Further, the System menu has no reason to be smaller. It would make some sense if the menu was as busy a menu as Applications or Places, but it isn't.

GNOME's shutdown dialog (which was finally adopted in the System menu without FUSA) is pretty nice and had some neat UI design ideas including the way that the countdown counted by 10s, then 5s, then 1s to avoid drawing too much attention. It even has a Help button to help those people who don't know what Hibernate and Suspend do.

Besides that, the Ubuntu developers have been changing the shutdown and logout menus with Every Single Release while adding no actual functionality. They need to stop doing it. If Ubuntu is meant to be a stable operating system that users can use for a long time, they need to stop trying to screw with their heads. I cheered when they finally stopped diverging from upstream with Intrepid, because I thought that meant they had seen the light.

Last problem: FUSA's shutdown dialog looks pretty but is an inconsistent waste of translation and documentation effort. If I hit the Power button on my computer I get a completely different shutdown menu (the one that you get through System -> Shutdown). What is so hard about integrating with what exists from upstream? This reminds me of those useless toolbars computer manufacturers throw in because they don't seem to realize the operating system they install already provides the same functionality in a better way.

[Yashiro]

Lack of consistency on such a simple process is indeed stupid.

[jarlath]

I like having less stuff in my menus and I always dump the mouse arrow into the top-right corner to shutdown/log out quickly so I like the change.

But I think everybody could be kept happy by having a checkbox in the FUSA preferences that says "Don't steal menu-entries from 'System' menu"

[GraysonPeddie]

I came across this article (http://vinci.wordpress.com/2009/03/29/removed-shutdown-in-ubuntu-jauntys-system-menu/) from Google and this got me concerned for those who use Orca as a screen reader (from the blind user point of view, although I'm visually impaired and I do use Orca and prefer the keyboard).

If Connonical really wanted to satisfy blind users who use Ubuntu, then Connonical needs to stop with the design changes that changes the way the blind users do to log off, switch users, or turn off their computer. Thus, I wouldn't advise blind users to upgrade to 9.04, but instead, stay with either 8.04 or 8.10 if it just works. But if blind users really want to upgrade to 9.04, I, or someone with knowledge of 9.04 and have sight, will have to help them and get the menus back to where they belong.

[Mr. Picklesworth]

Well, I had posted in ubuntu-devel-discuss. The whole matter has been ignored completely by the people who could affect this. Not sure what's up. Probably a harmless issue where just nobody noticed me and my funny subject lines, but it's 6 days from release and I haven't been convinced that the change is remotely sane.

https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-discuss/2009-April/007787.html

I just proposed my bug report (https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fast-user-switch-applet/+bug/343219) for nomination to Jaunty release, since it is a SERIOUS usability regression largely thanks to how navigating the panel via the keyboard is complicated and not discoverable. (And impossible with Compiz, since we are ridiculously pretending that changing the entire window manager is just "adding desktop effects").
We'll see what happens...

[GraysonPeddie]

Hey, man! It's okay to rant. Just put in [begin rant] and [/end rant] tags.

The reason I mention this is I know Connonical took the wrong turn when it comes to making Ubuntu accessible for blind users and users without a mouse (including those who have problems with using their mouse). :)

Cheer up! :)

[Locke_99GS]

I grossly disliked it when the FUSA maintainer added all that fluff which was included in Intrepid. Fortunately I discovered there was a level of configurability for it accessible from gconf. I quickly removed the foolish Pidgin status integration and the Shutdown/Logout/&c... menu items. I intend to do the same with Jaunty, and figure out how to add it back into the gnome-panel menu applet, as it should be. It can't possibly be very difficult.

Aside from it being just rediculous to continually alter the interface unnecessarily on every release, and using the user-switcher to shutdown the machine, I often find the applet's on the right side of the top panel seemingly randomly rearranging themselves periodically.

[Mr. Picklesworth]

Actually, if you disable show_session_commands in gconf, there is then no shutdown button in the GUI period. None in the main menu or in FUSA. It also, for some reason, decides not to draw separators between IM status and users in that case.

Just realized this is obviously not a bug to be fixed with fast-user-switch-applet but with Ubuntu's patches on gnome-panel... I would make a patch myself, but I'm having trouble finding what to revert.

[GraysonPeddie]

So, Ubuntu's design decision is making it harder for blind users to use the FUSA functions, including logging out, restart, or turning their computer off! :)

Way to go Connonical! :)